The "Nintendo Games" forum, which includes Retro Game Reviews, has been archived and is now read-only. You cannot post here or create a new thread or review on this forum.
"It looks aweful. Why can't the make it like the realistic demos???"
A phrase so ofte heard. And I agree, but for a different reason.
Of course, I have no doubt that the new Zelda will have great gameplay, maybe even some revolutionary elements too. Either way it's going to be a classic.
But why Cell-shading? After all, as I understand it, cell-shading was invented by Sega to give Jet Set a grafiti feel to it. Of course, it works superbly for cartoons too, hene games like Wacky Racers use it. So, why Zelda? It is neither a cartoon, nor is it a street sports game. It simply doesn't warrant the new look.
I propose two alternatives:
1) The hyper-realistoc look.
Clearly, this will allow Nintendo to truely realise the phantasy elements of the game- great looking maic effect, immense bosses and perfect sword fights would make the game the crown of the Gamecube and show what the console is capable of. It would increase gamecube sales, and would alert the massmarket as to Nintendo's genius. It couldn't go wrong!
2) A new graphical style:
Well, Cell-shading was invented to look like grafiti- the topic of the game it was used in. So, why doesn't Miyamoto invent a new style for Zelda that would allow the phantasy side of the game to shine. How about having a sky that swirls with multiple colours- like a moving Monet painting. Lakes could be done in the same way- ever seen Monet's water-lilies? Evil creatures in the game could be surrounded by a haze of dark evil that would follow their bodys and produce stunning effects.
This is what I mean by a new graphical style.
Well, there are my two cents for the day. I'd like to know your opinions- especially on that last idea.
Sonic
A phrase so ofte heard. And I agree, but for a different reason.
Of course, I have no doubt that the new Zelda will have great gameplay, maybe even some revolutionary elements too. Either way it's going to be a classic.
But why Cell-shading? After all, as I understand it, cell-shading was invented by Sega to give Jet Set a grafiti feel to it. Of course, it works superbly for cartoons too, hene games like Wacky Racers use it. So, why Zelda? It is neither a cartoon, nor is it a street sports game. It simply doesn't warrant the new look.
I propose two alternatives:
1) The hyper-realistoc look.
Clearly, this will allow Nintendo to truely realise the phantasy elements of the game- great looking maic effect, immense bosses and perfect sword fights would make the game the crown of the Gamecube and show what the console is capable of. It would increase gamecube sales, and would alert the massmarket as to Nintendo's genius. It couldn't go wrong!
2) A new graphical style:
Well, Cell-shading was invented to look like grafiti- the topic of the game it was used in. So, why doesn't Miyamoto invent a new style for Zelda that would allow the phantasy side of the game to shine. How about having a sky that swirls with multiple colours- like a moving Monet painting. Lakes could be done in the same way- ever seen Monet's water-lilies? Evil creatures in the game could be surrounded by a haze of dark evil that would follow their bodys and produce stunning effects.
This is what I mean by a new graphical style.
Well, there are my two cents for the day. I'd like to know your opinions- especially on that last idea.
Sonic
Page:
Ooops! :-D
Blame the "reply with quote"
That's how it was set out...
Anyway, read the second half of my reply.
It went back to the main topic subject and shows how Nintendo hasn't simply copied and pasted a graffiti look to an adventure game.
They have modified it to suit Hyrule.
Watch the the video AGAIN (;-D), you'll see what I mean...
Blame the "reply with quote"
That's how it was set out...
Anyway, read the second half of my reply.
It went back to the main topic subject and shows how Nintendo hasn't simply copied and pasted a graffiti look to an adventure game.
They have modified it to suit Hyrule.
Watch the the video AGAIN (;-D), you'll see what I mean...
I have seen the video, and I am impressed...
but not half as impressed as I am about Strafex taking me out of context..
Where I said
"I do, however, completely agree with El Moro's point that the new Zelda "looks crap" to an extent. Although I don't think the actual game will have a bad appearance, I can think of many other, more original ways to go than cell shading"
Strafex took the two sentences completely separately, replying first to:
"I do, however, completely agree with El Moro's point that the new Zelda "looks crap" to an extent."
And then to the second half. Clearly, the first half by itself means something completely different to when you read both sentences together!
Sonic
but not half as impressed as I am about Strafex taking me out of context..
Where I said
"I do, however, completely agree with El Moro's point that the new Zelda "looks crap" to an extent. Although I don't think the actual game will have a bad appearance, I can think of many other, more original ways to go than cell shading"
Strafex took the two sentences completely separately, replying first to:
"I do, however, completely agree with El Moro's point that the new Zelda "looks crap" to an extent."
And then to the second half. Clearly, the first half by itself means something completely different to when you read both sentences together!
Sonic
===SONICRAV---> wrote:
> Well, Strafex, I do agree that Zelda will be great whether it has Cell Shading
> or not... as you say.
I do, however, completely agree with El Moro's point
> that the new Zelda "looks crap" to an extent.
Don't tell me that you've only seen screenshots too...
Haven't you watched the video running?
Although they're not detailed, the graphics are far from crap!
Although I don't think
> the actual game will have a bad appearance, I can think of many other, more
> original ways to go than cell shading- like making a whole new graphical style
> based on Monet's paintings for example.
Having seen Jet Set's cell shading, it is fairly different to Zelda's. Jet Set has thick dark outlines, giving it that cleverly characterised "graffiti" look.
Zelda is different. Those thick black lines are more or less missing.
I think that the Cel Shading technique has been a little bit for Zelda modified to give a "cartoon storyland" look.
Seeing as that's what all the other Zelda games were based on (a cartoon storyland of some sort), I think that this suits the game perfectly.
Download and watch it on video.
I agree that the screenshots are crap, but that's because they don't give the game (when it's running) justice.
It's the sort of animation you only see in FMV, even on the bits that are clearly actual game footage!
You'd have to see the clip to know what I mean...
> Well, Strafex, I do agree that Zelda will be great whether it has Cell Shading
> or not... as you say.
I do, however, completely agree with El Moro's point
> that the new Zelda "looks crap" to an extent.
Don't tell me that you've only seen screenshots too...
Haven't you watched the video running?
Although they're not detailed, the graphics are far from crap!
Although I don't think
> the actual game will have a bad appearance, I can think of many other, more
> original ways to go than cell shading- like making a whole new graphical style
> based on Monet's paintings for example.
Having seen Jet Set's cell shading, it is fairly different to Zelda's. Jet Set has thick dark outlines, giving it that cleverly characterised "graffiti" look.
Zelda is different. Those thick black lines are more or less missing.
I think that the Cel Shading technique has been a little bit for Zelda modified to give a "cartoon storyland" look.
Seeing as that's what all the other Zelda games were based on (a cartoon storyland of some sort), I think that this suits the game perfectly.
Download and watch it on video.
I agree that the screenshots are crap, but that's because they don't give the game (when it's running) justice.
It's the sort of animation you only see in FMV, even on the bits that are clearly actual game footage!
You'd have to see the clip to know what I mean...
El Moro wrote:
ironic to say the least, idiocy? the
> main failing in Strafex's arguement is that he himself is an idiot. Opinions
> differ! live with it!
Your opinion?
That you can't call Cel Shading graphics?
That Miyamoto's gone stupid?
You didn't express a proper opinion.
To be completely honest, yes the shading technique will
> appeal to some people, just because you are one of those people does not mean
> you are right!
I could understand if you simply said you prefer the characters to look like Plastacine models then that would be fine. To say that the cel shading looks crap because it looks cartoony is more or less saying "i wont zelda to look adult so my frends dont call me sad when i play a cartoon game!".
I do truely believe i
> am to old even at 16, to play some cartoony game with 'bright colours and pig
> tails', and why should i get a ps?
Because you can play games that don't have bright colours and pig tails...
i love Mario, but it works slightly cartoony,
> Zelda looses something special in ultra cartoony style, if Miyamato wont go 'all
> the way' at least keep "medium" level of cartoon as in the N64
> versions.
Watch the game clip.
Go on, watch it!
What has it lost?
Link does look a bit strange but you'll get used to that...
The music is still the same theme, there are similar gameplay mechanics...
Don't be fooled into thinking that it's become "happy land".
It'll be just as dark as previous instalments of the game!
If anything, the game runs smoother, there's better, more advanced animation and the game is brought to life.
Watch the cartoon without thinking "im too big for games that dont look really dark and grown up!" and you'll realise that the graphics look fine (they might not be detailed but they run and look as smooth as silk), and everything else that has made previous Zelda games great is still there.
Besides, this is how Shiguru Miyamoto envisioned the game to be.
If a Zelda game wasn't done how he wanted it then it wouldn't be done properly!
With all those so-called Zelda fans dissing the game purely because of the pathetic excuse that the graphics weren't "adult" enough for them, I wouldn't blame Shigsy if he packed up the entire project and left Zelda out of the Gamecube generation of games!!!
ironic to say the least, idiocy? the
> main failing in Strafex's arguement is that he himself is an idiot. Opinions
> differ! live with it!
Your opinion?
That you can't call Cel Shading graphics?
That Miyamoto's gone stupid?
You didn't express a proper opinion.
To be completely honest, yes the shading technique will
> appeal to some people, just because you are one of those people does not mean
> you are right!
I could understand if you simply said you prefer the characters to look like Plastacine models then that would be fine. To say that the cel shading looks crap because it looks cartoony is more or less saying "i wont zelda to look adult so my frends dont call me sad when i play a cartoon game!".
I do truely believe i
> am to old even at 16, to play some cartoony game with 'bright colours and pig
> tails', and why should i get a ps?
Because you can play games that don't have bright colours and pig tails...
i love Mario, but it works slightly cartoony,
> Zelda looses something special in ultra cartoony style, if Miyamato wont go 'all
> the way' at least keep "medium" level of cartoon as in the N64
> versions.
Watch the game clip.
Go on, watch it!
What has it lost?
Link does look a bit strange but you'll get used to that...
The music is still the same theme, there are similar gameplay mechanics...
Don't be fooled into thinking that it's become "happy land".
It'll be just as dark as previous instalments of the game!
If anything, the game runs smoother, there's better, more advanced animation and the game is brought to life.
Watch the cartoon without thinking "im too big for games that dont look really dark and grown up!" and you'll realise that the graphics look fine (they might not be detailed but they run and look as smooth as silk), and everything else that has made previous Zelda games great is still there.
Besides, this is how Shiguru Miyamoto envisioned the game to be.
If a Zelda game wasn't done how he wanted it then it wouldn't be done properly!
With all those so-called Zelda fans dissing the game purely because of the pathetic excuse that the graphics weren't "adult" enough for them, I wouldn't blame Shigsy if he packed up the entire project and left Zelda out of the Gamecube generation of games!!!
Well, Strafex, I do agree that Zelda will be great whether it has Cell Shading or not... as you say.
I do, however, completely agree with El Moro's point that the new Zelda "looks crap" to an extent. Although I don't think the actual game will have a bad appearance, I can think of many other, more original ways to go than cell shading- like making a whole new graphical style based on Monet's paintings for example.
Now that would mark a completely huge revolution in gaming if someone would try it.
Sonic
I do, however, completely agree with El Moro's point that the new Zelda "looks crap" to an extent. Although I don't think the actual game will have a bad appearance, I can think of many other, more original ways to go than cell shading- like making a whole new graphical style based on Monet's paintings for example.
Now that would mark a completely huge revolution in gaming if someone would try it.
Sonic
When I said proper games, I meant games that sell for what they are, not because they look "cool" or "adult", so kids that like to think that they're "all grown up" will buy them...
When I said buy a Playstation I didn't mean that all Playstation games are "adult" gimmick led, it's just the system that these idiots tend to choose.
When I said buy a Playstation I didn't mean that all Playstation games are "adult" gimmick led, it's just the system that these idiots tend to choose.
"rather than proper games..."
All games are proper games
Except for that darn Parappa the Rapper! What the heck is that all about?
All games are proper games
Except for that darn Parappa the Rapper! What the heck is that all about?
Strafex wrote:
> You're an idiot.
ironic to say the least, idiocy? the main failing in Strafex's arguement is that he himself is an idiot. Opinions differ! live with it! To be completely honest, yes the shading technique will appeal to some people, just because you are one of those people does not mean you are right! any1 who looked at my totally uninteresting topic would understand that you have to be the most stubborn self riteous (annoying television beep noise sounds for 5 minutes) in the world. I do truely believe i am to old even at 16, to play some cartoony game with 'bright colours and pig tails', and why should i get a ps? i love Mario, but it works slightly cartoony, Zelda looses something special in ultra cartoony style, if Miyamato wont go 'all the way' at least keep "medium" level of cartoon as in the N64 versions.
>You obviously haven't seen the clip so go and watch it before you talk as if you know what you're talking about.
The problem is, so do you...
Question 40D: Data Handling
p.s. look jus below to see the "arguement"
> You're an idiot.
ironic to say the least, idiocy? the main failing in Strafex's arguement is that he himself is an idiot. Opinions differ! live with it! To be completely honest, yes the shading technique will appeal to some people, just because you are one of those people does not mean you are right! any1 who looked at my totally uninteresting topic would understand that you have to be the most stubborn self riteous (annoying television beep noise sounds for 5 minutes) in the world. I do truely believe i am to old even at 16, to play some cartoony game with 'bright colours and pig tails', and why should i get a ps? i love Mario, but it works slightly cartoony, Zelda looses something special in ultra cartoony style, if Miyamato wont go 'all the way' at least keep "medium" level of cartoon as in the N64 versions.
>You obviously haven't seen the clip so go and watch it before you talk as if you know what you're talking about.
The problem is, so do you...
Question 40D: Data Handling
p.s. look jus below to see the "arguement"
You're an idiot.
Although SonicRav prefers the plastacine style of graphics, he knows that Zelda will still be great with Cel Shading (unless it's only 15 hours long...).
You obviously haven't seen the clip so go and watch it before you talk as if you know what you're talking about.
If you have seen the clip and STILL think that the game looks crap then you might as well get a Playstation as you obviously prefer mainstream "all big and grown up cos im not a little baby n e more!!!" rather than proper games...
Although SonicRav prefers the plastacine style of graphics, he knows that Zelda will still be great with Cel Shading (unless it's only 15 hours long...).
You obviously haven't seen the clip so go and watch it before you talk as if you know what you're talking about.
If you have seen the clip and STILL think that the game looks crap then you might as well get a Playstation as you obviously prefer mainstream "all big and grown up cos im not a little baby n e more!!!" rather than proper games...
I could not agree more with Sonic, i absolutely, catagorically despise the so-called new graphics of Zelda, if those are graphics then im a Lama, scrap that, cos that may well be true... But still i honestly have no idea what Miyamato was and is thinking, my only conlusion is that he wanted to retire, created a budget clone to continue his work for him and due to a technical error his common sense was left out...
Page: