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Discuss.
Now.
Now.
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The interest does start very low though, and when you consider the sum you are borrowing it is effectively negligible.
I don't ultimately care what they do with tuition fees or student loans, as long as they don't change some fundamental constants. Namely:
* The amount of money the student has in his/her pocket to live on
* When you pay it back, and the rate at which you pay it back
As long as there's a job at the end of my degree in the subject I took my degree in, I don't really mind paying back the tens of thousands of pounds I owe. However I know a great many people who failed to secure graduate positions despite months of trying, and are aimlessly wandering the job market wondering how the hell this could've happened to them.
Get saddled with £25K debt and then no job at the end? No thanks
I don't ultimately care what they do with tuition fees or student loans, as long as they don't change some fundamental constants. Namely:
* The amount of money the student has in his/her pocket to live on
* When you pay it back, and the rate at which you pay it back
As long as there's a job at the end of my degree in the subject I took my degree in, I don't really mind paying back the tens of thousands of pounds I owe. However I know a great many people who failed to secure graduate positions despite months of trying, and are aimlessly wandering the job market wondering how the hell this could've happened to them.
Get saddled with £25K debt and then no job at the end? No thanks
sideshow buzz wrote:
> Grrrrr I've got to moan at the student loans company....
> As far as I was aware they only start charging interest when I
> graduate or am able to start making payments on the loan.
>
> I recently got a letter stating the amount I owe and have been payed,
> also listing interest that was acumulating as far back as september
> 2001
> at the rate they are going I may have to owe an extra 5-600 quid
> before I even graduate.
Yeah, I got caught out with that one too :(
No-one mentions beforehand about the amount of interest, but it's accumulative, so it goes up and up and up and up.
and up...
> Grrrrr I've got to moan at the student loans company....
> As far as I was aware they only start charging interest when I
> graduate or am able to start making payments on the loan.
>
> I recently got a letter stating the amount I owe and have been payed,
> also listing interest that was acumulating as far back as september
> 2001
> at the rate they are going I may have to owe an extra 5-600 quid
> before I even graduate.
Yeah, I got caught out with that one too :(
No-one mentions beforehand about the amount of interest, but it's accumulative, so it goes up and up and up and up.
and up...
Grrrrr I've got to moan at the student loans company....
As far as I was aware they only start charging interest when I graduate or am able to start making payments on the loan.
I recently got a letter stating the amount I owe and have been payed, also listing interest that was acumulating as far back as september 2001
at the rate they are going I may have to owe an extra 5-600 quid before I even graduate.
As far as I was aware they only start charging interest when I graduate or am able to start making payments on the loan.
I recently got a letter stating the amount I owe and have been payed, also listing interest that was acumulating as far back as september 2001
at the rate they are going I may have to owe an extra 5-600 quid before I even graduate.
RM18 wrote:
> Just been discovering that little fact. Basically, at A-Level you're
> spoon fed information basically designed specifically for passsing the
> exam. At uni, its sink or swim - do the work and get along, don't and
> the teachers won't obsess about teaching you what you need to know for
> the exam.
Exactly, a lot of people on my course avoid the lecturers like they carry the plague, and think it's great to be able to skip tons of lectures. So why did they come in the first place ? If you show no interest or skive off all the time then lecturers don't care - they've got tenure and if you, or your parents complain when you do badly they've got attendence records. It's pretty simple, if you're doing a nessay then find time to let your tutor look at it, he/she will, and they'll tell you how to improve it, and you get a higher mark for it which is great. It's highly unlikely even the greatest person can do all the coursework without getting some advice - first essay I did on colonialism last year, I shoed a rough version to my tutor, she spent 10 mins telling me what to do to improve it, I did what she said, and got 80%, great.
First year of my course we had 85, now it's the second year we're on 60 left...mostly though those who failed to even average 40% in the first year. Pathetic. But good, you get rid of the timewasters.
~~Belldandy~~
> Just been discovering that little fact. Basically, at A-Level you're
> spoon fed information basically designed specifically for passsing the
> exam. At uni, its sink or swim - do the work and get along, don't and
> the teachers won't obsess about teaching you what you need to know for
> the exam.
Exactly, a lot of people on my course avoid the lecturers like they carry the plague, and think it's great to be able to skip tons of lectures. So why did they come in the first place ? If you show no interest or skive off all the time then lecturers don't care - they've got tenure and if you, or your parents complain when you do badly they've got attendence records. It's pretty simple, if you're doing a nessay then find time to let your tutor look at it, he/she will, and they'll tell you how to improve it, and you get a higher mark for it which is great. It's highly unlikely even the greatest person can do all the coursework without getting some advice - first essay I did on colonialism last year, I shoed a rough version to my tutor, she spent 10 mins telling me what to do to improve it, I did what she said, and got 80%, great.
First year of my course we had 85, now it's the second year we're on 60 left...mostly though those who failed to even average 40% in the first year. Pathetic. But good, you get rid of the timewasters.
~~Belldandy~~
Belldandy wrote:
>
> As for making it CCC minimum - bad idea. You're assuming A Levels are
> a good guide to University progress and they aren't - in most subjects
> it's completely different ways of assessment, learning, and teaching.
Just been discovering that little fact. Basically, at A-Level you're spoon fed information basically designed specifically for passsing the exam. At uni, its sink or swim - do the work and get along, don't and the teachers won't obsess about teaching you what you need to know for the exam.
On the subject of getting rid of lower universities, I would disagree, as they have their function. BUT, only if they get rid of the stupid degrees - not media studies (:D), but the useless dead end ones. Go back to tradiional subjects, ones that can surve a purpose if used properly (as in Media Studies), and switch the ridiculous to ones that can lead to proper employment.
P.S. In the LSE student paper recently, there was an article about the number of unemployed graduates rising. Frankly, I see this as sympotmatic of the problems people have mentioned, as some of these degrees don't teach anything that can be used effectively AFTER uni - cut the useless degrees, and teach people skills they can actually use in the real world.
>
> As for making it CCC minimum - bad idea. You're assuming A Levels are
> a good guide to University progress and they aren't - in most subjects
> it's completely different ways of assessment, learning, and teaching.
Just been discovering that little fact. Basically, at A-Level you're spoon fed information basically designed specifically for passsing the exam. At uni, its sink or swim - do the work and get along, don't and the teachers won't obsess about teaching you what you need to know for the exam.
On the subject of getting rid of lower universities, I would disagree, as they have their function. BUT, only if they get rid of the stupid degrees - not media studies (:D), but the useless dead end ones. Go back to tradiional subjects, ones that can surve a purpose if used properly (as in Media Studies), and switch the ridiculous to ones that can lead to proper employment.
P.S. In the LSE student paper recently, there was an article about the number of unemployed graduates rising. Frankly, I see this as sympotmatic of the problems people have mentioned, as some of these degrees don't teach anything that can be used effectively AFTER uni - cut the useless degrees, and teach people skills they can actually use in the real world.
SHEEPY wrote:
> I never said that Stryke
--
Oh, sorry. Might have been Goatboy.
> Means I would get to study for almost nothing :)
--
Me too. :D
> I never said that Stryke
--
Oh, sorry. Might have been Goatboy.
> Means I would get to study for almost nothing :)
--
Me too. :D
I have to disagree with most of you on this one. The current system isn't actually far off. Sure its not perfect, I don't think it ever will be. But just look at the improvement from ten years ago.
Back then your family either had to be really loaded enough to get you through uni, or you needed a grant, which were limited. Now, with much lower students fess and the loan system, if you want it enough, and are motivated enough, you CAN get to go to a good uni and get a degree WHATEVER your family's income and wealth.
I know some people will come out in debt, believe me - I'm a student at the moment (well actually I'm on a placement year, but I'll be back in York next October). BUT, you have to ask yourself the question: What would I rather have, a degree that I can put as much or as little effort in as I want, and £12000 of debt to pay off. Or no degree and no debt? Answer that question, and then decide whether to go to uni.
In my opinion, you should be old enough and ugly enough to make that decision yourself. If you know that you won't put in enough effort to get a degree that is worth all that debt, don't go to uni. Get a job. But don't moan about fees. If you put the work in, then the fees are worth it.
That's what I think anyway. :-)
GL
Back then your family either had to be really loaded enough to get you through uni, or you needed a grant, which were limited. Now, with much lower students fess and the loan system, if you want it enough, and are motivated enough, you CAN get to go to a good uni and get a degree WHATEVER your family's income and wealth.
I know some people will come out in debt, believe me - I'm a student at the moment (well actually I'm on a placement year, but I'll be back in York next October). BUT, you have to ask yourself the question: What would I rather have, a degree that I can put as much or as little effort in as I want, and £12000 of debt to pay off. Or no degree and no debt? Answer that question, and then decide whether to go to uni.
In my opinion, you should be old enough and ugly enough to make that decision yourself. If you know that you won't put in enough effort to get a degree that is worth all that debt, don't go to uni. Get a job. But don't moan about fees. If you put the work in, then the fees are worth it.
That's what I think anyway. :-)
GL
Stryke wrote:
> And stupid people should be kept out of university. Bottom class uni's
> should be abolished. Napier, Thames Valley, Lincoln e.t.c are just
> wastes of time. Plus Newcastle, on principle. I reckon you should need
> grades CCC minimum to go to uni, preferably BBB. In fact, yeah, BBB.
> Plus you've got to show a genuine enthusiasum for your subject and for
> the general academic lifestyle. Sod the stupid townies who just want
> to study something utterly worthless like Media Studies. Mind you, I'm
> probably biased due to being middle-class. Or something.
Academic lifestyle ? *collapses in laughter* I've got better things to do than mess around with my time. I go to the lectures and seminars, and then get lost. Genuine enthusiasm eh? What if it's amore involved subject not taught at A Level, and isn't the point of going to get a degree to learn about a subject, and not to swot up on it before you go ?
As for making it CCC minimum - bad idea. You're assuming A Levels are a good guide to University progress and they aren't - in most subjects it's completely different ways of assessment, learning, and teaching.
And I don't think you can judge things like media studies worthless as they're simply new areas of study. If no one starts any new courses then the system will vegetate.
University can be for everyone who wants to go - if it were not for loans - and I'd question anyone who thinks "stupid people" should be kept out of university. In fact I'd question whether they should be going to university in the first place with an attitude like that.
~~Belldandy~~
> And stupid people should be kept out of university. Bottom class uni's
> should be abolished. Napier, Thames Valley, Lincoln e.t.c are just
> wastes of time. Plus Newcastle, on principle. I reckon you should need
> grades CCC minimum to go to uni, preferably BBB. In fact, yeah, BBB.
> Plus you've got to show a genuine enthusiasum for your subject and for
> the general academic lifestyle. Sod the stupid townies who just want
> to study something utterly worthless like Media Studies. Mind you, I'm
> probably biased due to being middle-class. Or something.
Academic lifestyle ? *collapses in laughter* I've got better things to do than mess around with my time. I go to the lectures and seminars, and then get lost. Genuine enthusiasm eh? What if it's amore involved subject not taught at A Level, and isn't the point of going to get a degree to learn about a subject, and not to swot up on it before you go ?
As for making it CCC minimum - bad idea. You're assuming A Levels are a good guide to University progress and they aren't - in most subjects it's completely different ways of assessment, learning, and teaching.
And I don't think you can judge things like media studies worthless as they're simply new areas of study. If no one starts any new courses then the system will vegetate.
University can be for everyone who wants to go - if it were not for loans - and I'd question anyone who thinks "stupid people" should be kept out of university. In fact I'd question whether they should be going to university in the first place with an attitude like that.
~~Belldandy~~
I never said that Stryke
I actually agree with you to an extent
I don't want to go to University with a bunch of morons who scraped in to study P.E or something.
Venombyte's idea is the way (although mine was like that errr a bit)
Means I would get to study for almost nothing :)
I actually agree with you to an extent
I don't want to go to University with a bunch of morons who scraped in to study P.E or something.
Venombyte's idea is the way (although mine was like that errr a bit)
Means I would get to study for almost nothing :)
I like that idea.
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