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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3190934.stm
Whoops. Looks like some administration is desperate to convince the sheeple that things are a-ok!!!!
And I even posted this close to 5pm, so Bell can show me just how wrong this report is.
Whoops. Looks like some administration is desperate to convince the sheeple that things are a-ok!!!!
And I even posted this close to 5pm, so Bell can show me just how wrong this report is.
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I would just like to remind Belldandy of his staunch political and moral beliefs as of Monday of this week:
Belldandy wrote:
> Yes indeed it does have a Foreign Policy: Disagree with us and we'll
> invade\sanction\politically cripple you\send the CIA to topple you.
> Agree with us and we'll buy your stuff and sell shiny new stuff to
> you, and occasionaly ignore you anyway.
Belldandy wrote:
> Yes indeed it does have a Foreign Policy: Disagree with us and we'll
> invade\sanction\politically cripple you\send the CIA to topple you.
> Agree with us and we'll buy your stuff and sell shiny new stuff to
> you, and occasionaly ignore you anyway.
I'm saying this without any proof whatsoever but:
Is it possible that the attack on a US convoy was perpetrated by extreme Zionists? Seems like the best way possible to dicredit the Palestinian cause.
Just a theory, of course.
Is it possible that the attack on a US convoy was perpetrated by extreme Zionists? Seems like the best way possible to dicredit the Palestinian cause.
Just a theory, of course.
pb wrote:
> Because Japan ARE doing it for the same reason, more than likely, as
> the US - Political and material gain. They aren't stupid and they
> may certainly need help sooner or later as their country falls
> further in to all sorts of problems from cashflow to an ageing
> population.
Well at least someone can see that...
> As for today's roadside bomb in Gaza...
>
> Which is just as likely to be a small unorganised group than a
> politically motivated terrorist organisation. Extreme Splinter
> group? I didn't know the Turtles were involved....
Doubtful, but I'll explain my reasoning (because this is just my opinion);
1) It's a roadside bomb - in itself unusual.
2) It was planted in a specific place indicating the route of the US Convoy was known to the attackers, no way it was sheer chance and luck.
3) The attackers knew which vehicles the americans were in and instead of detonating straight away they let those specific vehicles come within the centre of the bomb.
4) It was a remote detonation, wires led from the roadside to a nearby house, that's not the standard method for most Palestinians groups who make more use of suicide bombers.
5) American target - whilst US citizens have been killed in crossfires and both Israeli and Palestinian terrorist attacks, the Palestinian groups have never ever specifically targetted US interests in the past 3 years. It only gives America more reason to support Israel and America more reasons why it should do so, hence why they don't attack Americans on purpose.
6) All known groups are denying it, usually they do not shirk away from anything they've done because it's pointless being a terrorist group if you don't claim to do anything.
Terrorist groups don't spring up from nowhere, hence my reasoning this is a splinter cell from another group(s) that is sick of not being able to attack US targets, or terrorists from other places who see it as an environment with little law and order and the chance to attack Zionist/Jewish/US targets with relative freedom.
> I believe it would be as hard for Arafat to promise to remove all
> terrorist groups as it would for, say, Ireland to remove the IRA or
> Basque Spain remove ETA (though they can prevent Batasuna from
> running as a bona fide political group). Though once militant
> factions may have been organised by the governing parties, they are
> now a completely seperate entity working for similar causes.
Yes it would be hard, but it is inexcusable to even refuse to commit to trying to do so publically. In both cases I believe Arafat and Syria could, if they were willing to act, be given exact locations of training camps and suchlike - after all I doubt the US spy satellite imagery from the area is being dedicated to postcard photography...
> Because Japan ARE doing it for the same reason, more than likely, as
> the US - Political and material gain. They aren't stupid and they
> may certainly need help sooner or later as their country falls
> further in to all sorts of problems from cashflow to an ageing
> population.
Well at least someone can see that...
> As for today's roadside bomb in Gaza...
>
> Which is just as likely to be a small unorganised group than a
> politically motivated terrorist organisation. Extreme Splinter
> group? I didn't know the Turtles were involved....
Doubtful, but I'll explain my reasoning (because this is just my opinion);
1) It's a roadside bomb - in itself unusual.
2) It was planted in a specific place indicating the route of the US Convoy was known to the attackers, no way it was sheer chance and luck.
3) The attackers knew which vehicles the americans were in and instead of detonating straight away they let those specific vehicles come within the centre of the bomb.
4) It was a remote detonation, wires led from the roadside to a nearby house, that's not the standard method for most Palestinians groups who make more use of suicide bombers.
5) American target - whilst US citizens have been killed in crossfires and both Israeli and Palestinian terrorist attacks, the Palestinian groups have never ever specifically targetted US interests in the past 3 years. It only gives America more reason to support Israel and America more reasons why it should do so, hence why they don't attack Americans on purpose.
6) All known groups are denying it, usually they do not shirk away from anything they've done because it's pointless being a terrorist group if you don't claim to do anything.
Terrorist groups don't spring up from nowhere, hence my reasoning this is a splinter cell from another group(s) that is sick of not being able to attack US targets, or terrorists from other places who see it as an environment with little law and order and the chance to attack Zionist/Jewish/US targets with relative freedom.
> I believe it would be as hard for Arafat to promise to remove all
> terrorist groups as it would for, say, Ireland to remove the IRA or
> Basque Spain remove ETA (though they can prevent Batasuna from
> running as a bona fide political group). Though once militant
> factions may have been organised by the governing parties, they are
> now a completely seperate entity working for similar causes.
Yes it would be hard, but it is inexcusable to even refuse to commit to trying to do so publically. In both cases I believe Arafat and Syria could, if they were willing to act, be given exact locations of training camps and suchlike - after all I doubt the US spy satellite imagery from the area is being dedicated to postcard photography...
Belldandy wrote:
> Of course if the USA gets involved in an
> oil exporting country it gets accused of all sorts, anyone else does
> it though and it's a great thing. Try that for double standards.
Because Japan ARE doing it for the same reason, more than likely, as the US - Political and material gain. They aren't stupid and they may certainly need help sooner or later as their country falls further in to all sorts of problems from cashflow to an ageing population.
> As for today's roadside bomb in Gaza...
Which is just as likely to be a small unorganised group than a politically motivated terrorist organisation. Extreme Splinter group? I didn't know the Turtles were involved....
I believe it would be as hard for Arafat to promise to remove all terrorist groups as it would for, say, Ireland to remove the IRA or Basque Spain remove ETA (though they can prevent Batasuna from running as a bona fide political group). Though once militant factions may have been organised by the governing parties, they are now a completely seperate entity working for similar causes.
> Of course if the USA gets involved in an
> oil exporting country it gets accused of all sorts, anyone else does
> it though and it's a great thing. Try that for double standards.
Because Japan ARE doing it for the same reason, more than likely, as the US - Political and material gain. They aren't stupid and they may certainly need help sooner or later as their country falls further in to all sorts of problems from cashflow to an ageing population.
> As for today's roadside bomb in Gaza...
Which is just as likely to be a small unorganised group than a politically motivated terrorist organisation. Extreme Splinter group? I didn't know the Turtles were involved....
I believe it would be as hard for Arafat to promise to remove all terrorist groups as it would for, say, Ireland to remove the IRA or Basque Spain remove ETA (though they can prevent Batasuna from running as a bona fide political group). Though once militant factions may have been organised by the governing parties, they are now a completely seperate entity working for similar causes.
Alternatively, because of it's own constitution, Japan has been unable to help very much with Iraq militarily, but has expressed a desire to help even before the war. This is Japan putting money where they can't do anything else, plus it never hurts to buy some friendship in an oil exporting country. Of course if the USA gets involved in an oil exporting country it gets accused of all sorts, anyone else does it though and it's a great thing. Try that for double standards.
As for today's roadside bomb in Gaza, Israel undoubtedly will take action with America's blessing if the Palestinian Authority cannot track those responsible, but so far the group claiming responsibility is an unknown one and the existing ones are protesting that it was not them. The very fact American's were purposelly targeted lends some credence to the idea that elements of other terrorist organisations are moving into the area, or that their is a new extreme splinter group.
The very fact this has happened does reinforce America's veto of a UN resolution condemning Israel's on going security fence. No way anyone can expect Israel to stop or dismantle if Arafat can't even police his own people let alone stop terrorist attacks. And before someone comments further on the UN resolution, both the Palestinians and the Syrians were asked to add to the UN resolution passages which comitted them to officially dismantling terror groups. Had they added them then the comments of the US representative in the UN suggest the USA would not have to veto it.
Neither Syria nor the Palestinians were willing to officially state they would dismantle terrorist organisations, training camps and so forth. how can they expect support in these times if they will not do that ?
As for today's roadside bomb in Gaza, Israel undoubtedly will take action with America's blessing if the Palestinian Authority cannot track those responsible, but so far the group claiming responsibility is an unknown one and the existing ones are protesting that it was not them. The very fact American's were purposelly targeted lends some credence to the idea that elements of other terrorist organisations are moving into the area, or that their is a new extreme splinter group.
The very fact this has happened does reinforce America's veto of a UN resolution condemning Israel's on going security fence. No way anyone can expect Israel to stop or dismantle if Arafat can't even police his own people let alone stop terrorist attacks. And before someone comments further on the UN resolution, both the Palestinians and the Syrians were asked to add to the UN resolution passages which comitted them to officially dismantling terror groups. Had they added them then the comments of the US representative in the UN suggest the USA would not have to veto it.
Neither Syria nor the Palestinians were willing to officially state they would dismantle terrorist organisations, training camps and so forth. how can they expect support in these times if they will not do that ?
Light wrote:
> I'd seen that Israeli pilot thing. Does anyone know what has happened
> to them since? It's a wonderful piece of news, and one can only hope
> that more good comes from it. Time will tell.
I don't know about those pilots but I remember reading something a while back about soldiers who refused to serve in the occupied territories - and they were thrown in the clink.
And that good news looks like being immediately cancelled out: somebody just blew up a US diplomatic convoy in the Gaza Strip. Least intelligent move ever? It does seem to suggest that the war on terror is creating more terror, or at least turning national terrorists into international ones. Sharon must be creaming his pants in anticipation of the carte blanche that mini-Bush is about to give him.
> I'd seen that Israeli pilot thing. Does anyone know what has happened
> to them since? It's a wonderful piece of news, and one can only hope
> that more good comes from it. Time will tell.
I don't know about those pilots but I remember reading something a while back about soldiers who refused to serve in the occupied territories - and they were thrown in the clink.
And that good news looks like being immediately cancelled out: somebody just blew up a US diplomatic convoy in the Gaza Strip. Least intelligent move ever? It does seem to suggest that the war on terror is creating more terror, or at least turning national terrorists into international ones. Sharon must be creaming his pants in anticipation of the carte blanche that mini-Bush is about to give him.
Light wrote:
> Heh. It's a nice thought; that the nation taking more steps to rebuild
> Iraq will get the credit for any good that comes out of the land
> grab. I hope so anyway.
I bet they saw that one coming. They looked at the itenery for the US and Uk based attacks and thought about how they could muscle in at the end. It would benefit them in the long run, financially and politically. The US could be seething at the thought, I'm pretty sure they will try to beat the amount, if only to save face in the public eye.
> Heh. It's a nice thought; that the nation taking more steps to rebuild
> Iraq will get the credit for any good that comes out of the land
> grab. I hope so anyway.
I bet they saw that one coming. They looked at the itenery for the US and Uk based attacks and thought about how they could muscle in at the end. It would benefit them in the long run, financially and politically. The US could be seething at the thought, I'm pretty sure they will try to beat the amount, if only to save face in the public eye.
funny, because it's turning into a political tool for both sides. See below newspaper clippings from an Egyptian and Israeli news source:
Twenty-seven Israeli war pilots have slammed the Sharon government for pursuing an assassination policy against Palestinian activists, likening this to other criminal guerrillas and terrorist organisations, which have no way of dealing with opponents other than killing them....
The entire world, except for the USA, has condemned the killing of Palestinian leaders, not because of the loss of civilian life, as admitted by the Israeli pilots themselves, but because it wastes an opportunity for peace.
Al-Jumhuriyah - Egypt
--------------------------------------------
The collapse of the roadmap, with [Yasser] Arafat to blame, puts [Ariel] Sharon in an ideal position from his point of view. He doesn't have to do his bit to get out of the [Palestinian] Territories.
Meanwhile, Israeli society is falling apart - as witnessed by the chilling letter from the 27 pilots - and if he doesn't initiate something or start a political process, not only will the terror resume with full force, but Israel could find itself clashing with Bush.
Ha'aretz - Israel
So, Egypt seem to see the pilot's actions as disliking their governments "assassination policy", while Israel somehow implicate that society is at fault.
Twenty-seven Israeli war pilots have slammed the Sharon government for pursuing an assassination policy against Palestinian activists, likening this to other criminal guerrillas and terrorist organisations, which have no way of dealing with opponents other than killing them....
The entire world, except for the USA, has condemned the killing of Palestinian leaders, not because of the loss of civilian life, as admitted by the Israeli pilots themselves, but because it wastes an opportunity for peace.
Al-Jumhuriyah - Egypt
--------------------------------------------
The collapse of the roadmap, with [Yasser] Arafat to blame, puts [Ariel] Sharon in an ideal position from his point of view. He doesn't have to do his bit to get out of the [Palestinian] Territories.
Meanwhile, Israeli society is falling apart - as witnessed by the chilling letter from the 27 pilots - and if he doesn't initiate something or start a political process, not only will the terror resume with full force, but Israel could find itself clashing with Bush.
Ha'aretz - Israel
So, Egypt seem to see the pilot's actions as disliking their governments "assassination policy", while Israel somehow implicate that society is at fault.
Heh. It's a nice thought; that the nation taking more steps to rebuild Iraq will get the credit for any good that comes out of the land grab. I hope so anyway.
I'd seen that Israeli pilot thing. Does anyone know what has happened to them since? It's a wonderful piece of news, and one can only hope that more good comes from it. Time will tell.
I'd seen that Israeli pilot thing. Does anyone know what has happened to them since? It's a wonderful piece of news, and one can only hope that more good comes from it. Time will tell.
It's also worth noting, going back to the idea of "winning hearts and minds" that Japan recently announced a $1.5bn aid package to help rebuild Iraqs "power, education, water and jobs.", part of a speculated total aid package of $5bn.
Compare that with the UK's pledg of $835mill, recently raised from a mere $330mill, and the rest of europe combine pledging a paltry $234 mill, and Japan look to be the new saviours of Iraq...
Compare that with the UK's pledg of $835mill, recently raised from a mere $330mill, and the rest of europe combine pledging a paltry $234 mill, and Japan look to be the new saviours of Iraq...
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