Viewing Thread:
"Who's worse in your opinion/s"

Who do you guys or gals think is worse overall in terms of murdering and various atrocities throughout the past century?, the Irish paramilitaries (the IRA), America, Japan or N.Korea? Its just I was ahving a discussion with a few of my friends yesterday and they seemed to think that I was ignorant beacuse I didn't think the IRA were as bad as America.

Yet here in Northern Ireland the IRA seem to be worse, how do you think that works? As far as arming other nations and taking away the funding when they are done with the nations (America), the British did the same thing with the paramilitaries, during WW1 when the paras were recognised as part of the national guard, then they were tosses on the scrapheap so they were angry and decided to fight for something else, 'An army must fight and to fight they must have something to fight for or they are no longer an army'. There are quite a few countries which have committed atrocities on their own nation and other nations (N.Korea, China, Russia and numerous others), America stands out in my mind for one reason, they have never been culpable of their actions and no punishment has ever been placed upon them.

You know some estimates put the number of Chinese civilians killed whilst under Japanese occupation during the 30's and 40's as high as 20 million.

"Ultimate killcount: which is worst"

hmmm... could be an interesting channel 5 documentary...

But anyway... in terms of direct attrocities, Russia (under Stalin) was probably the worst - killing something like 18 million people, and having many more sent off to gulags. That said, many current Russian professors see Stalin as a great leader - in 20 years he turned the USSR from a peasant crop-growing country into a super-power.

In terms of causing attrocities and general unrest in the world, my vote goes to America. It began in Vietnam (where they tried to replace a communist North with a dictatorship South,) and continued in the Middle East during the Cold War. They arm Osama Bin Laden and other "freedom fighrers" and then removed all funding at the end of the war - resulting in those organisations turning to terrorism. They expelled the Palistinians from their country and told them that the land now belonged to the Jews. They gave Saddam Hussein chemical weapons.... and so it continues...

Sonicrav

No more talking for today, I will continue this discussion with you two guys tomorrow, nice arguemnts by the way.

Pandaemonium wrote:
> Black hole wrote:
> Check this out, its a list of various soldiers who died as a result
> of
> vietnam;
>
> http://www.rootsweb.com/~nymonroe/vr/vietnam-5.htm
>
> So you are saying in the Vietnam confilt a total of 145 people died?
> I don't know where you are going with this.

I am simply showing that there are different reports about the same war, which one is true?

Insane Bartender wrote:
> Black hole wrote:
> who died during the war is estimated at around 9.14 million
>
> Umm, can I just pick that statistic up?
>
> Vietnam:
>
> • More than 200,000 South Vietnamese troops died
> • More than a million Vietnamese civilians died
> • There were more than 6.5 million displaced war refugees
>
> Source: The World Almanac and Book of *Facts* 1998, World Almanac
> Books, 1997.
>
> So, 6.5 million people were DISPLACED, ie - lost their homes etc.
> They didn't DIE, they just became refugees. I sincerely doubt - and
> will treat any unbacked claims to the contrary with the cynical
> eyebrow of pain - that a further 9million people died in conflict,
> especialy given the factual statistics I doth quoth above.
>
> I'm not expert on Vietnam, but you do appear to be talking out of
> your *censored*
>
>
> Also:
>
> • The average age of the soldiers serving during the Vietnam War was
> nineteen (19).

I must aquiesce, I do believe you are right about the 9 million figure, that was not the additional death toll, the estimated figure for vietnamese soldiers/civilians dying is closer to 2 million as for the american suicides, the true figure is unknown although it is probably around 150,000 suicides but what about the rest of the uncounted military personnel?

More accurate than 9+ million dying, i'd wager.

Black hole wrote:
> Check this out, its a list of various soldiers who died as a result of
> vietnam;
>
> http://www.rootsweb.com/~nymonroe/vr/vietnam-5.htm

So you are saying in the Vietnam confilt a total of 145 people died? I don't know where you are going with this.

Black hole wrote:
> who died during the war is estimated at around 9.14 million

Umm, can I just pick that statistic up?

Vietnam:

• More than 200,000 South Vietnamese troops died
• More than a million Vietnamese civilians died
• There were more than 6.5 million displaced war refugees

Source: The World Almanac and Book of *Facts* 1998, World Almanac Books, 1997.

So, 6.5 million people were DISPLACED, ie - lost their homes etc. They didn't DIE, they just became refugees. I sincerely doubt - and will treat any unbacked claims to the contrary with the cynical eyebrow of pain - that a further 9million people died in conflict, especialy given the factual statistics I doth quoth above.

I'm not expert on Vietnam, but you do appear to be talking out of your *censored*


Also:

• The average age of the soldiers serving during the Vietnam War was nineteen (19).

Check this out, its a list of various soldiers who died as a result of vietnam;

http://www.rootsweb.com/~nymonroe/vr/vietnam-5.htm