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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/2842093.stm
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Men held at Camp X-Ray, an American base since 2001.
Their lawyers demand they be charged, as they have been held without any claims made against them for over a year now.
America's response?
"It's not US soil, they're not covered by our Constitution"
This is the base where 2 "prisoners" died from "blunt force trauma" and the Medical Examiner ruled they had been beaten to death by US interrogators.
But hey, those weapons of mass destruction eh?
----
Men held at Camp X-Ray, an American base since 2001.
Their lawyers demand they be charged, as they have been held without any claims made against them for over a year now.
America's response?
"It's not US soil, they're not covered by our Constitution"
This is the base where 2 "prisoners" died from "blunt force trauma" and the Medical Examiner ruled they had been beaten to death by US interrogators.
But hey, those weapons of mass destruction eh?
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Goatboy wrote:
> The Afghanistan situation is all but over, to the extent that
> Halliburton (Dick Cheney, Vice-President being the CEO) have their
> pipeline across formerly taliban controlled regions now.
Goatboy, are you sure Dick Cheney is the CEO?
http://www.hoovers.com/co/capsule/7/0,2163,10697,00.html
> The Afghanistan situation is all but over, to the extent that
> Halliburton (Dick Cheney, Vice-President being the CEO) have their
> pipeline across formerly taliban controlled regions now.
Goatboy, are you sure Dick Cheney is the CEO?
http://www.hoovers.com/co/capsule/7/0,2163,10697,00.html
Goatboy wrote:
> But Sagacious, these aren't prisoners of war.
>
> They havent been charged with anything at all.
> They havent been convicted of acts of terrorism.
> They weren't in a wartime scenario.
> They aren't soldiers fighting for their country.
I can't imagine that they were randomly plucked from their countries and deposited in Cuba. The Americans are well aware of the considerable angst and revulsion that their actions are causing, but they must be convinced that it is in their best interest to do so. When you are dealing with the sort of people happy to blow themselves and innocent people up for some "noble cause", a bit of heavy handedness is to be expected. I'm not saying it is a good thing, I'm not saying it is right and I can sympathise with any of the prisoners for their treatment.
> But Sagacious, these aren't prisoners of war.
>
> They havent been charged with anything at all.
> They havent been convicted of acts of terrorism.
> They weren't in a wartime scenario.
> They aren't soldiers fighting for their country.
I can't imagine that they were randomly plucked from their countries and deposited in Cuba. The Americans are well aware of the considerable angst and revulsion that their actions are causing, but they must be convinced that it is in their best interest to do so. When you are dealing with the sort of people happy to blow themselves and innocent people up for some "noble cause", a bit of heavy handedness is to be expected. I'm not saying it is a good thing, I'm not saying it is right and I can sympathise with any of the prisoners for their treatment.
Rainier Wolfcastle wrote:
> If I remember correctly...
cookie monster wrote:
> I thought the Daisy cutter was a bunker busting bomb?
I might be wrong. Maybe it has multiple uses?
> If I remember correctly...
cookie monster wrote:
> I thought the Daisy cutter was a bunker busting bomb?
I might be wrong. Maybe it has multiple uses?
Maybe it'd look like that silly thing the aliens used in Independence Day...
If everyone's lucky, maybe it'll move as slowly as well...
If everyone's lucky, maybe it'll move as slowly as well...
Rainier Wolfcastle wrote:
> If I remember correctly, the Daisy Cutter bomb is intended for
> dropping at the entrance to the many caves that the west assume Bin
> Laden is hiding in.
>
> It explodes horizontally so that the explosion is channelled into the
> caves rather than into the air.
>
> This would imply that they aren't to be used on highly populated
> areas. But that doesn't mean that they won't.
>
> Make of it what you will.
I thought the Daisy cutter was a bunker busting bomb?
> If I remember correctly, the Daisy Cutter bomb is intended for
> dropping at the entrance to the many caves that the west assume Bin
> Laden is hiding in.
>
> It explodes horizontally so that the explosion is channelled into the
> caves rather than into the air.
>
> This would imply that they aren't to be used on highly populated
> areas. But that doesn't mean that they won't.
>
> Make of it what you will.
I thought the Daisy cutter was a bunker busting bomb?
Insane Bartender wrote:
> Surely a horizontal explosion makes it just as apt for a flat,
> populated area?
>
> Sweeping through the streets etc..
I don't think that the US are setting out to kill as many civilians as possible. That would seem a bit too silly.
But if they are, then you are right, It would be extremely efficient.
> Surely a horizontal explosion makes it just as apt for a flat,
> populated area?
>
> Sweeping through the streets etc..
I don't think that the US are setting out to kill as many civilians as possible. That would seem a bit too silly.
But if they are, then you are right, It would be extremely efficient.
It's just as relevant as bringing up Iraq methods of torture used during wartime.
The Camp X-Ray detainees are not being held in a wartime scenario, the US made that perfectly clear to bypass Geneva Convention law.
It's all too easy to use inflammatory remarks, be it referencing Sept 11th or, as you did, make mention of methods used by an army under attack from foreign nationals on their home soil.
The Gulf War was (however you define it) a legitimate war, with sides openly fighting and trying to kill each other.
The Iraqis tortued captured soldiers, we buried lots of them alive using tanks filling in trenches.
That is a war-time scenario.
Snatching people from villages in Afghanistan in a non-war time and detaining them for over a year, using techniques designed to mentally break a captive and, eventually, killing 2 people is quite another.
Especially when none of these people, numbering almost 600, have had absolutely no charges brought against them.
Terrorists? Yes say America.
Yet they don't bring charges and put them on trial.
Instead, they are held in limbo.
Not the actions of a country that is condemning Iraq for human rights violation. Before you can call someone on their actions, you need to ensure you are beyond reproach.
But it's precisely this double-standard that is causing so many problems and why only 3 countries have agreed to the US led invasion.
The Camp X-Ray detainees are not being held in a wartime scenario, the US made that perfectly clear to bypass Geneva Convention law.
It's all too easy to use inflammatory remarks, be it referencing Sept 11th or, as you did, make mention of methods used by an army under attack from foreign nationals on their home soil.
The Gulf War was (however you define it) a legitimate war, with sides openly fighting and trying to kill each other.
The Iraqis tortued captured soldiers, we buried lots of them alive using tanks filling in trenches.
That is a war-time scenario.
Snatching people from villages in Afghanistan in a non-war time and detaining them for over a year, using techniques designed to mentally break a captive and, eventually, killing 2 people is quite another.
Especially when none of these people, numbering almost 600, have had absolutely no charges brought against them.
Terrorists? Yes say America.
Yet they don't bring charges and put them on trial.
Instead, they are held in limbo.
Not the actions of a country that is condemning Iraq for human rights violation. Before you can call someone on their actions, you need to ensure you are beyond reproach.
But it's precisely this double-standard that is causing so many problems and why only 3 countries have agreed to the US led invasion.
Surely a horizontal explosion makes it just as apt for a flat, populated area?
Sweeping through the streets etc..
Sweeping through the streets etc..
If I remember correctly, the Daisy Cutter bomb is intended for dropping at the entrance to the many caves that the west assume Bin Laden is hiding in.
It explodes horizontally so that the explosion is channelled into the caves rather than into the air.
This would imply that they aren't to be used on highly populated areas. But that doesn't mean that they won't.
Make of it what you will.
It explodes horizontally so that the explosion is channelled into the caves rather than into the air.
This would imply that they aren't to be used on highly populated areas. But that doesn't mean that they won't.
Make of it what you will.
Goatboy wrote:
> The Afghanistan situation is all but over, to the extent that
> Halliburton (Dick Cheney, Vice-President being the CEO) have their
> pipeline across formerly taliban controlled regions now.
My friend works for Halliburton and he's being sent to Azerbhajan in a couple of weeks. What a scumbag!
> The Afghanistan situation is all but over, to the extent that
> Halliburton (Dick Cheney, Vice-President being the CEO) have their
> pipeline across formerly taliban controlled regions now.
My friend works for Halliburton and he's being sent to Azerbhajan in a couple of weeks. What a scumbag!
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