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I was watching this on the news (from about 10:30-14:00) and i have to say i found it rather exciting, obviously it was a terrible ordeal for everyone involved. Especially the poor kids that were practically naked, apparently when they asked for a drink they were told to strip, their clothes were doused with water and they were told to suck the moisture out. Pretty grim stuff.
Near the end of the special show an ITN cameraman actually got into the gym where everyone had been held, the roof had collapsed (chechen rebels had rigged it with 14 explosive charges) while people were still inside and apparently some 100 bodies lay inside.
The chechens then fled to some buildings nearby and were holding a sustained firefight with the russian military.
Near the end of the special show an ITN cameraman actually got into the gym where everyone had been held, the roof had collapsed (chechen rebels had rigged it with 14 explosive charges) while people were still inside and apparently some 100 bodies lay inside.
The chechens then fled to some buildings nearby and were holding a sustained firefight with the russian military.
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The news described it as “embarrassing” for Putin. Yes. That's one way to descibe it.
Light wrote:
> Jesus Christ, sometimes I absolutely despair...
You're not alone.
> Jesus Christ, sometimes I absolutely despair...
You're not alone.
Light wrote:
> One side commits an atrocity which they justify by pointing to the
> atrocity committed against them, so they have yet another atrocity
> committed and....
>
> Well, you get the idea. The only way to stop terrorism is to stop
> partaking of it. Sooner every nation realises this, the sooner the
> terror stops.
That is true, in theory, but in practice, one of the 'parties' involved, i.e. a country ect... would have to stop their actions first.
That 'parties' citizens would not be pleased with this would they? It would seem more like in-action, and an extremly risky move, than the solution to the problem. And your assuming that the terrorist cell sees that the other country is trying to make the situation better, and would stop in return. Where as it may be seen as a weakness, and use the opportunity to attack.
It could easily go either way, and the public is usually more concerned with the short term.
Take the US war on terror, it may not solve terrorism in the long term, i'm no fool, i see that, but as one US citizen told me, and i quote:
"Before the 'War on Terror', under Clinton, there were 5 attacks on US soil. Since Bush and his War on Terror, there has only been one."
So from an American perspecive, the War on Terror seems to be working, and so will be a bit reluctant to just stop everything and hope Al Quida leaves them alone. I agree, your idea would probably, or at least go a toward, stopping terrorism, however, for the US, a nation filled with the post 9/11 paranoids, can you see why they do what they do?
> One side commits an atrocity which they justify by pointing to the
> atrocity committed against them, so they have yet another atrocity
> committed and....
>
> Well, you get the idea. The only way to stop terrorism is to stop
> partaking of it. Sooner every nation realises this, the sooner the
> terror stops.
That is true, in theory, but in practice, one of the 'parties' involved, i.e. a country ect... would have to stop their actions first.
That 'parties' citizens would not be pleased with this would they? It would seem more like in-action, and an extremly risky move, than the solution to the problem. And your assuming that the terrorist cell sees that the other country is trying to make the situation better, and would stop in return. Where as it may be seen as a weakness, and use the opportunity to attack.
It could easily go either way, and the public is usually more concerned with the short term.
Take the US war on terror, it may not solve terrorism in the long term, i'm no fool, i see that, but as one US citizen told me, and i quote:
"Before the 'War on Terror', under Clinton, there were 5 attacks on US soil. Since Bush and his War on Terror, there has only been one."
So from an American perspecive, the War on Terror seems to be working, and so will be a bit reluctant to just stop everything and hope Al Quida leaves them alone. I agree, your idea would probably, or at least go a toward, stopping terrorism, however, for the US, a nation filled with the post 9/11 paranoids, can you see why they do what they do?
cookie monster wrote:
> Paradox: wrote:
> Are Chechyna (dont know the correct spelling)
> wanting independence but Russia are reluctant to grant it because
> yet
> again they will appear weak in the history books?
>
> Well, sort of but there is more. Putin would be scared to allow
> Chechnya independence incase Al-Quaida set up operations there.
OR It's becuase Putin doesn't want to let some tiny republic go just in case any more of Russias' once great empire falls to bits - it's considered incredibly important in Russia (apparantly) that the Russian land remains as it was.
> Paradox: wrote:
> Are Chechyna (dont know the correct spelling)
> wanting independence but Russia are reluctant to grant it because
> yet
> again they will appear weak in the history books?
>
> Well, sort of but there is more. Putin would be scared to allow
> Chechnya independence incase Al-Quaida set up operations there.
OR It's becuase Putin doesn't want to let some tiny republic go just in case any more of Russias' once great empire falls to bits - it's considered incredibly important in Russia (apparantly) that the Russian land remains as it was.
What Light said. Attack breeds attack breeds attack.......etc.
Read something about something before opening your mouth please (to Foszy and anylike him/her).
Anyway, very nasty.
Read something about something before opening your mouth please (to Foszy and anylike him/her).
Anyway, very nasty.
Paradox: wrote:
> Are Chechyna (dont know the correct spelling)
> wanting independence but Russia are reluctant to grant it because yet
> again they will appear weak in the history books?
Well, sort of but there is more. Putin would be scared to allow Chechnya independence incase Al-Quaida set up operations there.
> Are Chechyna (dont know the correct spelling)
> wanting independence but Russia are reluctant to grant it because yet
> again they will appear weak in the history books?
Well, sort of but there is more. Putin would be scared to allow Chechnya independence incase Al-Quaida set up operations there.
I'm not going to attempt to flaunt my terrorism knowledge, I'll just sum it up in my own simple opinion.
Terrorism - Nasty and underhand
Terrorism with kids involved - Cowardice
I assume that the only reason they chose to take over a school was to get more news coverage and get their "cause" more acknowledged - though it seems it has failed because I don't even know why they've taken the school over - just that Russia and at war with a rebel state. Are Chechyna (dont know the correct spelling) wanting independence but Russia are reluctant to grant it because yet again they will appear weak in the history books?
Terrorism - Nasty and underhand
Terrorism with kids involved - Cowardice
I assume that the only reason they chose to take over a school was to get more news coverage and get their "cause" more acknowledged - though it seems it has failed because I don't even know why they've taken the school over - just that Russia and at war with a rebel state. Are Chechyna (dont know the correct spelling) wanting independence but Russia are reluctant to grant it because yet again they will appear weak in the history books?
Foszy wrote:
> So your saying they did this because we did it to them first, the
> reason behind most terroism is because they dont agree with the way
> we live our culture here in the western world. We dont belive in
> there religion and therefore should be attacked and made to fear
> them, no i dont think thats fair.
Do you actually even have the faintest idea what it is you're talking about or have you simply disengaged your brain and let your fingers hit random keys?
Okay; the Chechen state declared independence from Russian rule. Russia, under Yeltsin, invaded in order to bring "the rogue state to heel". In doing so, the Russian army (underpaid, low morale, generally not a good place to be) committed numerous atrocities on the Chechen people. The Chechen rebels fought quite ferociously, and the current situation is by no means stable in the Chechnya.
Therefore the atrocities in Chechnya caused todays atrocity in Russia. Unless you're trying to suggest that the Chechens had some spare time and decided to use it up blowing up children?
Oh, and as to your Government approved headbilge "They don't like our culture", I assume that was in relation to Al-Quaida? Well, I don't think that's the reason. I think the reason for Al-Quaida's attacks was because of the US presence in Saudi Arabia coupled with the continual support of Israel whilst condemned any actions by the Palestinians. Know why I think that? Cos that's what bin-Laden actually f**king said
Jesus Christ, sometimes I absolutely despair...
> So your saying they did this because we did it to them first, the
> reason behind most terroism is because they dont agree with the way
> we live our culture here in the western world. We dont belive in
> there religion and therefore should be attacked and made to fear
> them, no i dont think thats fair.
Do you actually even have the faintest idea what it is you're talking about or have you simply disengaged your brain and let your fingers hit random keys?
Okay; the Chechen state declared independence from Russian rule. Russia, under Yeltsin, invaded in order to bring "the rogue state to heel". In doing so, the Russian army (underpaid, low morale, generally not a good place to be) committed numerous atrocities on the Chechen people. The Chechen rebels fought quite ferociously, and the current situation is by no means stable in the Chechnya.
Therefore the atrocities in Chechnya caused todays atrocity in Russia. Unless you're trying to suggest that the Chechens had some spare time and decided to use it up blowing up children?
Oh, and as to your Government approved headbilge "They don't like our culture", I assume that was in relation to Al-Quaida? Well, I don't think that's the reason. I think the reason for Al-Quaida's attacks was because of the US presence in Saudi Arabia coupled with the continual support of Israel whilst condemned any actions by the Palestinians. Know why I think that? Cos that's what bin-Laden actually f**king said
Jesus Christ, sometimes I absolutely despair...
Light wrote:
> One side commits an atrocity which they justify by pointing to the
> atrocity committed against them, so they have yet another atrocity
> committed and....
>
> Well, you get the idea. The only way to stop terrorism is to stop
> partaking of it. Sooner every nation realises this, the sooner the
> terror stops.
So your saying they did this because we did it to them first, the reason behind most terroism is because they dont agree with the way we live our culture here in the western world. We dont belive in there religion and therefore should be attacked and made to fear them, no i dont think thats fair.
> One side commits an atrocity which they justify by pointing to the
> atrocity committed against them, so they have yet another atrocity
> committed and....
>
> Well, you get the idea. The only way to stop terrorism is to stop
> partaking of it. Sooner every nation realises this, the sooner the
> terror stops.
So your saying they did this because we did it to them first, the reason behind most terroism is because they dont agree with the way we live our culture here in the western world. We dont belive in there religion and therefore should be attacked and made to fear them, no i dont think thats fair.
One side commits an atrocity which they justify by pointing to the atrocity committed against them, so they have yet another atrocity committed and....
Well, you get the idea. The only way to stop terrorism is to stop partaking of it. Sooner every nation realises this, the sooner the terror stops.
Well, you get the idea. The only way to stop terrorism is to stop partaking of it. Sooner every nation realises this, the sooner the terror stops.
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