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Thu 24/10/02 at 23:04
Regular
Posts: 787
I am a pro console war person, I love nothing better than to argue with a fellow gamer of which console offers the best goods etc… yet there are certain variations in the way people argue that I really dislike. Now I have recently discovered a new console war fairground, the opposition console’s forum (in my case PS2 and X-box), and the majority of the opposition use facts and figures told to them by PS2 or X-box magazines/websites. In other words the majority of you lot listen to the Nintendo bashing PR (just as I hear X-box and PS2 bashing PR) all your websites and magazines subject you too, and I hate it.

There’s nothing wrong with disliking lets say the Gamecube for one reason or the other yet you’ll try and attack it for numerous reasons. When and X-box fan for example begins to criticize the Gamecube they can only do it via what they know, and being an X-box fan means that in the case of the Gamecube, not a lot. So where do these said people get their information? Yep the X-box websites and magazines, filled with as much negative Nintendo PR as possible. Lets take for example the release of Super Mario Sunshine, if someone criticizes it, which one or two people have done then an X-box website will claim the game was a major disappointment yet fail to mention from one persons point of view (as opposed to the millions that loved it). Another point about Mario Sunshine is the sales, as regards Europe websites and magazines are reporting that despite the release of Nintendo’s biggest title of the year Microsoft has in fact managed to close the gap between the two. Yet this website would fail to mention that Microsoft had in fact cut the price of the X-box just a month before hand and that Microsoft had hoped to be far ahead of Nintendo sales wise because of it, not to still be struggling behind Nintendo. And they also fail to point out that Microsoft is aiming at the same market as Sony, the bulk young teenager – adult market as opposed to Nintendo’s younger generations and specialist gamer market. The fact that Microsoft are behind Nintendo be it for the time being or not is an utter disaster because Microsoft are being trounced by their only real rival that is the Playstation 2. Yet I can’t just criticize X-box websites etc… Nintendo ones are just as bad. As regarding Mario Sunshine Nintendo websites reported that Super Mario Sunshine had sold more in its first two weeks than Microsoft’s biggest selling game Halo, Playstation 2’s biggest selling game GTA 3 and Mario 64 on the N64. Yet what they fail to point out that, despite being true, Halo hasn’t been around since the early 1980’s and that in its first two weeks it didn’t have a very large user base, as it was a launch title (the same point can be made about Mario 64). Also it failed to mention that GTA 3’s hype didn’t really get going until after its launch.

And this is why you have to be careful because when you say something you know to be true there is a spin on it you’ll, nine times out of ten, fail to realize. Naturally some companies are far better at PR than others namely Microsoft and Sony are good whilst Nintendo are bad. The Internet is a great example of this, whilst Sony have claimed they have many online plans and Microsoft are screaming about the X-box live idea, Nintendo aren’t saying a word. Many believe Nintendo are sitting and waiting, well that isn’t true because Nintendo aren’t that stupid. Nintendo are developing online titles but they won’t be ready for sometime so Nintendo aren’t saying a word, the rumor of Pokémonline and Mario Kart online proves that Nintendo have just as much potential as Microsoft in the online end with extremely promising software yet what are Nintendo’s PR people doing to reassure us that online plans are in the works? Absolutely nothing and that is one example of Nintendo’s disability at doing good PR. Another example involves system statistics. Both Microsoft and Sony confirmed they could shift X amount of polygons, this can only be done though in a cut scene when nothing else is moving in the background just the single character. Nintendo meanwhile stated they could shift Y many polygons when hundreds of other things such as motion blur, flying birds, moving scenery and characters were on the screen at the same time. Nintendo have failed to realize that they really needed to play up the Gamecube’s specs a bit more.

Specifications bring me onto yet another point about arguments; do not use specifications to argue against your friends. Yes the X-box has higher specs than the rest but they don’t have the flipper chip (yawn), something that enables ‘special effects’ like motion blur, heat haze and transparency to be implemented with the up most realism and incredibly easy. So who really cares that the Gamecube can’t push quite as many polygons? By saying that your console is the most powerful you will find that your opponent (if not me) will chip in with the flipper chip (no pun intended) fact. There are many points that need to be avoided when entering an argument, other than system specifications another is a list. Why oh why when entering an argument do we list the best and most promising games? Why as far as I’m concerned you could stuff all your ‘thirty promising titles’ up your **** and give me one Zelda game any day. Which leads me onto my fundamental point, Nintendo fans like Nintendo games. You can release 300 10/10 Halo sequels yet a Nintendo fan would rather settle for one Mario game every six years. And if you are listing games to see who has the most promising titles then that are equally pointless, are you honestly telling me Buffy The Vampire Slayer has the capability to cancel out Zelda?

When arguing you need to remember, your opponent knows his console better than you do no matter how much you insist he doesn’t. You also need to be skeptical when it comes to what popular websites and magazines tell you. For example did you know EDGE magazine rates Capcom Vs. SNK EO a really low mark because they didn’t like the new control system, yet there was an option to revert it to the old one and goes to show that even the ‘experts’ talk crap. And finally respect the fact that Nintendo fans like Nintendo because they love games like Mario and Zelda, no matter how much you think Halo is a better game.

And then let the wars commence.

Dringo.
Fri 25/10/02 at 00:10
Regular
"Oi you- sort it out"
Posts: 2,969
Savatt wrote:
> So while we're discussing a game such as Blinx in here, we really have no interest in hearing Ninties whine on about how Mario Sunshine poos all over it from a great height and is made by lovely wonderful wish they were our grandad Nintendo.

For some reason that is really really funny.
Fri 25/10/02 at 00:04
Regular
"ATAT Supremo"
Posts: 6,238
A nicely written post Dringo, but that end bit gets my back up because its not the X-Box forum posters that go into your forum dictating that your console is crap and answer every topic that covers a promising Gamecube game with replies such as "yes, but X-Box..."

We don't give a flying toss about Gamecube basically. So while we're discussing a game such as Blinx in here, we really have no interest in hearing Ninties whine on about how Mario Sunshine poos all over it from a great height and is made by lovely wonderful wish they were our grandad Nintendo.

Of course these forums are a place to discuss, but theres a thin line between using this forum as a place of discussion and using it as a fanboy slating ground.

Personally, I don't care what X-Box mags say about the Gamecube, as far as I know, they've never really slated the Gamecube. All my opinions come from my experiences with consoles, not other people of mags.
I bought a Gamecube and got a taste of its games in titles such as Luigi's Mansion, Rogue Leader, Bloody Roar, Monkey Ball and Wave Race.
As I played the games more and more, I formed an opinion of the console and found it to be not as enticing as the X-Box games I'd been playing.

Same thing goes for the graphics, etc. Gamecube can do some nice stuff, but I can still see the difference between the X-Box and Gamecube without the help of stats. I've seen footage of games such as Zelda and Metroid Prime and there really isn't anything in them that makes my jaw drop in awe as I've seen better on the X-Box.

Overall, the Gamecube is bound to have sold more than the X-Box even with a 2 month difference in release because Nintendo has a fan base that will always buy new Nintendo consoles, whereas Microsoft are just starting out and are having to attract people over to the X-Box.
I don't think Microsoft are doing too badly considering they're the new boys coming into the console industry. They might be doing badly in Japan, but from what I hear they're number 1 in Australia, doing excellent in the States and doing increasingly well over here.

As far as effort into their console goes, I don't think anyone could do anymore than what Microsoft are doing to make the games player happy.
They have a $2 billion online plan, they've signed up Rare, they have an excellent games line up which they are always trying to expand to offer games in all genres, the console is very developer friendly, they've done a couple of price drops and they've added all kinds of potential to the console such as using your own music in games and saving things to the console's hard drive (along with what else it can do).
When people moaned about the controller, they even designed a new smaller one to give players another option.

Of course as at least everyone in here knows, Microsoft could do a million things and certain elements of people will still hate the X-Box purely because they're scared of it overtaking the precious company they love wether its Nintendo or Sony.
I'm not saying everyone should give in and buy X-Box, but plenty of people will always spend plenty of time desperately looking for something new to moan about with the X-Box.
The price being one of the more famous ones - one minute a poster on here would be like "god, Microsoft won't sell that stupid X-Box until its cheaper than £300 - I wouldn't even consider a purchase until its nearly half the price."
Microsoft bring down the price and sure enough that same poster would be in here ranting "hur, hur - the X-Box has gone down in price, that means its dying and everyone is going to think that !"

At the end of the day, people in here will protect the X-Box because they enjoy the console and their arguements are no less plausible than what Ninties come in here ranting about.
Of course there are some Ninties that seem to think that defending the X-Box makes someone a fanboy while they're allowed to verbally kick the crap out of it in the name of Gamecube and this makes them a hardcore gamer.
Thu 24/10/02 at 23:11
Posts: 11,652
to be honest i never read any of the long posts, i hate reading long things, i like short funny things, (dont say my pe***) but im shore what you have wrote is good...
Thu 24/10/02 at 23:04
Regular
Posts: 18,185
I am a pro console war person, I love nothing better than to argue with a fellow gamer of which console offers the best goods etc… yet there are certain variations in the way people argue that I really dislike. Now I have recently discovered a new console war fairground, the opposition console’s forum (in my case PS2 and X-box), and the majority of the opposition use facts and figures told to them by PS2 or X-box magazines/websites. In other words the majority of you lot listen to the Nintendo bashing PR (just as I hear X-box and PS2 bashing PR) all your websites and magazines subject you too, and I hate it.

There’s nothing wrong with disliking lets say the Gamecube for one reason or the other yet you’ll try and attack it for numerous reasons. When and X-box fan for example begins to criticize the Gamecube they can only do it via what they know, and being an X-box fan means that in the case of the Gamecube, not a lot. So where do these said people get their information? Yep the X-box websites and magazines, filled with as much negative Nintendo PR as possible. Lets take for example the release of Super Mario Sunshine, if someone criticizes it, which one or two people have done then an X-box website will claim the game was a major disappointment yet fail to mention from one persons point of view (as opposed to the millions that loved it). Another point about Mario Sunshine is the sales, as regards Europe websites and magazines are reporting that despite the release of Nintendo’s biggest title of the year Microsoft has in fact managed to close the gap between the two. Yet this website would fail to mention that Microsoft had in fact cut the price of the X-box just a month before hand and that Microsoft had hoped to be far ahead of Nintendo sales wise because of it, not to still be struggling behind Nintendo. And they also fail to point out that Microsoft is aiming at the same market as Sony, the bulk young teenager – adult market as opposed to Nintendo’s younger generations and specialist gamer market. The fact that Microsoft are behind Nintendo be it for the time being or not is an utter disaster because Microsoft are being trounced by their only real rival that is the Playstation 2. Yet I can’t just criticize X-box websites etc… Nintendo ones are just as bad. As regarding Mario Sunshine Nintendo websites reported that Super Mario Sunshine had sold more in its first two weeks than Microsoft’s biggest selling game Halo, Playstation 2’s biggest selling game GTA 3 and Mario 64 on the N64. Yet what they fail to point out that, despite being true, Halo hasn’t been around since the early 1980’s and that in its first two weeks it didn’t have a very large user base, as it was a launch title (the same point can be made about Mario 64). Also it failed to mention that GTA 3’s hype didn’t really get going until after its launch.

And this is why you have to be careful because when you say something you know to be true there is a spin on it you’ll, nine times out of ten, fail to realize. Naturally some companies are far better at PR than others namely Microsoft and Sony are good whilst Nintendo are bad. The Internet is a great example of this, whilst Sony have claimed they have many online plans and Microsoft are screaming about the X-box live idea, Nintendo aren’t saying a word. Many believe Nintendo are sitting and waiting, well that isn’t true because Nintendo aren’t that stupid. Nintendo are developing online titles but they won’t be ready for sometime so Nintendo aren’t saying a word, the rumor of Pokémonline and Mario Kart online proves that Nintendo have just as much potential as Microsoft in the online end with extremely promising software yet what are Nintendo’s PR people doing to reassure us that online plans are in the works? Absolutely nothing and that is one example of Nintendo’s disability at doing good PR. Another example involves system statistics. Both Microsoft and Sony confirmed they could shift X amount of polygons, this can only be done though in a cut scene when nothing else is moving in the background just the single character. Nintendo meanwhile stated they could shift Y many polygons when hundreds of other things such as motion blur, flying birds, moving scenery and characters were on the screen at the same time. Nintendo have failed to realize that they really needed to play up the Gamecube’s specs a bit more.

Specifications bring me onto yet another point about arguments; do not use specifications to argue against your friends. Yes the X-box has higher specs than the rest but they don’t have the flipper chip (yawn), something that enables ‘special effects’ like motion blur, heat haze and transparency to be implemented with the up most realism and incredibly easy. So who really cares that the Gamecube can’t push quite as many polygons? By saying that your console is the most powerful you will find that your opponent (if not me) will chip in with the flipper chip (no pun intended) fact. There are many points that need to be avoided when entering an argument, other than system specifications another is a list. Why oh why when entering an argument do we list the best and most promising games? Why as far as I’m concerned you could stuff all your ‘thirty promising titles’ up your **** and give me one Zelda game any day. Which leads me onto my fundamental point, Nintendo fans like Nintendo games. You can release 300 10/10 Halo sequels yet a Nintendo fan would rather settle for one Mario game every six years. And if you are listing games to see who has the most promising titles then that are equally pointless, are you honestly telling me Buffy The Vampire Slayer has the capability to cancel out Zelda?

When arguing you need to remember, your opponent knows his console better than you do no matter how much you insist he doesn’t. You also need to be skeptical when it comes to what popular websites and magazines tell you. For example did you know EDGE magazine rates Capcom Vs. SNK EO a really low mark because they didn’t like the new control system, yet there was an option to revert it to the old one and goes to show that even the ‘experts’ talk crap. And finally respect the fact that Nintendo fans like Nintendo because they love games like Mario and Zelda, no matter how much you think Halo is a better game.

And then let the wars commence.

Dringo.

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