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While I was browsing the site you can find if you [URL]http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14510&page=2&pp=15[/URL] , I came across this interesting story.
Some people were arguing over which version of Taoism was the best (Taoism was an alternative to Buddhism in China) and also what was best out of Buddhism and Taoism (which was silly considering that they're both so similar and a proper Taoist/Buddhist wouldn't be bothered by who's belief is best...) and a guy came out with this analogy:
It's like in the old story of the blind guys all grabbing an elephant on a different part and then trying to describe to each other what an elephant really is based on the one part they have in their hands. One guy has an ear, one guy has the tail, one guy has the torso, one guy has a leg, another guy has a tusk. They all have a real part of the elephant, but they also all have completely different descriptions and end up getting mad and yelling at each other about what an elephant is really like. It isn't because they are stupid or wrong, it is because they can't see the rest of the elephant.
Taoism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Christianity, Islam, Judaism, you name it, they all have dozens, if not hundreds, of sects just because of "blindness" regarding their other parts. If you dig into the roots of the traditions you'll see that most of the founders of different religions all warned against this happening. But, people being who they are, everyone wants their part of the elephant to be the best one and don't give a monkey's (or an elephant's) butt about the other parts (if they even admit that other parts exist) and spend all day yelling about their own.
Do you think that God has revealed EVERYTHING there is to know about him in your Bible?
Even if you were to be right, that would not necessarily make over religions and beliefs wrong?
What do you think? :-)
Some people were arguing over which version of Taoism was the best (Taoism was an alternative to Buddhism in China) and also what was best out of Buddhism and Taoism (which was silly considering that they're both so similar and a proper Taoist/Buddhist wouldn't be bothered by who's belief is best...) and a guy came out with this analogy:
It's like in the old story of the blind guys all grabbing an elephant on a different part and then trying to describe to each other what an elephant really is based on the one part they have in their hands. One guy has an ear, one guy has the tail, one guy has the torso, one guy has a leg, another guy has a tusk. They all have a real part of the elephant, but they also all have completely different descriptions and end up getting mad and yelling at each other about what an elephant is really like. It isn't because they are stupid or wrong, it is because they can't see the rest of the elephant.
Taoism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Christianity, Islam, Judaism, you name it, they all have dozens, if not hundreds, of sects just because of "blindness" regarding their other parts. If you dig into the roots of the traditions you'll see that most of the founders of different religions all warned against this happening. But, people being who they are, everyone wants their part of the elephant to be the best one and don't give a monkey's (or an elephant's) butt about the other parts (if they even admit that other parts exist) and spend all day yelling about their own.
Do you think that God has revealed EVERYTHING there is to know about him in your Bible?
Even if you were to be right, that would not necessarily make over religions and beliefs wrong?
What do you think? :-)
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monkey_man wrote:
> Scientifically, it
> all works out, and there is proof from studying our ancient
> anscestors that we have grown in our mentaland physical capacities,
> as well as adapting and altering the environment we live in.
But it doesn't. On a practical level, why can this earth sustain life so well? Why do the plants use photosynthesis? Why are we protected by the Ozone layer? Why do the seasons balance out? Why do we have the power of thought?
On a practical level, you can see that every masterpiece needs a creator and God is the creator of the universe.
> Scientifically, it
> all works out, and there is proof from studying our ancient
> anscestors that we have grown in our mentaland physical capacities,
> as well as adapting and altering the environment we live in.
But it doesn't. On a practical level, why can this earth sustain life so well? Why do the plants use photosynthesis? Why are we protected by the Ozone layer? Why do the seasons balance out? Why do we have the power of thought?
On a practical level, you can see that every masterpiece needs a creator and God is the creator of the universe.
Forest Fan wrote:
> There is no proof of evolution, or even an account to back it up.
"Evolution can be divided into two parts, macro and micro. Micro evolution is a fact, where as macro evolution remains a theory due to debates on the exact steps of the evolutionary process.
EVOLUTION DID HAPPEN we simply can’t trace the exact evolutionary steps of the of the 3 trillion plus species on earth. Considering there is no way that we can even prove if we have located all the species on earth, this may always remain a theory. We can prove though, beyond a doubt, that humans have evolved. We can trace it back conclusively 3.6 million years. 97% of all scientists accept evolution (so does the Catholic Church). Christians have spread lies about this excessively, they especially like to say evolution preaches that Humans evolved from monkeys. Evolution does not state that humans evolved from monkeys, that idea is completely absurd. Science states that monkeys and humans evolved from a shared forefather and are hence relatives, (all primates are) but we are in no way direct descendants of them."
> There is no proof of evolution, or even an account to back it up.
"Evolution can be divided into two parts, macro and micro. Micro evolution is a fact, where as macro evolution remains a theory due to debates on the exact steps of the evolutionary process.
EVOLUTION DID HAPPEN we simply can’t trace the exact evolutionary steps of the of the 3 trillion plus species on earth. Considering there is no way that we can even prove if we have located all the species on earth, this may always remain a theory. We can prove though, beyond a doubt, that humans have evolved. We can trace it back conclusively 3.6 million years. 97% of all scientists accept evolution (so does the Catholic Church). Christians have spread lies about this excessively, they especially like to say evolution preaches that Humans evolved from monkeys. Evolution does not state that humans evolved from monkeys, that idea is completely absurd. Science states that monkeys and humans evolved from a shared forefather and are hence relatives, (all primates are) but we are in no way direct descendants of them."
Forest Fan wrote:
> Pandaemonium wrote:
> There is no proof it is true, outside of what is said in the bible.
>
> There is no proof of evolution, or even an account to back it up.
Even an account isn't proof - it's just an account, and isn't accurate. Like the Bible, for instance, is just an account of what happened between 3000 and 1500 years ago. It doesn't mean it's real, just because it's written down by someone.
But, evolution is the most plausible theory for why we are at this stage in the development of the Human species. Scientifically, it all works out, and there is proof from studying our ancient anscestors that we have grown in our mentaland physical capacities, as well as adapting and altering the environment we live in.
> Pandaemonium wrote:
> There is no proof it is true, outside of what is said in the bible.
>
> There is no proof of evolution, or even an account to back it up.
Even an account isn't proof - it's just an account, and isn't accurate. Like the Bible, for instance, is just an account of what happened between 3000 and 1500 years ago. It doesn't mean it's real, just because it's written down by someone.
But, evolution is the most plausible theory for why we are at this stage in the development of the Human species. Scientifically, it all works out, and there is proof from studying our ancient anscestors that we have grown in our mentaland physical capacities, as well as adapting and altering the environment we live in.
Pandaemonium wrote:
> There is no proof it is true, outside of what is said in the bible.
There is no proof of evolution, or even an account to back it up.
> There is no proof it is true, outside of what is said in the bible.
There is no proof of evolution, or even an account to back it up.
Forest Fan wrote:
> Explain to me in your own words then how the power of thought
> 'evolved'.
It evolved. The point being that you have to believe in evolution (which makes far more sense to me that my ancestors being sprung into existence by a supernatural being).
There is nothing special about the human brain. It is a four pound chunk of meat. The only thing that is surprising is that we are the only "intelligence" that we can measure on the face of the planet, and that makes some of us feel superior. Dolphins have an incredibly complex social structure and understanding of their surroundings, they may evolve (or already be) a self aware intelligence.
Intelligence is not a phenomenon. Its a pattern, and as reproducible as a photocopy. We can't do this yet but the investigations into artificial intelligence are proving that it will be possible in the future to create intelligence. It'll not be the same as our intelligence, as it'll be based on circuits as opposed to carbon based flesh, but it'll still be based on electric interaction between nodes.
Remember, in 40 years from the first "real" computers, you are playing highly sophisticated video games on a playstation 2. Where will the world be in 200 years time, at the present rate of advancement in the field of computing? We are already using super computing power in the search for extraterrestrial intelligence.
> Explain to me in your own words then how the power of thought
> 'evolved'.
It evolved. The point being that you have to believe in evolution (which makes far more sense to me that my ancestors being sprung into existence by a supernatural being).
There is nothing special about the human brain. It is a four pound chunk of meat. The only thing that is surprising is that we are the only "intelligence" that we can measure on the face of the planet, and that makes some of us feel superior. Dolphins have an incredibly complex social structure and understanding of their surroundings, they may evolve (or already be) a self aware intelligence.
Intelligence is not a phenomenon. Its a pattern, and as reproducible as a photocopy. We can't do this yet but the investigations into artificial intelligence are proving that it will be possible in the future to create intelligence. It'll not be the same as our intelligence, as it'll be based on circuits as opposed to carbon based flesh, but it'll still be based on electric interaction between nodes.
Remember, in 40 years from the first "real" computers, you are playing highly sophisticated video games on a playstation 2. Where will the world be in 200 years time, at the present rate of advancement in the field of computing? We are already using super computing power in the search for extraterrestrial intelligence.
Forest Fan wrote:
> What makes you think Creation is wrong, when it breaks not one
> scientific rule, unlike evolution.
There is no proof it is true, outside of what is said in the bible.
If instead of Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth", it read "In the beginning God found the earth, and created man" then that would be your belief. There is no scientific proof of creation.
> What makes you think Creation is wrong, when it breaks not one
> scientific rule, unlike evolution.
There is no proof it is true, outside of what is said in the bible.
If instead of Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth", it read "In the beginning God found the earth, and created man" then that would be your belief. There is no scientific proof of creation.
Explain to me in your own words then how the power of thought 'evolved'.
Pandaemonium wrote:
> Forest Fan wrote:
> You may have your faith, and it may make you think you are special,
> but it has NO place in the search for the truth"
What makes you think Creation is wrong, when it breaks not one scientific rule, unlike evolution.
> Forest Fan wrote:
> You may have your faith, and it may make you think you are special,
> but it has NO place in the search for the truth"
What makes you think Creation is wrong, when it breaks not one scientific rule, unlike evolution.
Forest Fan wrote:
> Pandaemonium wrote:
> But we are trying, trying to answer this question, instead of
> blindly accepting the bible.
>
> Can you not understand this simple reasoning?
>
> Or in other words,
>
> 'Yes, Evolution does contradict itself and is impossible, but we
> would rather believe a lie, than believe the Bible, telling us that
> we all need forgiveness.'
No, in my words
"I am more interested with the search for the truth and the actual origins of the universe, where we came from and where we are going as a species, than beveliving in a crock of s**t drempt up by a bunch of Bronze Age tribesmen that has no place in modern science. You may have your faith, and it may make you think you are special, but it has NO place in the search for the truth"
> Pandaemonium wrote:
> But we are trying, trying to answer this question, instead of
> blindly accepting the bible.
>
> Can you not understand this simple reasoning?
>
> Or in other words,
>
> 'Yes, Evolution does contradict itself and is impossible, but we
> would rather believe a lie, than believe the Bible, telling us that
> we all need forgiveness.'
No, in my words
"I am more interested with the search for the truth and the actual origins of the universe, where we came from and where we are going as a species, than beveliving in a crock of s**t drempt up by a bunch of Bronze Age tribesmen that has no place in modern science. You may have your faith, and it may make you think you are special, but it has NO place in the search for the truth"
Pandaemonium wrote:
> But we are trying, trying to answer this question, instead of
> blindly accepting the bible.
>
> Can you not understand this simple reasoning?
Or in other words,
'Yes, Evolution does contradict itself and is impossible, but we would rather believe a lie, than believe the Bible, telling us that we all need forgiveness.'
> But we are trying, trying to answer this question, instead of
> blindly accepting the bible.
>
> Can you not understand this simple reasoning?
Or in other words,
'Yes, Evolution does contradict itself and is impossible, but we would rather believe a lie, than believe the Bible, telling us that we all need forgiveness.'
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