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Do you believe that euthanasia should be made legal in Britain?
People believe that it is technically murder to have a Doctor kill you. But then animals have the right to die if they are in pain, why not humans?
People believe that it is technically murder to have a Doctor kill you. But then animals have the right to die if they are in pain, why not humans?
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You're just Grix in a wig aren't you!
Alright. Sheesh. You all seem so concerned about what I think, so I'll respond to Sibs idolry. Please keep in mind that the original post, was my opinion. I believe everyone is entitled to their own. I don't want to argue...but, if it's a debate you want, please know that I'll engage, but you won't have much (if any) of an impact on how I feel on these issues, because I'm secure with my judgement of them.
Here we go...
Sibs wrote:
> Celestine wrote:
> Decent people want to help others, not kill them. Life is a gift.
> Atleast I chose to look at it that way. Normal people want to live.
>
> 'normal'... I really have had enough of the word 'normal'... In that
> immigration topic it's being proposed that it isn't 'normal' to mix
> with other races, here it's being proposed that 'normal' people want
> to live... fair enough, but do 'normal' people have terminal
> illness', are 'normal' people in constant pain...? If, for a
> particular individual, a 'normal' day becomes something they can't
> stand living anymore, why force them to?
No, normal people do not have terminal illnesses, nor are they in constant pain. However, if they are, the standard normal person would go get help to eleviate the pain or make it atleast bearable. I won't force anyone to do anything. You missed my point. I won't have it on my conscience that I assisted in your suicide. I'll always believe that I was a friend to the end, encouraging you to find the strength to cope.
> Which means, that people who want to die are finding it a challenge
> to cope. If euthanasia were legal, I'd worry about the man that I
> love so dearly, who has an uncopable condition at times. He tells
> me
> he wants to die.
>
> If he tells you that all the time, maybe it's for a reason.
I never said he tells me that all the time. But again, I would be extremely worried for him if euthanasia were legal. He's been diagnosed disassociative.
> Obviously it's not a topic to be taken lightly at all. If someone is
> merely suffering a bit of depression and is a bit down, then we
> shouldn't just give them an injection and be done with it. Obviously
> euthenasia would have to be extremely closely monitored if it became
> legal. Patients who don't want to carry on should consult with a
> psychiatrist, family, friends. If a psychiatrist believes them to
> simply be depressed it obviously wouldn't be appropriate to kill
> them. But if they really do feel their life is no longer worth living
> as they can't attain any fulfillment from it and are in pain, then
> perhaps it is best for all concerned to let them die, without
> prolonging their pain.
This is the circumstance where a living will would be beneficial.
> I pray I give him every reason to live. Especially, because he has
> so much of it left to do.
>
> Trying not to be harsh, for I know nothing of this case. But in some
> cases, people may well have so much to do. Whether or not they will
> ever be able to do these things due to their condition is another
> matter.
You are being harsh on me. But, it's alright. I understand how it's a challenge for some to be kind. It's all in the upbringing.
> I come from a solid faith that commands thou shalt not kill. Though,
> I am only human too, so how can I judge you and what you feel is
> right for your life. All I can do is be your friend, and love you,
> and hope that you find peace in what you choose.
>
> I have a belief in making your own mind about issues, not letting a
> church, government or anyone/anything else decide for you.
I share the same belief. Re-read.
Here we go...
Sibs wrote:
> Celestine wrote:
> Decent people want to help others, not kill them. Life is a gift.
> Atleast I chose to look at it that way. Normal people want to live.
>
> 'normal'... I really have had enough of the word 'normal'... In that
> immigration topic it's being proposed that it isn't 'normal' to mix
> with other races, here it's being proposed that 'normal' people want
> to live... fair enough, but do 'normal' people have terminal
> illness', are 'normal' people in constant pain...? If, for a
> particular individual, a 'normal' day becomes something they can't
> stand living anymore, why force them to?
No, normal people do not have terminal illnesses, nor are they in constant pain. However, if they are, the standard normal person would go get help to eleviate the pain or make it atleast bearable. I won't force anyone to do anything. You missed my point. I won't have it on my conscience that I assisted in your suicide. I'll always believe that I was a friend to the end, encouraging you to find the strength to cope.
> Which means, that people who want to die are finding it a challenge
> to cope. If euthanasia were legal, I'd worry about the man that I
> love so dearly, who has an uncopable condition at times. He tells
> me
> he wants to die.
>
> If he tells you that all the time, maybe it's for a reason.
I never said he tells me that all the time. But again, I would be extremely worried for him if euthanasia were legal. He's been diagnosed disassociative.
> Obviously it's not a topic to be taken lightly at all. If someone is
> merely suffering a bit of depression and is a bit down, then we
> shouldn't just give them an injection and be done with it. Obviously
> euthenasia would have to be extremely closely monitored if it became
> legal. Patients who don't want to carry on should consult with a
> psychiatrist, family, friends. If a psychiatrist believes them to
> simply be depressed it obviously wouldn't be appropriate to kill
> them. But if they really do feel their life is no longer worth living
> as they can't attain any fulfillment from it and are in pain, then
> perhaps it is best for all concerned to let them die, without
> prolonging their pain.
This is the circumstance where a living will would be beneficial.
> I pray I give him every reason to live. Especially, because he has
> so much of it left to do.
>
> Trying not to be harsh, for I know nothing of this case. But in some
> cases, people may well have so much to do. Whether or not they will
> ever be able to do these things due to their condition is another
> matter.
You are being harsh on me. But, it's alright. I understand how it's a challenge for some to be kind. It's all in the upbringing.
> I come from a solid faith that commands thou shalt not kill. Though,
> I am only human too, so how can I judge you and what you feel is
> right for your life. All I can do is be your friend, and love you,
> and hope that you find peace in what you choose.
>
> I have a belief in making your own mind about issues, not letting a
> church, government or anyone/anything else decide for you.
I share the same belief. Re-read.
Euthanasia is ok in my eyes, if the person going to die is fully aware of the situation and what is going on, it is a very touch debate and i'm not the best person to really give an opinion on it.
So someone disagrees with what your faith tells you to think, and you go crazy?
Fair enough. Sibs wins (for not crying, and for having a good argument, which I agree with)
Fair enough. Sibs wins (for not crying, and for having a good argument, which I agree with)
I like my toys.
[edit] And, I know you'd be interested in my responses. But, right now I can't be bothered. Maybe later. So, please stop. *cheers*
[edit] And, I know you'd be interested in my responses. But, right now I can't be bothered. Maybe later. So, please stop. *cheers*
Fair enough, seems you can't have a discussion without throwing your toys out of the pram. If you grow up and find you have some time on your hands, I would actually be interested to see some of your responses to my questions. Until then.
WhatEVER. *sighs*
[edit] erased the bleeping bleeping up your bleeping bleep. Hehe.
Woo!
Right on Sibs. You win. I lose. You're right. I'm wrong. Touche mon frere. Because ya know whatttt??? I care! Yii!
[edit] erased the bleeping bleeping up your bleeping bleep. Hehe.
Woo!
Right on Sibs. You win. I lose. You're right. I'm wrong. Touche mon frere. Because ya know whatttt??? I care! Yii!
Jeez, there's no need to have a fit just because someone disagrees with you. I never said you should 'care' that I disagree with you, nor did I say you should change your views. If you're not willing to accept that people have different views to you it does make me wonder what you're doing on a discussion forum though...
People quoting others, looking at their points and further discussing those points is a common practice on these and many other forums. It is not 'tearing apart', or whatever you said, the other persons views, it is discussing those points...
It's also rather ironic that you're saying how 'exhausting' it is seeing me try to discredit you... I'm not trying to discredit you or anything you've said, I am asking you questions to try and understand the points you've made and to try and put my points across to you. What is rather annoying is that you ignore them and just start insulting me.
And frankly I have no idea what you mean by me idolising you...?
People quoting others, looking at their points and further discussing those points is a common practice on these and many other forums. It is not 'tearing apart', or whatever you said, the other persons views, it is discussing those points...
It's also rather ironic that you're saying how 'exhausting' it is seeing me try to discredit you... I'm not trying to discredit you or anything you've said, I am asking you questions to try and understand the points you've made and to try and put my points across to you. What is rather annoying is that you ignore them and just start insulting me.
And frankly I have no idea what you mean by me idolising you...?
I should have said "idolise." I really don't care what your beliefs are. Honestly, I don't. I care not to debate with you either. Because, I think your wrong and stupid and trying to sound smart, but just coming out sounding stupid...and it's exhausting just looking at you try so hard to discredit me. It's almost pathetic.
You can obliterate my posts all you want. Hanging on my every word...Psh. I believe what I do too, and it's hypocritical people like you that can't seem to respect that.
You can obliterate my posts all you want. Hanging on my every word...Psh. I believe what I do too, and it's hypocritical people like you that can't seem to respect that.
Celestine wrote:
> I hope you're enjoying yourself tearing me up with your pretentious
> logic. Do what you will, have your bias opinions and try getting
> others to confer. It makes me feel sad that you find it necessary to
> idealise me. I'm not here for that, honestly.
Please explain how my logic is pretentious...? I'm just trying to put forward my opinion and back it up, if that seems pretentious because it conflicts with what you believe, then sorry, but that's the way it is.
> I will not subject, because I am open-minded, fair and just, and an
> overall decent person who wishes no ill on anyone. Making euthanasia
> legal is making it readily available. You can try rationalising that
> it would be regulated, but the fact of the matter is that if someone
> wants something bad enough, they'll be (more than likely) willing to
> pay the price.
"If someone wants something bad enough, they'll be willing to pay the price"...? How do you mean? In that if someone wants to die badly enough they will find a way? Surely this is the case whether euthenasia is legal or not...?
> For instance, (and I believe this will give Displayed -another- forum
> topic to post) if marijuana were legalized, more people would be
> doing it. That would suck, because then everyone would be high and
> talking like you about making it easier for people to have access to
> killing themselves if they're depressed.
I never said people should be able to kill themselves if they were simply depressed. Try reading what I type. That was why I pointed out it would have to be extremely carefully monitored and and there would have to be many safeguards (such as psychiatrists) to protect people with terminal illness from being given a lethal injection if they are feeling depressed and so are not in a clear state of mind.
As for the Marijuana issue, that's another debate altogether, but considering how easy it is to get hold of, I really doubt legalising would lead to a significant increase in use. And euthenasia and marijuana use are hardly comparable...
> Have you fun poking my faith. It's mine and I'm secure with it.
I wasn't poking fun at your faith, I was saying you shouldn't be blindly led by it. A great deal of things in the bible are open to interpretation, but surely if someone has the choice of another few years of constant pain versus that extra time spent in heaven, then the heaven choice is the better option?
> I hope you're enjoying yourself tearing me up with your pretentious
> logic. Do what you will, have your bias opinions and try getting
> others to confer. It makes me feel sad that you find it necessary to
> idealise me. I'm not here for that, honestly.
Please explain how my logic is pretentious...? I'm just trying to put forward my opinion and back it up, if that seems pretentious because it conflicts with what you believe, then sorry, but that's the way it is.
> I will not subject, because I am open-minded, fair and just, and an
> overall decent person who wishes no ill on anyone. Making euthanasia
> legal is making it readily available. You can try rationalising that
> it would be regulated, but the fact of the matter is that if someone
> wants something bad enough, they'll be (more than likely) willing to
> pay the price.
"If someone wants something bad enough, they'll be willing to pay the price"...? How do you mean? In that if someone wants to die badly enough they will find a way? Surely this is the case whether euthenasia is legal or not...?
> For instance, (and I believe this will give Displayed -another- forum
> topic to post) if marijuana were legalized, more people would be
> doing it. That would suck, because then everyone would be high and
> talking like you about making it easier for people to have access to
> killing themselves if they're depressed.
I never said people should be able to kill themselves if they were simply depressed. Try reading what I type. That was why I pointed out it would have to be extremely carefully monitored and and there would have to be many safeguards (such as psychiatrists) to protect people with terminal illness from being given a lethal injection if they are feeling depressed and so are not in a clear state of mind.
As for the Marijuana issue, that's another debate altogether, but considering how easy it is to get hold of, I really doubt legalising would lead to a significant increase in use. And euthenasia and marijuana use are hardly comparable...
> Have you fun poking my faith. It's mine and I'm secure with it.
I wasn't poking fun at your faith, I was saying you shouldn't be blindly led by it. A great deal of things in the bible are open to interpretation, but surely if someone has the choice of another few years of constant pain versus that extra time spent in heaven, then the heaven choice is the better option?
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