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I was watching this on the news (from about 10:30-14:00) and i have to say i found it rather exciting, obviously it was a terrible ordeal for everyone involved. Especially the poor kids that were practically naked, apparently when they asked for a drink they were told to strip, their clothes were doused with water and they were told to suck the moisture out. Pretty grim stuff.
Near the end of the special show an ITN cameraman actually got into the gym where everyone had been held, the roof had collapsed (chechen rebels had rigged it with 14 explosive charges) while people were still inside and apparently some 100 bodies lay inside.
The chechens then fled to some buildings nearby and were holding a sustained firefight with the russian military.
Near the end of the special show an ITN cameraman actually got into the gym where everyone had been held, the roof had collapsed (chechen rebels had rigged it with 14 explosive charges) while people were still inside and apparently some 100 bodies lay inside.
The chechens then fled to some buildings nearby and were holding a sustained firefight with the russian military.
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Skarra, could you list the 5 attacks on US soil under Clinton please?
Here's something else I blatantly stole from another board that is worth reading and remembering;
Whatever you forget during the media grief-fest over the disgusting and spectacularly cruel actions by thirty Chechens in Beslan this week, you might try remembering the following:
1) Russian troops have killed anything between 20,000 and 150,000 civilians in the second Chechen war alone.
2) They have promulgated rape as policy.
3) Killings, disappearances and torture are standard.
4) As are arbitrary detention, shootings and looting.
5) Russian troops consciously target civilians, according to human rights organisations.
6) They target children, too, with bombs disguised as toys - a little trick they learned during the invasion of Afghanistan.
7) Where is the outrage about that?
Hundreds of dead children and grieving parents deserve more than the empty platitudes sounding from Moscow. They deserve an explanation.
Finally, take a look at this speech by Vladimir Putin:
"In general, we need to admit that we did not show an understanding of the complexities and dangers of the processes occurring in our own country and in the world..."
"In any case, we couldn't adequately react. We showed weakness, and weak people are beaten."
Weak. That's right, it was all those years of quietism and meekness that brought this about. Chechnya is on the verge of a cataclysm.
Here's something else I blatantly stole from another board that is worth reading and remembering;
Whatever you forget during the media grief-fest over the disgusting and spectacularly cruel actions by thirty Chechens in Beslan this week, you might try remembering the following:
1) Russian troops have killed anything between 20,000 and 150,000 civilians in the second Chechen war alone.
2) They have promulgated rape as policy.
3) Killings, disappearances and torture are standard.
4) As are arbitrary detention, shootings and looting.
5) Russian troops consciously target civilians, according to human rights organisations.
6) They target children, too, with bombs disguised as toys - a little trick they learned during the invasion of Afghanistan.
7) Where is the outrage about that?
Hundreds of dead children and grieving parents deserve more than the empty platitudes sounding from Moscow. They deserve an explanation.
Finally, take a look at this speech by Vladimir Putin:
"In general, we need to admit that we did not show an understanding of the complexities and dangers of the processes occurring in our own country and in the world..."
"In any case, we couldn't adequately react. We showed weakness, and weak people are beaten."
Weak. That's right, it was all those years of quietism and meekness that brought this about. Chechnya is on the verge of a cataclysm.
Let's be honest here, weepy citizens - In 2 weeks time, you'll have forgotten about this.
The media will have used every pic of weeping children and screaming adults they can find and will fly off to seek out new atrocities to show a hungry public.
The public will forget all about this "shocking horror" and become as docile and stupid as ever being told darkies and bummers are coming to move into their kitchen and bumcrime their white christian children.
It's this sudden and chest-holding shock and outrage at a country that has been involved in similar (but not as media hard-on) things for a long time that makes me angry. "But the children! Children in a gym!"
Right, so no kids are being butchered in Zimbabwe then? No kids are still being killed in Serbia by snipers then? No kids are being starved to death in Iraq 18months after a successful invasion then?
Yes it's sad, yes it's wrong.
But it's nothing new and will continue to happen.
Shut up and enjoy your lottery/gameshow/soap opera/John Grisham thriller.
The media will have used every pic of weeping children and screaming adults they can find and will fly off to seek out new atrocities to show a hungry public.
The public will forget all about this "shocking horror" and become as docile and stupid as ever being told darkies and bummers are coming to move into their kitchen and bumcrime their white christian children.
It's this sudden and chest-holding shock and outrage at a country that has been involved in similar (but not as media hard-on) things for a long time that makes me angry. "But the children! Children in a gym!"
Right, so no kids are being butchered in Zimbabwe then? No kids are still being killed in Serbia by snipers then? No kids are being starved to death in Iraq 18months after a successful invasion then?
Yes it's sad, yes it's wrong.
But it's nothing new and will continue to happen.
Shut up and enjoy your lottery/gameshow/soap opera/John Grisham thriller.
Light wrote:
> Skarra, could you list the 5 attacks on US soil under Clinton please?
Just sticking my head in without fully reading everything but I believe US embassy grounds count as US Soil so that might providea few examples for you.
Then again mabye not.
> Skarra, could you list the 5 attacks on US soil under Clinton please?
Just sticking my head in without fully reading everything but I believe US embassy grounds count as US Soil so that might providea few examples for you.
Then again mabye not.
Hedfix wrote:
> Just sticking my head in without fully reading everything but I
> believe US embassy grounds count as US Soil so that might providea
> few examples for you.
That's what I was wondering, cos if so then that statistic is ignoring the multitude of attacks on the US embassies worldwide (well...okay, in Iraq) during Dubya's regime.
However, personally I think the "5 attacks" thing is utter cobblers. I don't actually believe it. Hearing that it's from the mouth of a US citizen doesn't make it true; just think of the asshat Bell talks as a UK citizen. Doesn't make his constant lies any more true.
> Just sticking my head in without fully reading everything but I
> believe US embassy grounds count as US Soil so that might providea
> few examples for you.
That's what I was wondering, cos if so then that statistic is ignoring the multitude of attacks on the US embassies worldwide (well...okay, in Iraq) during Dubya's regime.
However, personally I think the "5 attacks" thing is utter cobblers. I don't actually believe it. Hearing that it's from the mouth of a US citizen doesn't make it true; just think of the asshat Bell talks as a UK citizen. Doesn't make his constant lies any more true.
I started watching the ITV coverage but it was so poorly done (as usual) and geared into stirring up people emotions rather than reporting the news (as usual).
ITV had one guy (the NEWREADER) trying to make sense of everything, the BBC were bringing in experts from allover the place.
ITV are rating chasers like Sky News. How they both won awards last year I don't know, probably only because of the fallout from the Hutton report or some crap.
ITV had one guy (the NEWREADER) trying to make sense of everything, the BBC were bringing in experts from allover the place.
ITV are rating chasers like Sky News. How they both won awards last year I don't know, probably only because of the fallout from the Hutton report or some crap.
I stopped watching as the plot kind of tapered off towards the end. It started off well, although the storyline was such a cliche that it was doomed to fail.
Who writes this stuff?
Who writes this stuff?
English_Bloke wrote:
> The news described it as “embarrassing” for Putin. Yes. That's one way
> to descibe it.
If a militia in the US wanted to do the same thing on a random school I expect it would be able to accomplish the same sort of thing.
You can't protect everywhere and everything.
> The news described it as “embarrassing” for Putin. Yes. That's one way
> to descibe it.
If a militia in the US wanted to do the same thing on a random school I expect it would be able to accomplish the same sort of thing.
You can't protect everywhere and everything.
This was also the first time I realised the Chechen fighters had fundamentalist elements. Mabye I wasn't paying close enough attention or perhaps the reports during the Russian-Chechen conflict didn't mention such things.
No doubt I was watching ITN at the time
*slaps forehead*
*slaps forehead*
This thing could escalate into war in that region.
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