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I've just read one of the most fascinating articles on IGN.
The reason it did was because it was staring me straight in the face, a concept developing in my mind and there it was. The entire problem surrounding Nintendo's fall from grace. In a collection of words on a page.
It started to play on my mind when the latest DS title was announced. Super Princess Peach, a tongue in cheek role reversal of Nintendo's classic Mario franchise. The game could well be an innovative and enjoyable new franchise. But it isn't. Not really. Instead it is placed along Nintendo's other DS franchises. These are Animal Crossing DS, Wario Ware DS, Mario Kart DS, Mario Brothers DS, Mario 64 DS, Metroid Prime: Hunters, four swords, Pokemon Dash, Yoshi's Touch and go... and so forth.
All of the above titles try to use (and probably succeed) a new and original form of gameplay. Yet they all, every one of them, share a common issue. They are all established Nintendo franchises. Why could Nintendo not call "Yoshi's Touch and Go" something totally different and remove Mario and Yoshi. Introduce a few new characters. Suddenly a new world is born, suddenly a new franchise is born... Yoshi and Mario could help the game to sell well but... we will never truly know.
It is funny how Nintendo are trying to release the most innovative game system ever... and yet they have not got one original game in the line up. SEGA's XY/XX feel the magic, is in fact the only game I see that isn't a new breed of an old franchise.
You see I, you and the legions of avid Nintendo followers love Nintendo for Mario, for Pokemon and for Zelda. So Nintendo continue to keep their forever falling fan base happy with new iterations of Mario and Zelda. Yet by not making a new "Mario" or a new "Pokemon" how can Nintendo ever hope to expand their fan base?
Metroid Prime was Nintendo "re-inventing" the Metroid brand. It was clever and the game is genius. Introducing the gaming world to something totally new. So why Metroid? Strafio, a massive Metroid fan from these very forums, still craves for a third person action platformer. Was it beyond Nintendo's capacity to make this? This would have satisfied the fan base. And what of Metroid Prime? Well did we have to have Samus in it? Did it have to be based around the Metroid universe?
Sure, Metroid Prime may not have sold as much if Samus and his enemies were not part of the game. And yet I feel we could have seen the birth of a brand new killer Nintendo franchise. Metroid could take the crown from Tomb Raider in the action platform sides of things. Whilst this new innovative First Person Adventure from Nintendo will make Perfect Dark a distant memory.
I shall present Zelda as my next example. A perfectly lovely realistic Zelda would have kept all Nintendo gamers happy. But the Wind Waker ruled did it not? The Wind Waker was a great new addition to the series. Yet why did it have to be Zelda? Could we not have seen a new adventure title from Nintendo? Even an RPG game! A cartoon RPG is a good idea (Namco did it). It did not have to be Zelda. It could have been a different game. A whole new series of Nintendo titles. Maybe next year we'd have the cel-shaded new adventure RPG and a new Zelda game. And the series' need not have anything to do with eachother.
Pokemon saved Nintendo back in 1996 as sales started to fall. It was Nintendo "being original". There was no Mario. There was no Zelda. This was something new. This was to attract new gamers. This was a new game. And like Mario and Zelda before it. It was huge. Now though we do not get that. We get Nintendo putting all their money, resources and efforts into keeping the fan base happy with a new Mario title or a new "Zelda Four Swords adventure". If Nintendo can keep 2 20-year-old franchises such as Mario and Zelda feeling fresh imagine what they could do with a new idea? Imagine if they were asked to make a Bongo action game that had nothing to do with Donkey Kong? We'd be looking at a totally new franchise at the beginning of next year.
What could Nintendo create with that sort of freedom on the Gamecube? Let me tell you. Pikmin. Pikmin started life as a demo featuring 100 Mario's. Imagine if that had stayed the same. Imagine if Olimar was a big Mario and the Pikmin were hundreds of little Mario’s/Luigi's and Peach's being directed to do various tasks to defeat Bowser. Indeed the game would still be original and fun. But instead we got a different world. New characters, a new franchise, new iconography and new landscapes. We got a whole new Nintendo game. One that can stand besides Mario/Zelda and Pokemon as a game that had NOTHING to do with another game. Olimar was never a baddie in Mario Land and Pikmin was never a Pokemon.
This is what Nintendo need. New games. New franchises. They don't HAVE to be adult either, might be helpful but hardly essential. Why does Wario Ware have Wario in it? Is he needed? Why did Dinosaur Planet have Fox in it? It was obviously not a Starfox game!
Nintendo are scared. Releasing a totally new game could mean a disaster. A flop. Would Viewtiful Joe have sold through the roof if it were a Megaman game? Hell yes. But would it be a new franchise on which Capcom can build on? No it could not.
Nintendo tried widening its appeal with new games. Metal Gear and Resident Evil remakes are a prime example. Yet these two games are still "old" games. Nintendo should never have bought the Resident Evil games because they had Eternal Darkness. This game could have been a new Nintendo franchise. An ideal new Nintendo franchise. As it happens it was never needed. It would never sell. Capcom's famous survival horror put pay to that.
RARE were never scared to release a new game. They did sequels too but next to the release of Banjo Tooie came Conker's Bad Fur Day. Next to Donkey Kong 64 came Jet Force Gemini. Besides Killer Instinct Gold there was Blast Corps and Goldeneye. Some were sequels. Most were totally new franchises that branched out to new gamers. What would the N64 have been without RARE? What new franchise did Nintendo create themselves? If it wasn't for the fact Nintendo's brand faces were moving into 3D we would all have wondered "what's new?" Just like we are now. If Nintendo still had RARE we would have had Grabbed by the Gholies and Kameo by now. 2 completley original and new games.
X-box gamers are lucky. Loads of totally new games to play, Knights of the Old Republic was a success, Blinx a failure but an attempt at least... and the biggest success story of this generation. Halo. A game that was so totally fresh that nearly every gamer in the world wants to own it. Even Sony, with Ico, the eye toy games, Rachet and Clank and Sly Cooper can risk a new franchise.
Are Nintendo just a bunch old golden oldies? Making nice games with the same faces over and over again? Are Nintendo out of touch? No I don't think so. Shigeru Miyamoto, a guy that made the original Donkey Kong game decades ago, made Pikmin. He hasn't lost it. He can still create a new world to exploit. A New World to delve into and explore.
Retro, Nintendo's latest acquisition, is one of Nintendo's greatest properties. Metroid Prime is almost a totally new franchise. Sure the name is the same but the game is not. Retro are original and Nintendo need to expand this team and bring Raven Blade and the companies back to the release schedule. Rare, Left Field and Silicon Knights have gone. It was a stupid mistake by the big N. But if only Nintendo themselves can make something new.
Nintendo are innovators. They were once the driving force in the gaming industry. Introducing new characters and new ideas. Now they are just a company growing old. Making the same great games... we need new great games.
Wake up Nintendo.
The reason it did was because it was staring me straight in the face, a concept developing in my mind and there it was. The entire problem surrounding Nintendo's fall from grace. In a collection of words on a page.
It started to play on my mind when the latest DS title was announced. Super Princess Peach, a tongue in cheek role reversal of Nintendo's classic Mario franchise. The game could well be an innovative and enjoyable new franchise. But it isn't. Not really. Instead it is placed along Nintendo's other DS franchises. These are Animal Crossing DS, Wario Ware DS, Mario Kart DS, Mario Brothers DS, Mario 64 DS, Metroid Prime: Hunters, four swords, Pokemon Dash, Yoshi's Touch and go... and so forth.
All of the above titles try to use (and probably succeed) a new and original form of gameplay. Yet they all, every one of them, share a common issue. They are all established Nintendo franchises. Why could Nintendo not call "Yoshi's Touch and Go" something totally different and remove Mario and Yoshi. Introduce a few new characters. Suddenly a new world is born, suddenly a new franchise is born... Yoshi and Mario could help the game to sell well but... we will never truly know.
It is funny how Nintendo are trying to release the most innovative game system ever... and yet they have not got one original game in the line up. SEGA's XY/XX feel the magic, is in fact the only game I see that isn't a new breed of an old franchise.
You see I, you and the legions of avid Nintendo followers love Nintendo for Mario, for Pokemon and for Zelda. So Nintendo continue to keep their forever falling fan base happy with new iterations of Mario and Zelda. Yet by not making a new "Mario" or a new "Pokemon" how can Nintendo ever hope to expand their fan base?
Metroid Prime was Nintendo "re-inventing" the Metroid brand. It was clever and the game is genius. Introducing the gaming world to something totally new. So why Metroid? Strafio, a massive Metroid fan from these very forums, still craves for a third person action platformer. Was it beyond Nintendo's capacity to make this? This would have satisfied the fan base. And what of Metroid Prime? Well did we have to have Samus in it? Did it have to be based around the Metroid universe?
Sure, Metroid Prime may not have sold as much if Samus and his enemies were not part of the game. And yet I feel we could have seen the birth of a brand new killer Nintendo franchise. Metroid could take the crown from Tomb Raider in the action platform sides of things. Whilst this new innovative First Person Adventure from Nintendo will make Perfect Dark a distant memory.
I shall present Zelda as my next example. A perfectly lovely realistic Zelda would have kept all Nintendo gamers happy. But the Wind Waker ruled did it not? The Wind Waker was a great new addition to the series. Yet why did it have to be Zelda? Could we not have seen a new adventure title from Nintendo? Even an RPG game! A cartoon RPG is a good idea (Namco did it). It did not have to be Zelda. It could have been a different game. A whole new series of Nintendo titles. Maybe next year we'd have the cel-shaded new adventure RPG and a new Zelda game. And the series' need not have anything to do with eachother.
Pokemon saved Nintendo back in 1996 as sales started to fall. It was Nintendo "being original". There was no Mario. There was no Zelda. This was something new. This was to attract new gamers. This was a new game. And like Mario and Zelda before it. It was huge. Now though we do not get that. We get Nintendo putting all their money, resources and efforts into keeping the fan base happy with a new Mario title or a new "Zelda Four Swords adventure". If Nintendo can keep 2 20-year-old franchises such as Mario and Zelda feeling fresh imagine what they could do with a new idea? Imagine if they were asked to make a Bongo action game that had nothing to do with Donkey Kong? We'd be looking at a totally new franchise at the beginning of next year.
What could Nintendo create with that sort of freedom on the Gamecube? Let me tell you. Pikmin. Pikmin started life as a demo featuring 100 Mario's. Imagine if that had stayed the same. Imagine if Olimar was a big Mario and the Pikmin were hundreds of little Mario’s/Luigi's and Peach's being directed to do various tasks to defeat Bowser. Indeed the game would still be original and fun. But instead we got a different world. New characters, a new franchise, new iconography and new landscapes. We got a whole new Nintendo game. One that can stand besides Mario/Zelda and Pokemon as a game that had NOTHING to do with another game. Olimar was never a baddie in Mario Land and Pikmin was never a Pokemon.
This is what Nintendo need. New games. New franchises. They don't HAVE to be adult either, might be helpful but hardly essential. Why does Wario Ware have Wario in it? Is he needed? Why did Dinosaur Planet have Fox in it? It was obviously not a Starfox game!
Nintendo are scared. Releasing a totally new game could mean a disaster. A flop. Would Viewtiful Joe have sold through the roof if it were a Megaman game? Hell yes. But would it be a new franchise on which Capcom can build on? No it could not.
Nintendo tried widening its appeal with new games. Metal Gear and Resident Evil remakes are a prime example. Yet these two games are still "old" games. Nintendo should never have bought the Resident Evil games because they had Eternal Darkness. This game could have been a new Nintendo franchise. An ideal new Nintendo franchise. As it happens it was never needed. It would never sell. Capcom's famous survival horror put pay to that.
RARE were never scared to release a new game. They did sequels too but next to the release of Banjo Tooie came Conker's Bad Fur Day. Next to Donkey Kong 64 came Jet Force Gemini. Besides Killer Instinct Gold there was Blast Corps and Goldeneye. Some were sequels. Most were totally new franchises that branched out to new gamers. What would the N64 have been without RARE? What new franchise did Nintendo create themselves? If it wasn't for the fact Nintendo's brand faces were moving into 3D we would all have wondered "what's new?" Just like we are now. If Nintendo still had RARE we would have had Grabbed by the Gholies and Kameo by now. 2 completley original and new games.
X-box gamers are lucky. Loads of totally new games to play, Knights of the Old Republic was a success, Blinx a failure but an attempt at least... and the biggest success story of this generation. Halo. A game that was so totally fresh that nearly every gamer in the world wants to own it. Even Sony, with Ico, the eye toy games, Rachet and Clank and Sly Cooper can risk a new franchise.
Are Nintendo just a bunch old golden oldies? Making nice games with the same faces over and over again? Are Nintendo out of touch? No I don't think so. Shigeru Miyamoto, a guy that made the original Donkey Kong game decades ago, made Pikmin. He hasn't lost it. He can still create a new world to exploit. A New World to delve into and explore.
Retro, Nintendo's latest acquisition, is one of Nintendo's greatest properties. Metroid Prime is almost a totally new franchise. Sure the name is the same but the game is not. Retro are original and Nintendo need to expand this team and bring Raven Blade and the companies back to the release schedule. Rare, Left Field and Silicon Knights have gone. It was a stupid mistake by the big N. But if only Nintendo themselves can make something new.
Nintendo are innovators. They were once the driving force in the gaming industry. Introducing new characters and new ideas. Now they are just a company growing old. Making the same great games... we need new great games.
Wake up Nintendo.
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Duke Nukem 3D was a 3rd person shooter too. You just had to press F4 (or one of them F keys anwyay :P)
Your point still stands though. I just thought I'd say :D
Your point still stands though. I just thought I'd say :D
That was a toilet plunger launcher.
This is different, it's a toilet brush.
It's new and original, this is a whole new franchise!
This is different, it's a toilet brush.
It's new and original, this is a whole new franchise!
Whitestripes X wrote:
> a toilet brush launcher.
Have you been playing south park 64?
> a toilet brush launcher.
Have you been playing south park 64?
Bullsh*t.
Go and play Thief III, you can switch between 3rd and 1st person. Different game from previous 1st person only Thief 1 & 2? No.
Duke Nukem : Zero Hour - 3rd person. Duke Nukem 3D - 1st person.
Different game? No.
Here's the board meeting BTW:
"Okay guys, let's made a big adventure game where you explore a giant, fully connected world and discover new weapons and upgrades."
"Hey, Nintendo already have an established franchise exactly like that!"
"Good point. Right then, lets take Metroid into the 3D world for the first time!"
So you'd like to see a 1st person adventure game where you explore one giant world and collect upgrades, with a new set of characters.
And then you'd like them to make an adventure game where you explore one giant world and collect upgrades, with the Metroid franchise.
The difference? 1st and 3rd person!!!!
WOW!!"! THESE GAMES WILL NOT AT ALL DIRECTLY COMPETE WITH EACH OTHER BECAUSE THEY'RE THE SAME ****ING GAME!!""!!"11
Oh yeah, let's not forget: In Metroid you'd have your plasma beam, wave beam etc, whereas in this TOTALLY NEW(!!!"!"!") adventure game you'd get like... a crossbow and..uhh..a toilet brush launcher.
Also, Megaman and Viewtiful Joe play completely different.
Also, what you've totally failed to realise is that:
A) The Metroid series was hugely underused and mostly unheard of with todays gamers.
B: The Metroid franchise remains unique. I can't think of any other Adventure games that have you exploring one world where you recieve weapons upgrades and upgrades to your character that allow you to return to previous areas and get somewhere new. It's closest comparison probably comes from Zelda, and that is completely different from Metroid Prime.
Like most of your posts, you remain the 'good intentions guy' who is a bit of an idiot. Recently you've departed from your trademark 'Hey everyone, Nintendo is actually winning at everything!' posts and started criticising Nintendo, unfortunatly you can't even get that right. Now you look more of a fool than before.
P.S. Strafio is nothing like the Metroid fan I am.
Here's to the future.
Let's hope it involves you attending school
Go and play Thief III, you can switch between 3rd and 1st person. Different game from previous 1st person only Thief 1 & 2? No.
Duke Nukem : Zero Hour - 3rd person. Duke Nukem 3D - 1st person.
Different game? No.
Here's the board meeting BTW:
"Okay guys, let's made a big adventure game where you explore a giant, fully connected world and discover new weapons and upgrades."
"Hey, Nintendo already have an established franchise exactly like that!"
"Good point. Right then, lets take Metroid into the 3D world for the first time!"
So you'd like to see a 1st person adventure game where you explore one giant world and collect upgrades, with a new set of characters.
And then you'd like them to make an adventure game where you explore one giant world and collect upgrades, with the Metroid franchise.
The difference? 1st and 3rd person!!!!
WOW!!"! THESE GAMES WILL NOT AT ALL DIRECTLY COMPETE WITH EACH OTHER BECAUSE THEY'RE THE SAME ****ING GAME!!""!!"11
Oh yeah, let's not forget: In Metroid you'd have your plasma beam, wave beam etc, whereas in this TOTALLY NEW(!!!"!"!") adventure game you'd get like... a crossbow and..uhh..a toilet brush launcher.
Also, Megaman and Viewtiful Joe play completely different.
Also, what you've totally failed to realise is that:
A) The Metroid series was hugely underused and mostly unheard of with todays gamers.
B: The Metroid franchise remains unique. I can't think of any other Adventure games that have you exploring one world where you recieve weapons upgrades and upgrades to your character that allow you to return to previous areas and get somewhere new. It's closest comparison probably comes from Zelda, and that is completely different from Metroid Prime.
Like most of your posts, you remain the 'good intentions guy' who is a bit of an idiot. Recently you've departed from your trademark 'Hey everyone, Nintendo is actually winning at everything!' posts and started criticising Nintendo, unfortunatly you can't even get that right. Now you look more of a fool than before.
P.S. Strafio is nothing like the Metroid fan I am.
Here's to the future.
Let's hope it involves you attending school
Rubbish, Metroid was a third person action adventure...
A first person action adventure is a VERY DIFFERENT GAME. Yes they do a lot to make it feel like Metroid but why did Retro have to do that?
Why were Retro almost forced by Nintendo to feature isolation, Metroid characters and weaponry?
It took imagination to invent a first person adventure and that imagination could have gone further. We could have had many characters involved, a variety of weapons and new moves for the Retro team to explore.
Instead their could not be many characters and they ended up including an awful lot of Metroid ideas. It maybe hard to imagine the game without the Metroid influence but then we aren't paid to imagine that.
The fact is Nintendo could have continued Metroid in a more traditional way and created a new game featuring the FPA system.
If Metroid Prime didn't re-invent the metroid series how come the latest GBA games are not called "Metroid Prime" but the next Gamecube one is... along with the new DS game?
I'll tell you, because this type of Metroid game is very different to the 2D games of yesteryear.
Imagine if Mario 64 was a first person game? Although Mario shoots less than Samus it is still a radical change for the series to take.
There is no point in argueing over what if Metroid Prime wasn't metroid because it is and always will be.
All I'm saying is that idea could have been used to invent a new franchise to sell the Gamecube. Pikmin is a new franchise that potentially sold the Gamecube (and it did in Japan)... if it was a Mario RTS (like it started out as) then it would not have had the effect. Because only Mario fans would get it. And Mario fans should already own a Gamecube.
If Viewtiful Joe featured Megaman... we would not have a new franchise to get excited over. We would have a re-invented old franchise.
A bit like Metroid Prime. And old franchise re-invented.
Why? Why could we not have a new game, a new world to explore, with new characters and new possibilities.
Think about it WS.
A first person action adventure is a VERY DIFFERENT GAME. Yes they do a lot to make it feel like Metroid but why did Retro have to do that?
Why were Retro almost forced by Nintendo to feature isolation, Metroid characters and weaponry?
It took imagination to invent a first person adventure and that imagination could have gone further. We could have had many characters involved, a variety of weapons and new moves for the Retro team to explore.
Instead their could not be many characters and they ended up including an awful lot of Metroid ideas. It maybe hard to imagine the game without the Metroid influence but then we aren't paid to imagine that.
The fact is Nintendo could have continued Metroid in a more traditional way and created a new game featuring the FPA system.
If Metroid Prime didn't re-invent the metroid series how come the latest GBA games are not called "Metroid Prime" but the next Gamecube one is... along with the new DS game?
I'll tell you, because this type of Metroid game is very different to the 2D games of yesteryear.
Imagine if Mario 64 was a first person game? Although Mario shoots less than Samus it is still a radical change for the series to take.
There is no point in argueing over what if Metroid Prime wasn't metroid because it is and always will be.
All I'm saying is that idea could have been used to invent a new franchise to sell the Gamecube. Pikmin is a new franchise that potentially sold the Gamecube (and it did in Japan)... if it was a Mario RTS (like it started out as) then it would not have had the effect. Because only Mario fans would get it. And Mario fans should already own a Gamecube.
If Viewtiful Joe featured Megaman... we would not have a new franchise to get excited over. We would have a re-invented old franchise.
A bit like Metroid Prime. And old franchise re-invented.
Why? Why could we not have a new game, a new world to explore, with new characters and new possibilities.
Think about it WS.
FFS.
Metroid Prime is NOT a reinvention of the Metroid series. It is exactly the same.
It's like saying Mario 64 was a new franchise compared to Super Mario World, and they decided to stick Mario in it rather than invent a new character.
Idiot.
Metroid Prime is NOT a reinvention of the Metroid series. It is exactly the same.
It's like saying Mario 64 was a new franchise compared to Super Mario World, and they decided to stick Mario in it rather than invent a new character.
Idiot.
gerrid wrote:
> yes mario kart DD is an incredible reinvention of the mario kart
> series Dringo.
I didn't say it totally re-invented the series but it helped keep the series feeling fresh instead of stagnant.
And Munn, Metroid Prime with or without the name would be published by Nintendo and Nintendo would still make sure the game was up to scratch. Whether it had Samus in it or not. Nintendo for example put in a lot of effort with Eternal Darkness. A game that had no connection to anything Nintendo have ever done.
At least with Prime Nintendo could hope to fill the void left by Joanna Dark.
> yes mario kart DD is an incredible reinvention of the mario kart
> series Dringo.
I didn't say it totally re-invented the series but it helped keep the series feeling fresh instead of stagnant.
And Munn, Metroid Prime with or without the name would be published by Nintendo and Nintendo would still make sure the game was up to scratch. Whether it had Samus in it or not. Nintendo for example put in a lot of effort with Eternal Darkness. A game that had no connection to anything Nintendo have ever done.
At least with Prime Nintendo could hope to fill the void left by Joanna Dark.
Dringo wrote:
> Imagine a new game from new company Retro called "Prime"
> the first ever First person adventure game. The concept was so good.
> It did not need the Metroid Iconography to make it so.
But without the Metroid Iconography, they wouldn't have had Shigeru Miyamoto come and fix half of the mistakes they'd made in a game which was originally tipped to be rubbish, made by a rubbish company.
It would have had the bugs and flaws that hadn't been fixed, and it wouldn't have had the ease of sliding in a story, whole new characters and enemies would have to be created, so less time would be spent on the actual game.
See now?
> Imagine a new game from new company Retro called "Prime"
> the first ever First person adventure game. The concept was so good.
> It did not need the Metroid Iconography to make it so.
But without the Metroid Iconography, they wouldn't have had Shigeru Miyamoto come and fix half of the mistakes they'd made in a game which was originally tipped to be rubbish, made by a rubbish company.
It would have had the bugs and flaws that hadn't been fixed, and it wouldn't have had the ease of sliding in a story, whole new characters and enemies would have to be created, so less time would be spent on the actual game.
See now?
yes mario kart DD is an incredible reinvention of the mario kart series Dringo.
I mean in terms of new franchises.
The DS is the perfect oppertunity to develop a new game, with new characters and a new world.
A new Pokemon so to speak.
A new game the launch the platform.
Like MArio 64 launched the N64 and Halo launched the X-box.
The DS is the perfect oppertunity to develop a new game, with new characters and a new world.
A new Pokemon so to speak.
A new game the launch the platform.
Like MArio 64 launched the N64 and Halo launched the X-box.
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