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What advice would you give to somebody about to build their first website?
I think I would advise them to look at sites that they like, as well as some of the top sites in the field of interest that the site is addressing, and try to understand why they like them... IE, easy navigation, nice design, good content. Then, try and apply what they have just learnt to their own web site.
Oh, and don't use frames... or the
I think I would advise them to look at sites that they like, as well as some of the top sites in the field of interest that the site is addressing, and try to understand why they like them... IE, easy navigation, nice design, good content. Then, try and apply what they have just learnt to their own web site.
Oh, and don't use frames... or the
Page:
Hazah, I can finally post! (Eww, this site is ugly in NS).
Tyla, you should have a PC at home anyway. Just because you have a PC, doesn't mean you have to work on it. Just don't install any graphics software.
Tyla, you should have a PC at home anyway. Just because you have a PC, doesn't mean you have to work on it. Just don't install any graphics software.
Turbonutter wrote:
> yeah...Tyla, why don't you have a PC at home?
I work 5 days a week with computers as well as weekends occassonally when I take one of the laptops home and i did have my own PC once until someone nicked it!! But I currently refuse to have one at home as I'd spend all my time working... It happened before, taking all my work home and not stopping and got quite unhealthy, so on those grounds, I refyse to have one at home!! I love my job, but not 24/7/365!!
> yeah...Tyla, why don't you have a PC at home?
I work 5 days a week with computers as well as weekends occassonally when I take one of the laptops home and i did have my own PC once until someone nicked it!! But I currently refuse to have one at home as I'd spend all my time working... It happened before, taking all my work home and not stopping and got quite unhealthy, so on those grounds, I refyse to have one at home!! I love my job, but not 24/7/365!!
Yeah, I like http://www.pczone.co.uk. I based the frames on my site around it.
http://www.zpgamer.co.uk if you wanna take a look.
P>S It is under construction so none of the menu links work!! :-)
I did want to use a similar lay out to SR but didn't do so well. Then I tried a bit like PCGAMER.co.uk, (another favourite site) But the colour scheme was crap!
What do u think of my new site layout??
http://www.zpgamer.co.uk if you wanna take a look.
P>S It is under construction so none of the menu links work!! :-)
I did want to use a similar lay out to SR but didn't do so well. Then I tried a bit like PCGAMER.co.uk, (another favourite site) But the colour scheme was crap!
What do u think of my new site layout??
I have two really cute rabbits: Mocha (bloke) and Princess (I didn't name her). They're the bestest bunnies ever. I'll upload a pic when I get home.
Oh yeah...
Tyla, why don't you have a PC at home?
Oh yeah...
Tyla, why don't you have a PC at home?
See, that's much more relaxing than fighting over who's the Queen of Webland.
monkey_man wrote:
> Talk about kittens or something.
I've got quite a cute kitten, mad as hell, thinks it's a dog and likes curry's!!
> Talk about kittens or something.
I've got quite a cute kitten, mad as hell, thinks it's a dog and likes curry's!!
Talk about kittens or something.
I meant you were the best in the forum, don't flatter yourself that much!
:-D
OK, handbags down, let's leave this.
:-D
OK, handbags down, let's leave this.
funkygamer wrote:
> Even MS realised they stood no chance of taking out all the other Internet technologies. I heard they were developing a suite of tools that was supposed to be the MS version of HTML, but gave up at the last minute.
They didnt give up on it, W3C slapped them over it for changing the essence of the internet!!
> IMHO Unix is much more stable and reliable.
Been there, done that, and as I keep tellin him, it's not my decision, but if he would like to come and convince our board of directors and MIS dept, TN's more than welcome to make an appointment ?(serious offer!!)
TurboNutter wrote:
>Tyla, you show up and all hell breaks loose.
Why thank you, it's nice to know that Anarchy follows me everywhere!!;-)
> Maybe you can't take it that you're not the only designer here.
Mr TN, I am not that arrogant. I'm here to discuss intellegent queries and ideas and have just got bored with you constantly ramming PHP and Unix down my throat everytime I make a post.
Yes! I do see the benefits and yes, we have experienced the benefits, but just get to grips with the fact that I am not interetsed nor bothered by your comments on changing a global architecture on the basis of your bedroom know how. You say on your website that you dislike corporations... well unfortunatley I work for one, a very very big global one who won't drop and change everything on the say so of one person unless the COST to implement can be justified, and thanks to the USA, we're off to ressessionsville...
> You're the best no question, but then it IS your job
> and you do have much more experience.
No I'm not nor have I ever said so, if I was THE BEST, I wouldn't be working here for a start and I would be getting paid for advice instead of giving it away free! Your are right though that my specialist area is Design, Usability, Navigation and Architecture (though spelling is not my strong point!!)
I have experience I want to share with those who are interested as well as learn from others, and as you pointed out, I'm a designer so PHP and Unix is of no interest to me and is obviously all you know about.
End discussion here, drop the bitching and lets get back to doing what this forum is for...
> Even MS realised they stood no chance of taking out all the other Internet technologies. I heard they were developing a suite of tools that was supposed to be the MS version of HTML, but gave up at the last minute.
They didnt give up on it, W3C slapped them over it for changing the essence of the internet!!
> IMHO Unix is much more stable and reliable.
Been there, done that, and as I keep tellin him, it's not my decision, but if he would like to come and convince our board of directors and MIS dept, TN's more than welcome to make an appointment ?(serious offer!!)
TurboNutter wrote:
>Tyla, you show up and all hell breaks loose.
Why thank you, it's nice to know that Anarchy follows me everywhere!!;-)
> Maybe you can't take it that you're not the only designer here.
Mr TN, I am not that arrogant. I'm here to discuss intellegent queries and ideas and have just got bored with you constantly ramming PHP and Unix down my throat everytime I make a post.
Yes! I do see the benefits and yes, we have experienced the benefits, but just get to grips with the fact that I am not interetsed nor bothered by your comments on changing a global architecture on the basis of your bedroom know how. You say on your website that you dislike corporations... well unfortunatley I work for one, a very very big global one who won't drop and change everything on the say so of one person unless the COST to implement can be justified, and thanks to the USA, we're off to ressessionsville...
> You're the best no question, but then it IS your job
> and you do have much more experience.
No I'm not nor have I ever said so, if I was THE BEST, I wouldn't be working here for a start and I would be getting paid for advice instead of giving it away free! Your are right though that my specialist area is Design, Usability, Navigation and Architecture (though spelling is not my strong point!!)
I have experience I want to share with those who are interested as well as learn from others, and as you pointed out, I'm a designer so PHP and Unix is of no interest to me and is obviously all you know about.
End discussion here, drop the bitching and lets get back to doing what this forum is for...
funkygamer wrote:
> Tyla wrote:
> Yeh, usability, fair enough, but not at the expense of a site has no originality about it. I remember looking at his site and thinking it was pap. A site should be usable, yes, but it should also be individual. Look nice and work well, thats all. We should take note of the web design rules, but not live to the strict letter of them.
Rules are ther to be bent a little here and there, and I take most of JN's ideas as reference but wouldn't say that I adopt everything he preaches about. His stance though has been proven to support what "user" have said and is not seen as a reference for designers but as a set of conciderations, a lot of which do make some sense. As always, there's a balance between functionality, originality and design, neither of which should be sacrificed to indulge the other.
Now Mr Jeffery Veen has taken the same set of ideas and applied them to the "Designer" with more practicle advice for those who design and build with good examples and ideas.
There are few rules/suggestions in web design, (appart from the U.S accessability requirement which is now a legal requirement for all sites in the USA!) such as the 3 click rule, the 3 page scroll rule, the "home button" and "alt" tags etc etc, all of which should be concidered.
I've always up held the belief that it's an organic medium with undefined boundaries and that it's up to designers and developers to see how far those boundaries can be pushed within the current limitations of the net. But too many designers forget about the end user and how end users interact with their computers. And beleive me, a lot of them ain't that bright!!
Too many designers assume that all end users have the same competence with their computers as they do, but often, this is not the case and many end users end up feeling alienated from the net due to its "apparent" complexity. Anyone over 30 needs things to be simplified as they do not come from the generation of technology. A lot of them still have problems programming their VCR's, how are they meant to get to grips with a website? Especially if it doesn't follow certain concepts...
"Human & Computer Interaction" and "Mind Mapping" explain very well how the human brain works, how it perceives tecnology and how it learns to navigate, These two books are vital to understanding how the end user will perceive and use your site and how they mentally navigate around.
I've strayed off a bit here...
It all comes down to your target audience in the end.. If your site aims at the "gaming" generation, then you can break every rule in the book as these people perceive and navigate very differently from those who come from the vinal generation.
Your right, JN is over hyped and has definately got to big for his boots, but I do have a healthy respect fro some of the issues he has raised.
Have you read his book "Designing Web Usability"? If not, read it, its definately enlightening even if his principles are a bit cack handed...
I also heavily suggest Jeffery Veen's "The Art and Science of Web Design", Now this man does know his stuff, after all, he's the boss of Webmonkey!!
> Do you read Cre@teOnline, perchance?
Indeed I do, regular suscriber, though starting to get bored with it's lack of "Design" focused content!!
Hope I've made some sense...
> Tyla wrote:
> Yeh, usability, fair enough, but not at the expense of a site has no originality about it. I remember looking at his site and thinking it was pap. A site should be usable, yes, but it should also be individual. Look nice and work well, thats all. We should take note of the web design rules, but not live to the strict letter of them.
Rules are ther to be bent a little here and there, and I take most of JN's ideas as reference but wouldn't say that I adopt everything he preaches about. His stance though has been proven to support what "user" have said and is not seen as a reference for designers but as a set of conciderations, a lot of which do make some sense. As always, there's a balance between functionality, originality and design, neither of which should be sacrificed to indulge the other.
Now Mr Jeffery Veen has taken the same set of ideas and applied them to the "Designer" with more practicle advice for those who design and build with good examples and ideas.
There are few rules/suggestions in web design, (appart from the U.S accessability requirement which is now a legal requirement for all sites in the USA!) such as the 3 click rule, the 3 page scroll rule, the "home button" and "alt" tags etc etc, all of which should be concidered.
I've always up held the belief that it's an organic medium with undefined boundaries and that it's up to designers and developers to see how far those boundaries can be pushed within the current limitations of the net. But too many designers forget about the end user and how end users interact with their computers. And beleive me, a lot of them ain't that bright!!
Too many designers assume that all end users have the same competence with their computers as they do, but often, this is not the case and many end users end up feeling alienated from the net due to its "apparent" complexity. Anyone over 30 needs things to be simplified as they do not come from the generation of technology. A lot of them still have problems programming their VCR's, how are they meant to get to grips with a website? Especially if it doesn't follow certain concepts...
"Human & Computer Interaction" and "Mind Mapping" explain very well how the human brain works, how it perceives tecnology and how it learns to navigate, These two books are vital to understanding how the end user will perceive and use your site and how they mentally navigate around.
I've strayed off a bit here...
It all comes down to your target audience in the end.. If your site aims at the "gaming" generation, then you can break every rule in the book as these people perceive and navigate very differently from those who come from the vinal generation.
Your right, JN is over hyped and has definately got to big for his boots, but I do have a healthy respect fro some of the issues he has raised.
Have you read his book "Designing Web Usability"? If not, read it, its definately enlightening even if his principles are a bit cack handed...
I also heavily suggest Jeffery Veen's "The Art and Science of Web Design", Now this man does know his stuff, after all, he's the boss of Webmonkey!!
> Do you read Cre@teOnline, perchance?
Indeed I do, regular suscriber, though starting to get bored with it's lack of "Design" focused content!!
Hope I've made some sense...
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