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http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/ 06/25/sprj.irq.centrifuge/index.html
Now why would anyone want to hide something like that, eh ?
Now why would anyone want to hide something like that, eh ?
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Joking aside, what has happened to this "immediate and serious threat of terrorist attack" since we invaded Iraq?
Remember the talk of practising attack drills in central London? The mosque in Finsbury, the (almost too cliche) hook-handed "cleric of hate", the gaurding at airports, the talk of ricin, shoes-bombs, tanks at heathrow, warnings from the Home Office about what to do in the event of terrorist attacks?
Gone. All gone.
Yet we dont know where Hussein is, or Bin Laden. But suddenly we're being fed The Euro, David Beckham, Big Brother and little talk of the enquiry into what Jack Straw called "an embarassment" in regards to dossiers of false information cribbed from 12 year old thesis?
Alistair Campbell chooses to attempt to divert attention by crying that the BBC is anti-labour and just trying to whip up trouble with it's "reputable source within the intelligence community", asking why the BBC doesn't reveal who - yet refuses to divulge the informational sources for their "sources" within MI5 and the military when preparing these dossiers.
Hmmmm......
Remember the talk of practising attack drills in central London? The mosque in Finsbury, the (almost too cliche) hook-handed "cleric of hate", the gaurding at airports, the talk of ricin, shoes-bombs, tanks at heathrow, warnings from the Home Office about what to do in the event of terrorist attacks?
Gone. All gone.
Yet we dont know where Hussein is, or Bin Laden. But suddenly we're being fed The Euro, David Beckham, Big Brother and little talk of the enquiry into what Jack Straw called "an embarassment" in regards to dossiers of false information cribbed from 12 year old thesis?
Alistair Campbell chooses to attempt to divert attention by crying that the BBC is anti-labour and just trying to whip up trouble with it's "reputable source within the intelligence community", asking why the BBC doesn't reveal who - yet refuses to divulge the informational sources for their "sources" within MI5 and the military when preparing these dossiers.
Hmmmm......
Goatboy wrote:
> Blair: MURDER DEATH KILL BOMBS IN YOUR IMMIGRANTS
heh heh!
> Blair: MURDER DEATH KILL BOMBS IN YOUR IMMIGRANTS
heh heh!
Blair:IMMEDIATE 45 MINUTES DEATH THREAT!!!!11!!11
Public: Balls
Blair: Terror alert!!! Tanks at Heathrow!!!
Public: Balls
Blair: MURDER DEATH KILL BOMBS IN YOUR IMMIGRANTS
Public: Balls
Blair: Look at this report!! DEATH!!
Public: That's a 12yr old Uni thesis
Blair: RICIN!!!!!
Public: From Algiers, attack Algiers.
Blair: FREEDOM FOR IRAQIS!!!!
Public: Citizens are shooting soldiers dead for weapons searches
Blair: WE FREED THEM!!!
Public: They lack basic water, power, law and order or any form of government
Blair: THE EURO, DIRTY FROGGY MONEY!!
Public: What about the 2nd dossier? Give evidence
Blair: No, here's Alistair Campbell instead
Public: No, you give evidence, you are the Prime Minister and went on television to convince us it was necessary to invade Iraq
Blair: No
Public: You are weak and too scared to back your previous words up?
Blair: SIX SOLDIERS KILLED!!!!!! STILL WAR!!!!
Public: No, that was a misunderstanding about weapons searches in a town, and any further searches have been halted after protest from the people you have liberated
---
Comedy Gold: The Gulf War 2, The Umpire Strikes Back
Public: Balls
Blair: Terror alert!!! Tanks at Heathrow!!!
Public: Balls
Blair: MURDER DEATH KILL BOMBS IN YOUR IMMIGRANTS
Public: Balls
Blair: Look at this report!! DEATH!!
Public: That's a 12yr old Uni thesis
Blair: RICIN!!!!!
Public: From Algiers, attack Algiers.
Blair: FREEDOM FOR IRAQIS!!!!
Public: Citizens are shooting soldiers dead for weapons searches
Blair: WE FREED THEM!!!
Public: They lack basic water, power, law and order or any form of government
Blair: THE EURO, DIRTY FROGGY MONEY!!
Public: What about the 2nd dossier? Give evidence
Blair: No, here's Alistair Campbell instead
Public: No, you give evidence, you are the Prime Minister and went on television to convince us it was necessary to invade Iraq
Blair: No
Public: You are weak and too scared to back your previous words up?
Blair: SIX SOLDIERS KILLED!!!!!! STILL WAR!!!!
Public: No, that was a misunderstanding about weapons searches in a town, and any further searches have been halted after protest from the people you have liberated
---
Comedy Gold: The Gulf War 2, The Umpire Strikes Back
Bush: We're going to invade Iraq.
UN: No, we need more time to ascertain if there are WMDs.
Bush: Too late, you're out of time.
Blair: We won't go to war without a second resolution
UN: No, we won't give you a second resolution.
Blair & Bush: Right, we're going to war.
*after the war*
UN: We can't find any WMDs.
Bush/Blair: Take as long as you want to find them.
UN: Why didn't you give us the time to find them before the war?
Bush/Blair: ...erm...
UN: No, we need more time to ascertain if there are WMDs.
Bush: Too late, you're out of time.
Blair: We won't go to war without a second resolution
UN: No, we won't give you a second resolution.
Blair & Bush: Right, we're going to war.
*after the war*
UN: We can't find any WMDs.
Bush/Blair: Take as long as you want to find them.
UN: Why didn't you give us the time to find them before the war?
Bush/Blair: ...erm...
Practical Magic wrote:
> Really, the story proves on thing - Iraq sought at some point to
> pursue a nuclear weapon.
--
Sorry to be so nitpicky but that's not correct Bell.
"So in that sense it doesn't show at all that Iraq had a nuclear program. And Obeidi told me that he never worked on a nuclear program after 1991"
"In his March 7 presentation to the U.N. Security Council, however, International Atomic Energy Agency Director General Mohamed ElBaradei said there was no evidence "Iraq intended to use these 81-millimeter tubes for any project other than the reverse engineering of rockets." (Full story)
U.S. officials, including President Bush, also had cited British intelligence documents indicating Iraq may have tried to buy 500 tons of uranium from Niger, but the IAEA said the documents were obvious fakes."
-------
These are quotes from your link, and the link to "full story", the transcript from ElBaradei offers the following information regarding Iraq's nuclear programme:
"At the outset, let me state on general observation, namely that during the past four years at the majority of Iraqi sites industrial capacity has deteriorated substantially due to the departure of the foreign support that was often present in the late '80s, the departure of large numbers of skilled Iraqi personnel in the past decade and the lack of consistent maintenance by Iraq of sophisticated equipment." - want to take a guess at the "foreign support" he's talking about?
"As you may recall, when we first began to request private, unescorted interviews, the Iraqi interviewees insisted on taping the interviews and keeping the recorded tapes. Recently, upon our insistence, individuals have been consenting to being interviewed without escort and without a taped record. The IAEA has conducted two such private interviews in the last 10 days, and hope that its ability to conduct private interviews will continue unhindered, including possibly interviews outside Iraq" - untaped transcripts and interviews, the things the USA were demanding.
"Based on available evidence, the IAEA team has concluded that Iraq efforts to import these aluminum tubes were not likely to have been related to the manufacture of centrifuge, and moreover that it was highly unlikely that Iraq could have achieved the considerable redesign needed to use them in a revived centrifuge program"
"there is no indication of resumed nuclear activities in those buildings that were identified through the use of satellite imagery as being reconstructed or newly erected since 1998, nor any indication of nuclear-related prohibited activities at any inspected sites."
"Second, there is no indication that Iraq has attempted to import uranium since 1990."
"Three, there is no indication that Iraq has attempted to import aluminum tubes for use in centrifuge enrichment. Moreover, even had Iraq pursued such a plan, it would have encountered practical difficulties in manufacturing centrifuge out of the aluminum tubes in question.
Fourth, although we are still reviewing issues related to magnets and magnet-production, there is no indication to date that Iraq imported magnets for use in centrifuge enrichment program."
You can read it for yourself:
"http://edition.cnn.com/2003/US/03/07/ sprj.irq.un.transcript.elbaradei/index.html"
> Really, the story proves on thing - Iraq sought at some point to
> pursue a nuclear weapon.
--
Sorry to be so nitpicky but that's not correct Bell.
"So in that sense it doesn't show at all that Iraq had a nuclear program. And Obeidi told me that he never worked on a nuclear program after 1991"
"In his March 7 presentation to the U.N. Security Council, however, International Atomic Energy Agency Director General Mohamed ElBaradei said there was no evidence "Iraq intended to use these 81-millimeter tubes for any project other than the reverse engineering of rockets." (Full story)
U.S. officials, including President Bush, also had cited British intelligence documents indicating Iraq may have tried to buy 500 tons of uranium from Niger, but the IAEA said the documents were obvious fakes."
-------
These are quotes from your link, and the link to "full story", the transcript from ElBaradei offers the following information regarding Iraq's nuclear programme:
"At the outset, let me state on general observation, namely that during the past four years at the majority of Iraqi sites industrial capacity has deteriorated substantially due to the departure of the foreign support that was often present in the late '80s, the departure of large numbers of skilled Iraqi personnel in the past decade and the lack of consistent maintenance by Iraq of sophisticated equipment." - want to take a guess at the "foreign support" he's talking about?
"As you may recall, when we first began to request private, unescorted interviews, the Iraqi interviewees insisted on taping the interviews and keeping the recorded tapes. Recently, upon our insistence, individuals have been consenting to being interviewed without escort and without a taped record. The IAEA has conducted two such private interviews in the last 10 days, and hope that its ability to conduct private interviews will continue unhindered, including possibly interviews outside Iraq" - untaped transcripts and interviews, the things the USA were demanding.
"Based on available evidence, the IAEA team has concluded that Iraq efforts to import these aluminum tubes were not likely to have been related to the manufacture of centrifuge, and moreover that it was highly unlikely that Iraq could have achieved the considerable redesign needed to use them in a revived centrifuge program"
"there is no indication of resumed nuclear activities in those buildings that were identified through the use of satellite imagery as being reconstructed or newly erected since 1998, nor any indication of nuclear-related prohibited activities at any inspected sites."
"Second, there is no indication that Iraq has attempted to import uranium since 1990."
"Three, there is no indication that Iraq has attempted to import aluminum tubes for use in centrifuge enrichment. Moreover, even had Iraq pursued such a plan, it would have encountered practical difficulties in manufacturing centrifuge out of the aluminum tubes in question.
Fourth, although we are still reviewing issues related to magnets and magnet-production, there is no indication to date that Iraq imported magnets for use in centrifuge enrichment program."
You can read it for yourself:
"http://edition.cnn.com/2003/US/03/07/ sprj.irq.un.transcript.elbaradei/index.html"
Practical Magic wrote:
> If they could hide things 12 years ago, why not a few months ago ?
---
True, but that's not what the link you provided was about.
It discussed the retrieval of a centrifuge from a rose bush in the garden by the person that buried it, awaiting instructions to begin a nuclear programme. Instructions that were never recieved in 12 years.
It also stressed that the USA are not suggesting it as evidence of existing WOMD.
It's nothing to do with currently existing or the suggestion of hidden weaponry.
> If they could hide things 12 years ago, why not a few months ago ?
---
True, but that's not what the link you provided was about.
It discussed the retrieval of a centrifuge from a rose bush in the garden by the person that buried it, awaiting instructions to begin a nuclear programme. Instructions that were never recieved in 12 years.
It also stressed that the USA are not suggesting it as evidence of existing WOMD.
It's nothing to do with currently existing or the suggestion of hidden weaponry.
Goatboy wrote:
> But, he adds, it will no doubt be used by defenders of the war in Iraq
> as proof that Saddam Hussein did indeed have something to hide -
> although it is not quite the smoking gun that the Americans have been
> hoping to find"
--
And I *believe* sagacious' comment about Korea was a j.o.k.e.
The point is, you provide a link saying "why would you hide that, eh?", when the point of the story was it was 12 years ago and proves nothing at all in regards to the current complete non-discovery of weapons of mass destruction.
Because there were never any. How do you know this Goatboy?
Well...all the intel, the radar shots, the intercepted transmissions, the satellite photographs of "suspected bomb sites" all proffered as reasons to go to war have yielded....nothing.
Wow, it's almost like the intel was laughable in the first place - hence the current investigation and admittance by Jack Straw that the 2nd dossier is an embarassment and should never have been presented to the government.
Besides, hiding it "under a rose bush" hardly gives the impression of a top-secret covert attempt to hide weapons does it?
> But, he adds, it will no doubt be used by defenders of the war in Iraq
> as proof that Saddam Hussein did indeed have something to hide -
> although it is not quite the smoking gun that the Americans have been
> hoping to find"
--
And I *believe* sagacious' comment about Korea was a j.o.k.e.
The point is, you provide a link saying "why would you hide that, eh?", when the point of the story was it was 12 years ago and proves nothing at all in regards to the current complete non-discovery of weapons of mass destruction.
Because there were never any. How do you know this Goatboy?
Well...all the intel, the radar shots, the intercepted transmissions, the satellite photographs of "suspected bomb sites" all proffered as reasons to go to war have yielded....nothing.
Wow, it's almost like the intel was laughable in the first place - hence the current investigation and admittance by Jack Straw that the 2nd dossier is an embarassment and should never have been presented to the government.
Besides, hiding it "under a rose bush" hardly gives the impression of a top-secret covert attempt to hide weapons does it?
The sagacious one wrote:
> We should take pre-emptive action and invade Korea.
North or South ? Any why bother, just embargo them, force them to act first so as to make retaliation easier.
Really, the story proves on thing - Iraq sought at some point to pursue a nuclear weapon.
If they could hide things 12 years ago, why not a few months ago ? The discovery was only made because of the scientist, so it is plausible that there are weapons still in Iraq waiting to be found.
> We should take pre-emptive action and invade Korea.
North or South ? Any why bother, just embargo them, force them to act first so as to make retaliation easier.
Really, the story proves on thing - Iraq sought at some point to pursue a nuclear weapon.
If they could hide things 12 years ago, why not a few months ago ? The discovery was only made because of the scientist, so it is plausible that there are weapons still in Iraq waiting to be found.
I bet they'll find a screwdriver soon and claim it could be used to screw screws into the armageddon obliterator device that the Iraqi's could assemble in under 48 decades.
We should take pre-emtptive action and invade Korea.
We should take pre-emtptive action and invade Korea.
And here's the same story from the BBC p.o.v:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3021612.stm
"US officials concede the discovery does not show that Iraq had an active nuclear weapons programme, the BBC's Ian Pannell in Washington says.
US authorities believe these statements are credible and provide evidence that Iraq was hiding information from UN inspectors, he says.
But, he adds, it will no doubt be used by defenders of the war in Iraq as proof that Saddam Hussein did indeed have something to hide - although it is not quite the smoking gun that the Americans have been hoping to find"
This is my favourite bit though:
"Located in two shipping containers, the trove of papers reportedly included instructions on how to hide materials and fool UN arms inspectors."
Instructions on how to hide materials and fool UN arms inspectors?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
"How to decieve the Western Pigbastards and hide our very bad things of death" by Omar Mullshakjeh.
"30 ways to dispose of massive bombs of destruction and evilness"
"10 things you didn't know about our deadly illegal poison bombs"
*shakes head*
This is turning into a Peter Cook sketch
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3021612.stm
"US officials concede the discovery does not show that Iraq had an active nuclear weapons programme, the BBC's Ian Pannell in Washington says.
US authorities believe these statements are credible and provide evidence that Iraq was hiding information from UN inspectors, he says.
But, he adds, it will no doubt be used by defenders of the war in Iraq as proof that Saddam Hussein did indeed have something to hide - although it is not quite the smoking gun that the Americans have been hoping to find"
This is my favourite bit though:
"Located in two shipping containers, the trove of papers reportedly included instructions on how to hide materials and fool UN arms inspectors."
Instructions on how to hide materials and fool UN arms inspectors?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
"How to decieve the Western Pigbastards and hide our very bad things of death" by Omar Mullshakjeh.
"30 ways to dispose of massive bombs of destruction and evilness"
"10 things you didn't know about our deadly illegal poison bombs"
*shakes head*
This is turning into a Peter Cook sketch
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