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Well I never believed it would have this much effect, when Nintendo announced the TRIFORCE arcade board I was never that excited, Arcade games were never my thing and I never honestly believed Nintendo would have anything to do with it. For those that don’t know what I’m on about the Triforce Arcade Board is an attempt to save the failing Arcade industry. The two major companies in the Arcade business is Namco and SEGA.
Namco’s arcade history has been a successful one, Time Crisis has always been a popular shooting game and Tekken is the daddy of Arcade beat ‘em ups along with Soul Calibur. SEGA’s Arcade library is a little more extensive, SEGA Rally is the biggest driving game in the arcade industry, House of the Dead is the most popular shooter, Crazy Taxi has inspired many to new heights, Virtual Fighter is on par with Namco’s Tekken, Virtual Striker is the only successful Arcade football game and Super Monkey Ball is brilliant beyond comparison. Meanwhile Nintendo are not part of the Arcade industry, they don’t make arcade games they concentrate on the home market. So when Triforce was announced (Triforce is the name of the main item in Zelda, the item is 3 powers combined in this case Namco, Nintendo and SEGA) I believed Nintendo would supply the technology as the board is based on Gamecube hardware and the other two would develop games. This made me hope that relationships between Nintendo and those two massive third party developers would improve with maybe Crazy Taxi 3, Jet Set Radio Future, House of the Dead 3, Tekken 4 and Time Crisis 2 coming to the Gamecube. Other than that very small hope I didn’t expect much and so basically I read it shrugged my shoulders and moved away. Well now I realize that the TRIFORCE Arcade board has a much larger effect than I initially thought.
When Namco announced Soul Calibur 2 on the arcade’s wont be using TRIFORCE I began to wonder what the two companies were working on and if they will be coming to the Cube. SEGA were the first to reveal the game they were working on, in fact two of them and I was shocked at what it was. F Zero is a massive Nintendo title, appearing on all Nintendo consoles released since the SNES accept the Gameboy Color. Main star Captain Falcon appeared in Smash Brothers that soon led to a successful run on the Gameboy Advance, soon after Captain Falcon reappeared in the sequel to Smash Brothers with his very own track. Surly Nintendo would want to beat Wipeout Fusion with a new F Zero title; it seemed so likely magazines even put the game on the release list. But no one predicted that SEGA would be the one heading the title, for both the Gamecube and the Arcades using Triforce. Amusement Vision (makers of Super Monkey Ball and Virtual Striker) are the SEGA team in charge of the F Zero GC (GameCube) and F Zero AC (arcade) games. With promised interactivity between the Gamecube and Arcade versions via memory cards I realized that the TRIFORCE arcade board isn’t as uninteresting as it first thought.
So what are Namco working on then, one of their own titles like Tekken or Ridge Racer or one of Nintendo’s own. Well I should have seen it coming, the best style of game Nintendo have other than F Zero for the Arcade’s are Mario Kart and Starfox and Starfox is the closest to F Zero. But with RARE developing Starfox Adventures it didn’t seem likely especially with space scenes occurring within it keeping with the normal Starfox theme. How wrong were we, a few days ago rumors spread that Nintendo are working with Namco on a new Starfox game for both the Arcade and the Gamecube and it suddenly became obvious. And today it is confirmed, Namco are indeed working on Starfox with a release of a poster (and the announcement of other new titles including a Gamecube racer (like Ridge Racer), an RPG and a Tales series title) the game will be a space shooter in a similar style to the N64 original. Starfox first appeared on the Super Nintendo in a game called Starfox, it used the new 3D style graphics also used in F Zero on the SNES, it was re-released early on in the N64’s life, better graphics, more levels, different weapons and a multiplayer mode made it an excellent N64 title developed by Zelda and Mario creator Shiguru Miyamoto. Starfox leaped out of his ship in an attempt to save Dinosaur Planet from General Scales in Rare’s upcoming adventure Starfox Adventures, whether Namco’s version is another update of the original or an entire new adventure is yet to be seen but whatever it is, it is sure to be great.
So Nintendo’s involvement in the TRIFORCE is a lot more than the hardware, in fact the only games using it at the moment are Nintendo branded products. SEGA has always had a close relationship with Nintendo both Sonic Team and Amusement Vision has been releasing exclusives for the Gamecube (AM2’s recent exclusive announcements for Virtual Fighter RPG and Beach Spikers also shows support from them) and this is set to bring the two giants closer together. Namco and Nintendo had a shady past on the N64 but now with joint games and many announcements (already more than N64) Nintendo’s attempt to work closer with 3rd party developers is proving to be successful.
Here’s to the future
Dringo.
Namco’s arcade history has been a successful one, Time Crisis has always been a popular shooting game and Tekken is the daddy of Arcade beat ‘em ups along with Soul Calibur. SEGA’s Arcade library is a little more extensive, SEGA Rally is the biggest driving game in the arcade industry, House of the Dead is the most popular shooter, Crazy Taxi has inspired many to new heights, Virtual Fighter is on par with Namco’s Tekken, Virtual Striker is the only successful Arcade football game and Super Monkey Ball is brilliant beyond comparison. Meanwhile Nintendo are not part of the Arcade industry, they don’t make arcade games they concentrate on the home market. So when Triforce was announced (Triforce is the name of the main item in Zelda, the item is 3 powers combined in this case Namco, Nintendo and SEGA) I believed Nintendo would supply the technology as the board is based on Gamecube hardware and the other two would develop games. This made me hope that relationships between Nintendo and those two massive third party developers would improve with maybe Crazy Taxi 3, Jet Set Radio Future, House of the Dead 3, Tekken 4 and Time Crisis 2 coming to the Gamecube. Other than that very small hope I didn’t expect much and so basically I read it shrugged my shoulders and moved away. Well now I realize that the TRIFORCE Arcade board has a much larger effect than I initially thought.
When Namco announced Soul Calibur 2 on the arcade’s wont be using TRIFORCE I began to wonder what the two companies were working on and if they will be coming to the Cube. SEGA were the first to reveal the game they were working on, in fact two of them and I was shocked at what it was. F Zero is a massive Nintendo title, appearing on all Nintendo consoles released since the SNES accept the Gameboy Color. Main star Captain Falcon appeared in Smash Brothers that soon led to a successful run on the Gameboy Advance, soon after Captain Falcon reappeared in the sequel to Smash Brothers with his very own track. Surly Nintendo would want to beat Wipeout Fusion with a new F Zero title; it seemed so likely magazines even put the game on the release list. But no one predicted that SEGA would be the one heading the title, for both the Gamecube and the Arcades using Triforce. Amusement Vision (makers of Super Monkey Ball and Virtual Striker) are the SEGA team in charge of the F Zero GC (GameCube) and F Zero AC (arcade) games. With promised interactivity between the Gamecube and Arcade versions via memory cards I realized that the TRIFORCE arcade board isn’t as uninteresting as it first thought.
So what are Namco working on then, one of their own titles like Tekken or Ridge Racer or one of Nintendo’s own. Well I should have seen it coming, the best style of game Nintendo have other than F Zero for the Arcade’s are Mario Kart and Starfox and Starfox is the closest to F Zero. But with RARE developing Starfox Adventures it didn’t seem likely especially with space scenes occurring within it keeping with the normal Starfox theme. How wrong were we, a few days ago rumors spread that Nintendo are working with Namco on a new Starfox game for both the Arcade and the Gamecube and it suddenly became obvious. And today it is confirmed, Namco are indeed working on Starfox with a release of a poster (and the announcement of other new titles including a Gamecube racer (like Ridge Racer), an RPG and a Tales series title) the game will be a space shooter in a similar style to the N64 original. Starfox first appeared on the Super Nintendo in a game called Starfox, it used the new 3D style graphics also used in F Zero on the SNES, it was re-released early on in the N64’s life, better graphics, more levels, different weapons and a multiplayer mode made it an excellent N64 title developed by Zelda and Mario creator Shiguru Miyamoto. Starfox leaped out of his ship in an attempt to save Dinosaur Planet from General Scales in Rare’s upcoming adventure Starfox Adventures, whether Namco’s version is another update of the original or an entire new adventure is yet to be seen but whatever it is, it is sure to be great.
So Nintendo’s involvement in the TRIFORCE is a lot more than the hardware, in fact the only games using it at the moment are Nintendo branded products. SEGA has always had a close relationship with Nintendo both Sonic Team and Amusement Vision has been releasing exclusives for the Gamecube (AM2’s recent exclusive announcements for Virtual Fighter RPG and Beach Spikers also shows support from them) and this is set to bring the two giants closer together. Namco and Nintendo had a shady past on the N64 but now with joint games and many announcements (already more than N64) Nintendo’s attempt to work closer with 3rd party developers is proving to be successful.
Here’s to the future
Dringo.
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You've gone way off the point Sonic, I'm ending this. Working on Triforce is like working on CUBE so EASY!!!! And even if Namco are working on merley a few games to start off with there will be more as their relationship with Ninty grows.
Now find another topic to reply to over a different matter.
Now find another topic to reply to over a different matter.
Edgy, of course the Fzero AC will be different to the GC version like you say... obviosly the GC version will have more modes, more in depth play and greater length.
However, this is of little relevance. All the AC version will be is a cut down version of the GC game. Either way, we won't see it in this country anyway.
As for games being developed for the GC that wouldn't have been developed if the Triforce didn't exist...
There are only two developers who make more than a handful of arcade games a year (and only a dozen that make a handful of arcade games). Clearly the developers who make only a few arcade games a year (3 or 4) are unlikely to change over to the Triforce because they will have to build up experience from ground zero. The fact that these companies make so few game a year shows that they don't have the resources to bother with this.
So, if any new games do appear on GC architecture that wouldn't have been made anyway, it will be from Sega or Namco. However, as Dringo pointed out, Sega and Namco approached Nintendo over creating the Triforce. Obviously this is because both companies have games they are making for the GC, and wish to also release these in the arcade- why else would they approach ninty?
Sonic
However, this is of little relevance. All the AC version will be is a cut down version of the GC game. Either way, we won't see it in this country anyway.
As for games being developed for the GC that wouldn't have been developed if the Triforce didn't exist...
There are only two developers who make more than a handful of arcade games a year (and only a dozen that make a handful of arcade games). Clearly the developers who make only a few arcade games a year (3 or 4) are unlikely to change over to the Triforce because they will have to build up experience from ground zero. The fact that these companies make so few game a year shows that they don't have the resources to bother with this.
So, if any new games do appear on GC architecture that wouldn't have been made anyway, it will be from Sega or Namco. However, as Dringo pointed out, Sega and Namco approached Nintendo over creating the Triforce. Obviously this is because both companies have games they are making for the GC, and wish to also release these in the arcade- why else would they approach ninty?
Sonic
There we go Edgy got it in a nutshell.
===SONICRAV---> wrote:
> Dringo, thank you for contradicting yourself, and proving my
> point...
>
> "Oh and the fact is these games are different, they aren't arcade
> games with the intention of a console release, but a console games
> with the intention of arcade release. "
>
> So, what you're saying is that the games that will appear on Troforce
> are console games... which is what I've been saying for the last few
> posts!
>
Not necessarily. From what I've read, F-Zero AC is a different game to F-Zero GC, hence not a direct port from the Arcade the GameCube or vice versa.
> There won't be any new games developed that wouldn't have appeared on
> the GC anyway!
>
You don't know that, and that's fact.
> "The fact is if Triforce does prove incredible to use then Tekken
> arcade games along with Time crisis will start appearing on them and
> these are two major Namco series of games not on the Gamecube...
> yet."
>
>
> But you just said that the games will be console games that will get
> arcade releases! Tekken is developed as being a PS2 game, and hence
> will get released on the 246. Namco won't go, "Oh! The Triforce
> is soooo easy to use that we'll NOT makie it on the infintely better
> selling PS2 format- we'll adopt that GC!".
>
> Sonic
Ah, but the fact that Namco is in the Triforce deal means that it's up to Namco to decide. According to most developers who commented, it's easy to port a Playstation 2 game to the GameCube. So developing for the PS2 does not mean it takes too much more effort to transfer the games to GameCube compatable software. It is likely that for the short term, Nintendo's own franchises will be developed as AC-version titles, however there is still room for Namco and Sega to develop their own titles.
> Dringo, thank you for contradicting yourself, and proving my
> point...
>
> "Oh and the fact is these games are different, they aren't arcade
> games with the intention of a console release, but a console games
> with the intention of arcade release. "
>
> So, what you're saying is that the games that will appear on Troforce
> are console games... which is what I've been saying for the last few
> posts!
>
Not necessarily. From what I've read, F-Zero AC is a different game to F-Zero GC, hence not a direct port from the Arcade the GameCube or vice versa.
> There won't be any new games developed that wouldn't have appeared on
> the GC anyway!
>
You don't know that, and that's fact.
> "The fact is if Triforce does prove incredible to use then Tekken
> arcade games along with Time crisis will start appearing on them and
> these are two major Namco series of games not on the Gamecube...
> yet."
>
>
> But you just said that the games will be console games that will get
> arcade releases! Tekken is developed as being a PS2 game, and hence
> will get released on the 246. Namco won't go, "Oh! The Triforce
> is soooo easy to use that we'll NOT makie it on the infintely better
> selling PS2 format- we'll adopt that GC!".
>
> Sonic
Ah, but the fact that Namco is in the Triforce deal means that it's up to Namco to decide. According to most developers who commented, it's easy to port a Playstation 2 game to the GameCube. So developing for the PS2 does not mean it takes too much more effort to transfer the games to GameCube compatable software. It is likely that for the short term, Nintendo's own franchises will be developed as AC-version titles, however there is still room for Namco and Sega to develop their own titles.
===SONICRAV---> wrote:
> Dringo, you seem to be going completely off the thread. This is about
> the Triforce ARCADE board. What has that got to do with Sony
> controlling console game prices?
Your the one going off thread, that was going woith your claim about Tekken not appearing on cube.
> Dringo, you seem to be going completely off the thread. This is about
> the Triforce ARCADE board. What has that got to do with Sony
> controlling console game prices?
Your the one going off thread, that was going woith your claim about Tekken not appearing on cube.
Strafex wrote:
> I didn't say stop making games for the PS2, I said stop making games
> on the PS2 based arcade board.
>
> The PS2 would still get a conversion, just like the Gamecube is
> getting conversions from the PS2 and Dreamcast board, but the game
> would sort of be tailored to Gamecube architecture.
>
> Is there no possible way that could happen whatsoever?
Ah, but shy would Namco make the game on the GC arcade board, stick it on the GC, and then port to the GC? Tekken will sell far far more copies on the PS2 than the GC (if only becuase there are more PS2s out there). So, they'll contimue to make the PS2 version first, and then consider whether to bother with a GC port.
And remember, Namco have just pumped loads of money into undating the System 246 arcade board- the PS2 based board that they make. Do you really think they'd do that if they were going to use less of the PS2 board?
Dringo, you seem to be going completely off the thread. This is about the Triforce ARCADE board. What has that got to do with Sony controlling console game prices?
Sonic
> I didn't say stop making games for the PS2, I said stop making games
> on the PS2 based arcade board.
>
> The PS2 would still get a conversion, just like the Gamecube is
> getting conversions from the PS2 and Dreamcast board, but the game
> would sort of be tailored to Gamecube architecture.
>
> Is there no possible way that could happen whatsoever?
Ah, but shy would Namco make the game on the GC arcade board, stick it on the GC, and then port to the GC? Tekken will sell far far more copies on the PS2 than the GC (if only becuase there are more PS2s out there). So, they'll contimue to make the PS2 version first, and then consider whether to bother with a GC port.
And remember, Namco have just pumped loads of money into undating the System 246 arcade board- the PS2 based board that they make. Do you really think they'd do that if they were going to use less of the PS2 board?
Dringo, you seem to be going completely off the thread. This is about the Triforce ARCADE board. What has that got to do with Sony controlling console game prices?
Sonic
===SONICRAV---> wrote:
> After all, that's Dringo's argument.
You seem to think my post is argumentative, it isn't the Triforce has encouraged more friendly developer ties with Nintendo with great games coming out, and for some unknown reason your doing a Turbonutter and beginning on a different argument altogether which im strugling to follow as i havent a clue why your going on about this!
But more to your point, you said:
"Oh! The Triforce is soooo easy to use that we'll NOT makie it on the infintely better selling PS2 format- we'll adopt that GC!".
So you somehow managed to read me say stop making Tekken games for PS2 somewhere did you? Your right about one thing it is about money and that is why major games should go multi-format. When Nintendo ruled they dictated prices of carts etc... and companies didn't make much profit and they had no where else to go. Sony can do the same, they can up the price of DVD's and developers profits will decrease, by making games for the Gamecube the cube will increase in sales. With this happening there will be a lot more competition and so prices of the formats be it optical disc or DVD's will go down in turn making further profit.
Fear that Sony will soon dictate prices is why more games are going multi-format and with the Triforce arcade board it won't be hard to make an arcade tekken game and bring it to the cube.
> After all, that's Dringo's argument.
You seem to think my post is argumentative, it isn't the Triforce has encouraged more friendly developer ties with Nintendo with great games coming out, and for some unknown reason your doing a Turbonutter and beginning on a different argument altogether which im strugling to follow as i havent a clue why your going on about this!
But more to your point, you said:
"Oh! The Triforce is soooo easy to use that we'll NOT makie it on the infintely better selling PS2 format- we'll adopt that GC!".
So you somehow managed to read me say stop making Tekken games for PS2 somewhere did you? Your right about one thing it is about money and that is why major games should go multi-format. When Nintendo ruled they dictated prices of carts etc... and companies didn't make much profit and they had no where else to go. Sony can do the same, they can up the price of DVD's and developers profits will decrease, by making games for the Gamecube the cube will increase in sales. With this happening there will be a lot more competition and so prices of the formats be it optical disc or DVD's will go down in turn making further profit.
Fear that Sony will soon dictate prices is why more games are going multi-format and with the Triforce arcade board it won't be hard to make an arcade tekken game and bring it to the cube.
I didn't say stop making games for the PS2, I said stop making games on the PS2 based arcade board.
The PS2 would still get a conversion, just like the Gamecube is getting conversions from the PS2 and Dreamcast board, but the game would sort of be tailored to Gamecube architecture.
Is there no possible way that could happen whatsoever?
The PS2 would still get a conversion, just like the Gamecube is getting conversions from the PS2 and Dreamcast board, but the game would sort of be tailored to Gamecube architecture.
Is there no possible way that could happen whatsoever?
Strafex, I don't think it is possible in any way...
The reason is simply this: developers are in the business to make money. Games made for the PS2 make far more money than the GC. Developers won't make games for the GC because it's developer friendly, and thus neglect the bigger profit margins on the PS2!
And remember, there are only 2 arcade game developers in the world anyway: Sega and Namco. (Dringo, Konami make how many arcade games a year? They had about 3 at JAMMA last year...)
So, how will developers who have nothing to do with arcade development find out about the GCs development ease from the Triforce if they don't use it.
After all, that's Dringo's argument.
The reason is simply this: developers are in the business to make money. Games made for the PS2 make far more money than the GC. Developers won't make games for the GC because it's developer friendly, and thus neglect the bigger profit margins on the PS2!
And remember, there are only 2 arcade game developers in the world anyway: Sega and Namco. (Dringo, Konami make how many arcade games a year? They had about 3 at JAMMA last year...)
So, how will developers who have nothing to do with arcade development find out about the GCs development ease from the Triforce if they don't use it.
After all, that's Dringo's argument.
I think that in the early stages it'll be like Sonic said, GC projects given an arcade version.
But, as devellopers get to grips with the board, they might well come to like it and be encouraged to make more of their titles on it.
The GC hardware not only outpowers the PS2, it's supposedly a lot more develloper friendly too. That might possibly encourage arcade gamer devellopers to prioritise it's use.
If so, the PS2 will still get conversions of the "non-Nintendo-exclusive" projects, but the Gamecube will get the fastest and most faithful conversions.
I'm not saying that it'll definately happen, but it's got to be possible, hasn't it?
But, as devellopers get to grips with the board, they might well come to like it and be encouraged to make more of their titles on it.
The GC hardware not only outpowers the PS2, it's supposedly a lot more develloper friendly too. That might possibly encourage arcade gamer devellopers to prioritise it's use.
If so, the PS2 will still get conversions of the "non-Nintendo-exclusive" projects, but the Gamecube will get the fastest and most faithful conversions.
I'm not saying that it'll definately happen, but it's got to be possible, hasn't it?
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