The "Freeola Customer Forum" forum, which includes Retro Game Reviews, has been archived and is now read-only. You cannot post here or create a new thread or review on this forum.
Bit of Philosophy for you
The Bible claims God is:
All powerful (omnipotent)
All knowing (omniscient)
All loving
everywhere at once (omnipresent)
However because of the existence of pain the bibles version of god can only be three of the four things.
either Gods not all powerful (eg. can't stop pain)
not all knowing (doesn't know how to stop all pain)
not all loving (he couldn't care less)
not everywhere at once (cannot get to everywhere pain is)
What do you reckon? I don't exactly believe in God but its an interesting discussion.
The Bible claims God is:
All powerful (omnipotent)
All knowing (omniscient)
All loving
everywhere at once (omnipresent)
However because of the existence of pain the bibles version of god can only be three of the four things.
either Gods not all powerful (eg. can't stop pain)
not all knowing (doesn't know how to stop all pain)
not all loving (he couldn't care less)
not everywhere at once (cannot get to everywhere pain is)
What do you reckon? I don't exactly believe in God but its an interesting discussion.
Page:
Hedfix wrote:
> Despite everthing that has been said and can be said, it boils down to
> belief. There is not enough conclusive proof for the existence of God,
> nor do we know enough to say God does not exist. It still biols down
> to belief whether your religious, agnostic or atheist.
If there were conclusive proof for Gods existence, he would cease to exist. It is an entity that exists only by faith. To have faith in something, one must have no proof that it is so. Having faith in something that one has proof for is like having faith in the existence of armchairs...
(With apologies to the HHGTTG)
> Despite everthing that has been said and can be said, it boils down to
> belief. There is not enough conclusive proof for the existence of God,
> nor do we know enough to say God does not exist. It still biols down
> to belief whether your religious, agnostic or atheist.
If there were conclusive proof for Gods existence, he would cease to exist. It is an entity that exists only by faith. To have faith in something, one must have no proof that it is so. Having faith in something that one has proof for is like having faith in the existence of armchairs...
(With apologies to the HHGTTG)
Garlic Bread!? wrote:
> If God is all knowing how come he didn't know the Devil was reponsible
> for the whole apple consumption problem that cost us our garden?
He did know.
> If God is all knowing how come he didn't know the Devil was reponsible
> for the whole apple consumption problem that cost us our garden?
He did know.
Despite everthing that has been said and can be said, it boils down to belief. There is not enough conclusive proof for the existence of God, nor do we know enough to say God does not exist. It still biols down to belief whether your religious, agnostic or atheist.
If God is all knowing how come he didn't know the Devil was reponsible for the whole apple consumption problem that cost us our garden?
God being omnipotent does not mean the world can not be bad. It means that there may be an external force that caused it. And that would be the Devil.
As for heaven and hell, neither in the shape or form the churches teach are actually like that. The word translated as hell in the bible comes from three different words. In the Old Testament it is the Hebrew word Sheol, which does not mean eternal torment but simly it is death. The common grave of dead mankind. Nothing more. Which is why in Genesis, Jacob a good guy who you would think would go to heaven, actually asks to be sent to hell.
The New Testament was in Greek, and the word that is translated as hell in it is Hades. This again just meant death. In a few places in the New Testament the word Gehenna, another Greek word was used. This comes from Gehenna which was a rubbish tip outside Jerusalem in the Valley of Hinnom. Dead animals would be thrown into the fires which were kept burning with the addition of Sulfur. Criminals who were considered unworthy of a proper burial were thrown into Gehenna. It symbolises eternal destruction, not fiery torment, because it was dead bodies that were thrown into the pit, hence there would be no suffering.
Another reason that the bible does not actually give rise to hell is found in Ecclesiastes. It says For the living are conscious that they will die, but the dead are conscious of nothing at all.
The bible does say that some would go to heaven, but this would be a very small number, 144000. For everyone else there is the prospect of resurrection after armageddon.
The bible is a book that will always be relevant. Everything it contains shows us how to lead better happier lives.
If there was no God, and evolution was real, then it would be survival of the fittest, and as such no-one should care about others. There would be no need for government or law and order. If evolution was the answer then we would, we should, be little more than the animals we supposedly evolved from.
Belief in God, even if you don't worship him, brings a little bit more sanity to the world. It gives life a meaning, something to look forward to. A real reason to live. Other than that we were all just an accident.
As for heaven and hell, neither in the shape or form the churches teach are actually like that. The word translated as hell in the bible comes from three different words. In the Old Testament it is the Hebrew word Sheol, which does not mean eternal torment but simly it is death. The common grave of dead mankind. Nothing more. Which is why in Genesis, Jacob a good guy who you would think would go to heaven, actually asks to be sent to hell.
The New Testament was in Greek, and the word that is translated as hell in it is Hades. This again just meant death. In a few places in the New Testament the word Gehenna, another Greek word was used. This comes from Gehenna which was a rubbish tip outside Jerusalem in the Valley of Hinnom. Dead animals would be thrown into the fires which were kept burning with the addition of Sulfur. Criminals who were considered unworthy of a proper burial were thrown into Gehenna. It symbolises eternal destruction, not fiery torment, because it was dead bodies that were thrown into the pit, hence there would be no suffering.
Another reason that the bible does not actually give rise to hell is found in Ecclesiastes. It says For the living are conscious that they will die, but the dead are conscious of nothing at all.
The bible does say that some would go to heaven, but this would be a very small number, 144000. For everyone else there is the prospect of resurrection after armageddon.
The bible is a book that will always be relevant. Everything it contains shows us how to lead better happier lives.
If there was no God, and evolution was real, then it would be survival of the fittest, and as such no-one should care about others. There would be no need for government or law and order. If evolution was the answer then we would, we should, be little more than the animals we supposedly evolved from.
Belief in God, even if you don't worship him, brings a little bit more sanity to the world. It gives life a meaning, something to look forward to. A real reason to live. Other than that we were all just an accident.
Heh. That may be harder, but it's usually more fun :^)
Dr Duck wrote:
> You're out of your depth? I'm falling back on time spent thinking and
> what I remember of Sophie's World :^)
You're only arguing against something, I'm trying to argue from a point of view that isn't even mine!
Tata.
> You're out of your depth? I'm falling back on time spent thinking and
> what I remember of Sophie's World :^)
You're only arguing against something, I'm trying to argue from a point of view that isn't even mine!
Tata.
BEARDS. wrote:
> Not if you're talking to fundamentalists
I try not to :^)
Ultimately though, it always seems to come down to the basic matter of belief in god and his work, fundamentalist or not. The only difference is whether the bible is still in tact at the point where blind faith comes in.
I think.
> Not if you're talking to fundamentalists
I try not to :^)
Ultimately though, it always seems to come down to the basic matter of belief in god and his work, fundamentalist or not. The only difference is whether the bible is still in tact at the point where blind faith comes in.
I think.
You're out of your depth? I'm falling back on time spent thinking and what I remember of Sophie's World :^)
I too could do with some sleep though, so I guess I better had...
Night
I too could do with some sleep though, so I guess I better had...
Night
Dr Duck wrote:
> Heh. It'd probably make for a shorter discussion though
Not if you're talking to fundamentalists, they argue against it by saying that the Bible clearly shows what God plans and states that evil exists, we are able to make correct decisions based upon it using the reason he has provided us with, anything else lacks "goodness" and hence is evil.
> Heh. It'd probably make for a shorter discussion though
Not if you're talking to fundamentalists, they argue against it by saying that the Bible clearly shows what God plans and states that evil exists, we are able to make correct decisions based upon it using the reason he has provided us with, anything else lacks "goodness" and hence is evil.
Page: