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6 times world champion (1994, 1995, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003), 80th race wins........... can anyone stop him?
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BiGGiE L͆†L€ Jn®™ wrote:
> If you put kimi raikkonen in a ferrari, he would most probably beat
> micheal. Sorry people but what F1 is witnissing at the moment is not
> driving genius but Techinical masterclass. Ross brawn is behind the
> car and ferrari have no doubt the best car, and the wins arent
> micheal's Credit,there the Car's and the tactical and mechanical
> genius behind the car.
You seem to be forgetting that Barrichello was spectacularly rapid all throughout his career until he jumped into the number 2 Ferrari. Now he follows Schumacher around the racetrack, not because he's told to, but because he can't keep up. As for having the 'best car', I think it was early 2001 when Schumacher announced that he believed this was the first time he was starting a year with a car advantage over the rest of the pitlane. What was he by then, a triple world champion? As for Kimi Raikonnen, I remember him trailing Nick Heidfeld for a year in a Sauber a while back. Is he still in F1?
> If you put kimi raikkonen in a ferrari, he would most probably beat
> micheal. Sorry people but what F1 is witnissing at the moment is not
> driving genius but Techinical masterclass. Ross brawn is behind the
> car and ferrari have no doubt the best car, and the wins arent
> micheal's Credit,there the Car's and the tactical and mechanical
> genius behind the car.
You seem to be forgetting that Barrichello was spectacularly rapid all throughout his career until he jumped into the number 2 Ferrari. Now he follows Schumacher around the racetrack, not because he's told to, but because he can't keep up. As for having the 'best car', I think it was early 2001 when Schumacher announced that he believed this was the first time he was starting a year with a car advantage over the rest of the pitlane. What was he by then, a triple world champion? As for Kimi Raikonnen, I remember him trailing Nick Heidfeld for a year in a Sauber a while back. Is he still in F1?
Der Nazi wrote:
> The accolade for best F1 driver ever has to go to Fangio- he never
> finished lower than fourth in a race, won 24 of his 51 races, and was
> a true sportsman- he retired so that others could do well. He had
> amazing driving ability: Once at the German GP on the original
> 14-mile Nurburgring, he was a long way down on the leaders, after a
> botched pitstop; he raced on to pass them in the closing stages,
> setting a lap record 9 seconds faster than his pole time. More
> talented than Schumacher? Easily, and also because he was not treated
> as well in the way that unlike schumacher, he was given a car and
> just drove it, nothing about settings and all that.
You're being a little selective with your statistics, as Fangio never drove anything less than the best car (and back then there were big differences between car performance levels). In truth, Fangio was the master of a different era where the competition level was a minor fraction as intense as it is today. Just as Roger Bannister's 4 minute mile wouldn't shock anyone today, personal performance levels in GP racing have risen since the 1950's - I'd wager if you sent Schumacher back in time, he'd mince Fangio in the same car, due to his mental and physical discipline levels. That's not to belittle Fangio or his achievements, as he did lord it over an entire era in GP racing. However Schumacher is doing the same today, over much, much stiffer competition.
> The accolade for best F1 driver ever has to go to Fangio- he never
> finished lower than fourth in a race, won 24 of his 51 races, and was
> a true sportsman- he retired so that others could do well. He had
> amazing driving ability: Once at the German GP on the original
> 14-mile Nurburgring, he was a long way down on the leaders, after a
> botched pitstop; he raced on to pass them in the closing stages,
> setting a lap record 9 seconds faster than his pole time. More
> talented than Schumacher? Easily, and also because he was not treated
> as well in the way that unlike schumacher, he was given a car and
> just drove it, nothing about settings and all that.
You're being a little selective with your statistics, as Fangio never drove anything less than the best car (and back then there were big differences between car performance levels). In truth, Fangio was the master of a different era where the competition level was a minor fraction as intense as it is today. Just as Roger Bannister's 4 minute mile wouldn't shock anyone today, personal performance levels in GP racing have risen since the 1950's - I'd wager if you sent Schumacher back in time, he'd mince Fangio in the same car, due to his mental and physical discipline levels. That's not to belittle Fangio or his achievements, as he did lord it over an entire era in GP racing. However Schumacher is doing the same today, over much, much stiffer competition.
Der Nazi wrote:
> Engines- stay at 3 litre normally aspirated, but improved emergency
> braking systems so that high speed crashes can be avoided more
> easily.
Not sure what you mean by this "emergency braking system". What is the car to do beyond applying it's brakes when it's trying to stop? Applying stronger brakes won't help, as an F1 brake's ability to stop already outstrips an F1 tyres (which is why you see lockups a lot). Nothing beyond a braking chute is going to help an F1 car stop faster, and even that wouldn't work.
> Engines- stay at 3 litre normally aspirated, but improved emergency
> braking systems so that high speed crashes can be avoided more
> easily.
Not sure what you mean by this "emergency braking system". What is the car to do beyond applying it's brakes when it's trying to stop? Applying stronger brakes won't help, as an F1 brake's ability to stop already outstrips an F1 tyres (which is why you see lockups a lot). Nothing beyond a braking chute is going to help an F1 car stop faster, and even that wouldn't work.
Michael Schumacher top poll again at qualifying.
Der Nazi wrote:
> Yes, but F1 has always been at the forefront of technology- dumbing it
> down would be a great blow for a whole industry, and racing in
> general- F1 has always been a benchmark for power and speed.
Just a shame it's not the benchmark for over-taking and excitement. Two things i'd class as more important seeing as F1 is meant to be an entertaining sport.
> Yes, but F1 has always been at the forefront of technology- dumbing it
> down would be a great blow for a whole industry, and racing in
> general- F1 has always been a benchmark for power and speed.
Just a shame it's not the benchmark for over-taking and excitement. Two things i'd class as more important seeing as F1 is meant to be an entertaining sport.
Yes, but F1 has always been at the forefront of technology- dumbing it down would be a great blow for a whole industry, and racing in general- F1 has always been a benchmark for power and speed.
The new changes will be made up for within a few years. It took around 14 years for the 3 litre normally aspirated cars to get to the same amounts of race power as the 1.5 litre turbos of the 80s, so surely with the way that technology has developed, speeds may well increase quite a bit within 6 years of these new changes being implemented. The new 2.4 litre V8s will produce around 700 BHP, 200 BHP down on the 3.0s- but seeing how power increaded during the 90s and past few years, this won't be too much of a defecit.
What should be changed, my current view:
Engines- stay at 3 litre normally aspirated, but improved emergency braking systems so that high speed crashes can be avoided more easily. Boost systems allowing 30 seconds of boost per race for each car, as in Champcars, to be introduced.
Tyres- One manufacturer, slick tyres to be allowed.
Testing- Slight decrease from what is now the norm.
Downforce- Limit the size of winglets on the back of cars; possibly a decrease in the size of rear wings.
Safety- Improve constructional standards marginally, especially those of the cockpit of the cars, for example strengthening around the aforementioned area, and the sides of the cars.
The new changes will be made up for within a few years. It took around 14 years for the 3 litre normally aspirated cars to get to the same amounts of race power as the 1.5 litre turbos of the 80s, so surely with the way that technology has developed, speeds may well increase quite a bit within 6 years of these new changes being implemented. The new 2.4 litre V8s will produce around 700 BHP, 200 BHP down on the 3.0s- but seeing how power increaded during the 90s and past few years, this won't be too much of a defecit.
What should be changed, my current view:
Engines- stay at 3 litre normally aspirated, but improved emergency braking systems so that high speed crashes can be avoided more easily. Boost systems allowing 30 seconds of boost per race for each car, as in Champcars, to be introduced.
Tyres- One manufacturer, slick tyres to be allowed.
Testing- Slight decrease from what is now the norm.
Downforce- Limit the size of winglets on the back of cars; possibly a decrease in the size of rear wings.
Safety- Improve constructional standards marginally, especially those of the cockpit of the cars, for example strengthening around the aforementioned area, and the sides of the cars.
Yes but my point was the races are far more exciting, it's not like with F1 where most of the overtaking is done in the pit lane, they actually are all pretty evenly matched in Champ because of the fact they buy the equipment instead of developing it themselves and you get some good exciting racing action whereas in F1 the first few laps are exciting then eventually it goes back to Schumacher running off from the pack and the procession begins
One tyre manufacturer is the way to go.
Current F1 planned changes include:
Reducing downforce by 25% but only reducing drag by 4%
Increasing braking distances and reducing corner speeds by adjusting diffusers height, front and rear wings and the bodywork in front of the rear wheels
Harder compound tyres, restricting drivers to 2 sets for a weekend, one set for practise, the other for qualifying and race.
Reducing engine sizes to a 2.4 litre V8
The engine rules seem to be a dodgy subject as a few manufacturers don't want to go away from V10.
I think a lot of recent speed increases has been made in tyre development. The tyre war has decreased lap times by up to 3 seconds on some tracks.
Current F1 planned changes include:
Reducing downforce by 25% but only reducing drag by 4%
Increasing braking distances and reducing corner speeds by adjusting diffusers height, front and rear wings and the bodywork in front of the rear wheels
Harder compound tyres, restricting drivers to 2 sets for a weekend, one set for practise, the other for qualifying and race.
Reducing engine sizes to a 2.4 litre V8
The engine rules seem to be a dodgy subject as a few manufacturers don't want to go away from V10.
I think a lot of recent speed increases has been made in tyre development. The tyre war has decreased lap times by up to 3 seconds on some tracks.
Champ Cars is incredbily dumbed down, though: Champ Cars produce around 600 BHP, whereas F1 cars produce around between 890-940 BHP, depending on gearing and engine. All the stuff in Champcars is bought, not developed; it's not so much at the forefront of technology, like F1. It's also far more crude: There are massive accidents, as was illustrated at the Cleveland race recently, when several cars were eliminated in an avoidable accident.
All that F1 needs is one tyre manufacturer, all cars using the same size fuel tank, and possibly a boost system for overtaking, as is used in Champ Cars (ie each car has 30 seconds of booster per race). That is all tha needs to be done, along with possibly stiffer bodywork to withstand high speed crashes.
All that F1 needs is one tyre manufacturer, all cars using the same size fuel tank, and possibly a boost system for overtaking, as is used in Champ Cars (ie each car has 30 seconds of booster per race). That is all tha needs to be done, along with possibly stiffer bodywork to withstand high speed crashes.
Grandprix wrote:
> I don't think the quality of the driving is as good in Champ Cars than
> in F1. The amount of needless accidents and full course yellows seems
> to prove that.
True.. I can agree with you there GP as when i was at Rockingham for the Champ a couple of years ago.. There were 35 yellow flags.. Kinda got boring as they were stopping and starting.. However still a good race as Dario Franchitti won :)
> I don't think the quality of the driving is as good in Champ Cars than
> in F1. The amount of needless accidents and full course yellows seems
> to prove that.
True.. I can agree with you there GP as when i was at Rockingham for the Champ a couple of years ago.. There were 35 yellow flags.. Kinda got boring as they were stopping and starting.. However still a good race as Dario Franchitti won :)
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