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My Mum came back from Italy yesterday, and she bought me back these sweets:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ paul.whiston/images/nougatine.gif
Is it just me, or is that an Indian Gollywog? I thought those things were highly offensive and were taken off all sorts of packaging years ago (marmalade, swets, etc). Not in Italy!
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ paul.whiston/images/nougatine.gif
Is it just me, or is that an Indian Gollywog? I thought those things were highly offensive and were taken off all sorts of packaging years ago (marmalade, swets, etc). Not in Italy!
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It's still dangerously close to the image that causes offence though.
The reason Gollywogs are considered racist is because they're basically black people dressed up in the kind of clothes they would have worn when slavery was still legal.
I find gollywogs racist but I don't really find this racist. Depends how you wanna take the picture though.
I find gollywogs racist but I don't really find this racist. Depends how you wanna take the picture though.
Twiddly wrote:
> I believe that if people fogot about the differences of te past, we
> would have much less need to censor ourselves going forward.
But then wouldn't that leave the possibilty of it happening again? Mistakes are there to be learnt from.
> I believe that if people fogot about the differences of te past, we
> would have much less need to censor ourselves going forward.
But then wouldn't that leave the possibilty of it happening again? Mistakes are there to be learnt from.
Goatboy wrote:
> Whites in "black-face"make-up singing and dancing.
> Used to be oh-so-trendy and is now considered an absolute disgrace by
> pretty much everyone.
Glancing over the material there, it seems that the mostly disgraceful part is the history behind the original concept. Is it acceptable? Probably not, given that its appearance points to a complete lack of racial harmony.
But then that's what so much of it all boils down to, isn't it? The history. Personally, I applaud the french for putting history behind them. Otherwise anything with a yellow stripe on it would be deemed offensive to the people of france (ok, poor timing for that).
I believe that if people fogot about the differences of te past, we would have much less need to censor ourselves going forward.
> Whites in "black-face"make-up singing and dancing.
> Used to be oh-so-trendy and is now considered an absolute disgrace by
> pretty much everyone.
Glancing over the material there, it seems that the mostly disgraceful part is the history behind the original concept. Is it acceptable? Probably not, given that its appearance points to a complete lack of racial harmony.
But then that's what so much of it all boils down to, isn't it? The history. Personally, I applaud the french for putting history behind them. Otherwise anything with a yellow stripe on it would be deemed offensive to the people of france (ok, poor timing for that).
I believe that if people fogot about the differences of te past, we would have much less need to censor ourselves going forward.
Exactly.
Times move, as does social concerns and awareness.
Just as the Golliwog once used to be a character in a child's book, it then became a much more darker (no pun intended) symbol of racial stereotyping and hatred, a means with which to mock and denegrate a racial group.
Just as the Minstrel show. It was once thought the height of wit and sophistication, yet today induces cringeworthy reactions.
As does Jim Davidson's hilarious "Chalky" voice from his stand-up.
And as Totoro says, in the 70s it was thought little of sitcoms like "Love Thy Neighbour" and "Mind Your Language", where horrific racial stereotypes were employed, and the jokes at the expense of foreign nationals. Same as the 70s gave birth to Skinheads and "bovver boots".
I think of the few attempts in the 70s of positive racial portrayal was in "Rising Damp" with Don Warrington playing the African Prince.
Rigsby continually made references to "your lot" and "back in your mudhuts", only to end up looking incredibly stupid. As did Alf Garnett, racial diatribes that were deliberately misinformed to show him up for the narrow minded bigot that character was.
However innocent the Golliwog once was, unfortunately it became a symbol of something far different and far more harmful than a kid's story figure.
But at the other end of the scale, you have this insane PC culture where any comment can be taken to be "racially provocative"
But any intelligent person can see the difference between banning "Blackboard" in case it did cause offence, and taking the decision to phase out the Golliwog because of the negative racial overtones it has picked up over the past 50 years.
Times move, as does social concerns and awareness.
Just as the Golliwog once used to be a character in a child's book, it then became a much more darker (no pun intended) symbol of racial stereotyping and hatred, a means with which to mock and denegrate a racial group.
Just as the Minstrel show. It was once thought the height of wit and sophistication, yet today induces cringeworthy reactions.
As does Jim Davidson's hilarious "Chalky" voice from his stand-up.
And as Totoro says, in the 70s it was thought little of sitcoms like "Love Thy Neighbour" and "Mind Your Language", where horrific racial stereotypes were employed, and the jokes at the expense of foreign nationals. Same as the 70s gave birth to Skinheads and "bovver boots".
I think of the few attempts in the 70s of positive racial portrayal was in "Rising Damp" with Don Warrington playing the African Prince.
Rigsby continually made references to "your lot" and "back in your mudhuts", only to end up looking incredibly stupid. As did Alf Garnett, racial diatribes that were deliberately misinformed to show him up for the narrow minded bigot that character was.
However innocent the Golliwog once was, unfortunately it became a symbol of something far different and far more harmful than a kid's story figure.
But at the other end of the scale, you have this insane PC culture where any comment can be taken to be "racially provocative"
But any intelligent person can see the difference between banning "Blackboard" in case it did cause offence, and taking the decision to phase out the Golliwog because of the negative racial overtones it has picked up over the past 50 years.
Goatboy wrote:
> So, going back to a previous question, do you think The Black and
> White Minstrel Show is acceptable as entertainment, or is that again
> Political Correctness gone insane?
I can see this on the Generation Game; Jim encouraging a hapless bald blacked-up forty year white accountant to "sing for dem watey melons" whilst his rotund partner does that extremely quick bottom shaking dance dressed in a loin cloth and an Afro wig. Much hilarity ensues....
> So, going back to a previous question, do you think The Black and
> White Minstrel Show is acceptable as entertainment, or is that again
> Political Correctness gone insane?
I can see this on the Generation Game; Jim encouraging a hapless bald blacked-up forty year white accountant to "sing for dem watey melons" whilst his rotund partner does that extremely quick bottom shaking dance dressed in a loin cloth and an Afro wig. Much hilarity ensues....
http://www.sterlingtimes.org/memorable_images29.htm
Whites in "black-face"make-up singing and dancing.
Used to be oh-so-trendy and is now considered an absolute disgrace by pretty much everyone.
Whites in "black-face"make-up singing and dancing.
Used to be oh-so-trendy and is now considered an absolute disgrace by pretty much everyone.
Goatboy wrote:
> So, going back to a previous question, do you think The Black and
> White Minstrel Show is acceptable as entertainment, or is that again
> Political Correctness gone insane?
Forgive my ignorance, but I've never even heard of it.
> So, going back to a previous question, do you think The Black and
> White Minstrel Show is acceptable as entertainment, or is that again
> Political Correctness gone insane?
Forgive my ignorance, but I've never even heard of it.
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/paul.whiston/ images/hidden_treasures.gif
Yeah, they were OK. Chocolate with a nutty middle bit. The things I found in my loft are much better though - Bravestar, Ghostbusters, He-Man, Star Wars! I'm trying to ring my Mum to find out where that Golliwog is, but she's not answering :(
Yeah, they were OK. Chocolate with a nutty middle bit. The things I found in my loft are much better though - Bravestar, Ghostbusters, He-Man, Star Wars! I'm trying to ring my Mum to find out where that Golliwog is, but she's not answering :(
Just picking up on the point about blackboard and black sheep of the family stuff, it does seem to most people nowadays that frowning upon such sayings is just political correctness gone mad, and I have to agree as for the most part many of these frowned upon sayings/words are totally innocent and that whole PC thing sometimes gets out of hand.
I also heard ages ago about other words or phrases such as (as far as I can remember) "bad egg" and "nitty gritty" being racist as they have their origins from black slave times. I guess if people want to link every phrase under the sun right back then they can find some racist undertones in it, but that's their problem.
I guess it's all about whether the term "black" is used in a derogatory way, and with things like blackboard it isn't, but I suppose with "the black sheep of the family" it could be seen as black being used to describe the inferior person.
It's just a big area of things open to interpretation, if people want to be offended by sayings like "the black sheep of the family" then they will, but if people didn't give a monkeys then it wont matter.
As for Golliwogs, well I suppose they're part of the old culture that we in Britain don't really see anymore, like Alf Garnett or Love Thy Neighbour sitcoms on TV, Black and White Minstrel shows and nursery rhyme books with the 'Ten Little N****r Boys' poem in it.
Football fans will know that Italy, and many other European countries is still blighted with inherent racism in the crowds who watch games and even players (remember Sinisa Mihalovic (sp?) having to publicly apologise to Patrick Viera for racist comments), with all manner of chants being sung, racist banners being shown off, bananas thrown onto the pitch and so forth, so maybe a mascot over there on a sweet packet doesn't seem out of the ordinary and is perfectly acceptable but isn't to us.
Another question:
Were the sweets nice?
I also heard ages ago about other words or phrases such as (as far as I can remember) "bad egg" and "nitty gritty" being racist as they have their origins from black slave times. I guess if people want to link every phrase under the sun right back then they can find some racist undertones in it, but that's their problem.
I guess it's all about whether the term "black" is used in a derogatory way, and with things like blackboard it isn't, but I suppose with "the black sheep of the family" it could be seen as black being used to describe the inferior person.
It's just a big area of things open to interpretation, if people want to be offended by sayings like "the black sheep of the family" then they will, but if people didn't give a monkeys then it wont matter.
As for Golliwogs, well I suppose they're part of the old culture that we in Britain don't really see anymore, like Alf Garnett or Love Thy Neighbour sitcoms on TV, Black and White Minstrel shows and nursery rhyme books with the 'Ten Little N****r Boys' poem in it.
Football fans will know that Italy, and many other European countries is still blighted with inherent racism in the crowds who watch games and even players (remember Sinisa Mihalovic (sp?) having to publicly apologise to Patrick Viera for racist comments), with all manner of chants being sung, racist banners being shown off, bananas thrown onto the pitch and so forth, so maybe a mascot over there on a sweet packet doesn't seem out of the ordinary and is perfectly acceptable but isn't to us.
Another question:
Were the sweets nice?
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