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Ahh, my second new topic in 5 minutes, yep, I'm getting back into using my pc again. I'll be pestering people about the web site I'm working on soon if I'm not careful :^)
As a combination of cheapskate and wannabe nerd, a year ago I began to build myself a pc. I bought the case then bust my shoulder, had to leave my job and couldn't afford to continue.
Now I'm starting up again.
I have a reasonable idea of my way around a pc, I know all the internal bits I need (I think) - except cables maybe, but I should be able to figure that out when I try to put everything together...
So then there's putting everything together. I knew a guy who did it by trial and error - is that a good idea? Seemed a bit reckless to me.
Can anyone recommend a good how-to web guide?
And can I expect to have to fiddle around in bios with drivers and stuff for everything, or should the first start-up just be a matter of firing up an OS ?
Cheers
As a combination of cheapskate and wannabe nerd, a year ago I began to build myself a pc. I bought the case then bust my shoulder, had to leave my job and couldn't afford to continue.
Now I'm starting up again.
I have a reasonable idea of my way around a pc, I know all the internal bits I need (I think) - except cables maybe, but I should be able to figure that out when I try to put everything together...
So then there's putting everything together. I knew a guy who did it by trial and error - is that a good idea? Seemed a bit reckless to me.
Can anyone recommend a good how-to web guide?
And can I expect to have to fiddle around in bios with drivers and stuff for everything, or should the first start-up just be a matter of firing up an OS ?
Cheers
Page:
What is your overall budget Duck, and what have you left to buy?
Loquacious Duck wrote:
>
> Hmm, aparantly I have FSB 200/266/333MHz (skt A).
> I was looking at a 1.533 GHz AMD athlon xp 1800, which runs at fsb
> 266.
> The £35 price tag was my main incentive :^)
>
> So that means that I could take DDR 532 (if I could find it)
Here the processor is actually at an FSB of 133 MHz. With the FSB at 133 MHz, the memory would be DDR 266, also known as PC2100... Never said this would make sense!
>
> If I used 266 ram, would that affect the fsb speed to the processor?
> If so, that would slow the processor down too, right?
DDR 266 would match your processor. Hence that is the minimum you should get. This is because 1,533 MHz = 11.5 multiplier x 133 MHz FSB (actually it is off by a whopping 3 MHz, but that is the way it works). DDR 200 (quite rare now actually) would slow your processor down as it would be 11.5 multiplier x 100 = 1,150 MHz.
The converse, faster FSB (i.e. 166 MHz, DDR 333 etc) and / or higher multiplier makes things faster, and this is the basis of overclocking. For example 166 MHz FSB x 11.5 multiplier = 1,909 MHz. But if that was too fast for the processor to actually run you could try 166 MHz x 10 multiplier = 1,660 MHz, still an increase. But we are getting ahead of ourselves now. But at least now you have an idea of how it works. I'm not the best at explaining things.
But as you can imagine, as with most things computer related, the faster the better. Now you can run DDR 333 at DDR 266 speeds etc, or any other memory slower than its rated speed. It is mostly luck if you get memory to run much faster than its rated speed though, DDR 266 would be unlikely to run at DDR 333.
Having had a look at that website you were thinking of ordering from, I urge you to consider some local PC shops first. Mine sells 512 Mb of DDR 400 at £47, a whole £5 cheaper than PC Next Day's DDR 266 stuff. Which is obviously better.
> Ah, I guess you're right about the HDD. It'd hardly make sense to
> upgrade to something £10 more expensive than my original one,
> if I did upgrade.
>
> Is a Radeon graphics card okay? If I pay for the £10 extra
> option for everything I buy then this'll get expensive!
Radeons are the current leaders in the graphics card market, from budget through to top end. I have one.
And yes if you keep spending an extra tenner on everything it would get expensive. But I would only recommend it for a few things. It saves money in the long run as you get longer out of your components.
Now I am pretty sure I managed to confuse you with all the FSB, DDR, multiplier stuff. Any more questions, just ask.
>
> Hmm, aparantly I have FSB 200/266/333MHz (skt A).
> I was looking at a 1.533 GHz AMD athlon xp 1800, which runs at fsb
> 266.
> The £35 price tag was my main incentive :^)
>
> So that means that I could take DDR 532 (if I could find it)
Here the processor is actually at an FSB of 133 MHz. With the FSB at 133 MHz, the memory would be DDR 266, also known as PC2100... Never said this would make sense!
>
> If I used 266 ram, would that affect the fsb speed to the processor?
> If so, that would slow the processor down too, right?
DDR 266 would match your processor. Hence that is the minimum you should get. This is because 1,533 MHz = 11.5 multiplier x 133 MHz FSB (actually it is off by a whopping 3 MHz, but that is the way it works). DDR 200 (quite rare now actually) would slow your processor down as it would be 11.5 multiplier x 100 = 1,150 MHz.
The converse, faster FSB (i.e. 166 MHz, DDR 333 etc) and / or higher multiplier makes things faster, and this is the basis of overclocking. For example 166 MHz FSB x 11.5 multiplier = 1,909 MHz. But if that was too fast for the processor to actually run you could try 166 MHz x 10 multiplier = 1,660 MHz, still an increase. But we are getting ahead of ourselves now. But at least now you have an idea of how it works. I'm not the best at explaining things.
But as you can imagine, as with most things computer related, the faster the better. Now you can run DDR 333 at DDR 266 speeds etc, or any other memory slower than its rated speed. It is mostly luck if you get memory to run much faster than its rated speed though, DDR 266 would be unlikely to run at DDR 333.
Having had a look at that website you were thinking of ordering from, I urge you to consider some local PC shops first. Mine sells 512 Mb of DDR 400 at £47, a whole £5 cheaper than PC Next Day's DDR 266 stuff. Which is obviously better.
> Ah, I guess you're right about the HDD. It'd hardly make sense to
> upgrade to something £10 more expensive than my original one,
> if I did upgrade.
>
> Is a Radeon graphics card okay? If I pay for the £10 extra
> option for everything I buy then this'll get expensive!
Radeons are the current leaders in the graphics card market, from budget through to top end. I have one.
And yes if you keep spending an extra tenner on everything it would get expensive. But I would only recommend it for a few things. It saves money in the long run as you get longer out of your components.
Now I am pretty sure I managed to confuse you with all the FSB, DDR, multiplier stuff. Any more questions, just ask.
Loquacious Duck wrote:
> When I buy an actual floppy drive, do I just take the front off to
> make it fit to the case?
No, just slide the floppy drive in behind it and the eject button should line up.
> When I buy an actual floppy drive, do I just take the front off to
> make it fit to the case?
No, just slide the floppy drive in behind it and the eject button should line up.
Loquacious Duck wrote:
> gamezfreak wrote:
> Ebay is probably your best bet for cheap stuff.
>
> I got my motherboard and processor cheap on ebay, nothing else seemed
> any cheaper than I could get from a 'proper' internet store (I found
> one very cheap place, but I don't want to advertise them here.
> Perhaps Certain Nods Effectively Xylophone Translate Domains
> At You?)
Wow, i have no idea who you are trying to hint at.
> gamezfreak wrote:
> Ebay is probably your best bet for cheap stuff.
>
> I got my motherboard and processor cheap on ebay, nothing else seemed
> any cheaper than I could get from a 'proper' internet store (I found
> one very cheap place, but I don't want to advertise them here.
> Perhaps Certain Nods Effectively Xylophone Translate Domains
> At You?)
Wow, i have no idea who you are trying to hint at.
Loquacious Duck wrote:
> When I buy an actual floppy drive, do I just take the front off to
> make it fit to the case?
Yup, just pop it out and slide the drive in :)
Sometimes there might be an extra metal "plate" behind it, just keep wiggling that around till it comes loose.
> When I buy an actual floppy drive, do I just take the front off to
> make it fit to the case?
Yup, just pop it out and slide the drive in :)
Sometimes there might be an extra metal "plate" behind it, just keep wiggling that around till it comes loose.
gamezfreak wrote:
> Ebay is probably your best bet for cheap stuff.
I got my motherboard and processor cheap on ebay, nothing else seemed any cheaper than I could get from a 'proper' internet store (I found one very cheap place, but I don't want to advertise them here. Perhaps Certain Nods Effectively Xylophone Translate Domains At You?)
> I say don't my skimpy on the PSU, never ever purchase one of those
> damn Qtec ones either.
I got a case with a psu built in. Hopefully it's a decent one...
Oh, the pc had a floppy hole (and eject button) in the front, as well as an extra floppy bay - as do many pcs, I think..
When I buy an actual floppy drive, do I just take the front off to make it fit to the case?
> Ebay is probably your best bet for cheap stuff.
I got my motherboard and processor cheap on ebay, nothing else seemed any cheaper than I could get from a 'proper' internet store (I found one very cheap place, but I don't want to advertise them here. Perhaps Certain Nods Effectively Xylophone Translate Domains At You?)
> I say don't my skimpy on the PSU, never ever purchase one of those
> damn Qtec ones either.
I got a case with a psu built in. Hopefully it's a decent one...
Oh, the pc had a floppy hole (and eject button) in the front, as well as an extra floppy bay - as do many pcs, I think..
When I buy an actual floppy drive, do I just take the front off to make it fit to the case?
Notorious Biggles wrote:
> I don't know how much you know, so I'll be basic here.
Heh, not much by the sound of it :^)
> The processor speed is the Front Side Bus (FSB) x the multiplier.
> So for a 2 GHz processor, you might have the FSB at 200 MHz and the
> multiplier at 10. Which gives you the 2000 MHz / 2 GHz.
>
> Point of this is that DDR is 2 x the FSB. So DDR 333 memory runs at
> 166 MHz FSB. DDR 266 runs at 133 MHz FSB.
>
> So if you mix and match memory, you can only go as fast as the
> slowest bit of memory.
>
> On Intel processors you can't change the multiplier. On recent AMD
> chips you can't either. But it is still possible to get the hold of
> some that were made when you could. So if you had one of those older
> chips, you could set the FSB to 133 and then use a bigger multiplier.
> Going back to the earlier 2 GHz example, you could do 133 MHz FSB x
> 15 multiplier.
>
> However, this does depend on the processor.
Hmm, aparantly I have FSB 200/266/333MHz (skt A).
I was looking at a 1.533 GHz AMD athlon xp 1800, which runs at fsb 266.
The £35 price tag was my main incentive :^)
So that means that I could take DDR 532 (if I could find it)?
If I used 226 ram, would that affect the fsb speed to the processor? If so, that would slpw the processor down too, right?
> As for hard drives... for £10, go with the bigger one. Sure,
> you might not need it now, you might think you would never need it,
> but it gives you the option. You never know, you might decide to do
> video editting or something one day and need the space.
>
> As for graphics cards, do yourself a favour. Even if you are never
> going to play games, get one based on an ATI or Nvidia chip. Current
> bottom of the range ATI is the 9200SE and can be gotten for around
> £30. The reason I say this is that you will always be able to
> get drivers for an ATI or Nvidia card more easily than something
> based on the Savage S8 or some other scraping the barrel budget
> card.
Ah, I guess you're right about the HDD. It'd hardly make sense to upgrade to something £10 more expensive than my original one, if I did upgrade.
Is a Radeon graphics card okay? If I pay for the £10 extra option for everything I buy then this'll get expensive!
> I don't know how much you know, so I'll be basic here.
Heh, not much by the sound of it :^)
> The processor speed is the Front Side Bus (FSB) x the multiplier.
> So for a 2 GHz processor, you might have the FSB at 200 MHz and the
> multiplier at 10. Which gives you the 2000 MHz / 2 GHz.
>
> Point of this is that DDR is 2 x the FSB. So DDR 333 memory runs at
> 166 MHz FSB. DDR 266 runs at 133 MHz FSB.
>
> So if you mix and match memory, you can only go as fast as the
> slowest bit of memory.
>
> On Intel processors you can't change the multiplier. On recent AMD
> chips you can't either. But it is still possible to get the hold of
> some that were made when you could. So if you had one of those older
> chips, you could set the FSB to 133 and then use a bigger multiplier.
> Going back to the earlier 2 GHz example, you could do 133 MHz FSB x
> 15 multiplier.
>
> However, this does depend on the processor.
Hmm, aparantly I have FSB 200/266/333MHz (skt A).
I was looking at a 1.533 GHz AMD athlon xp 1800, which runs at fsb 266.
The £35 price tag was my main incentive :^)
So that means that I could take DDR 532 (if I could find it)?
If I used 226 ram, would that affect the fsb speed to the processor? If so, that would slpw the processor down too, right?
> As for hard drives... for £10, go with the bigger one. Sure,
> you might not need it now, you might think you would never need it,
> but it gives you the option. You never know, you might decide to do
> video editting or something one day and need the space.
>
> As for graphics cards, do yourself a favour. Even if you are never
> going to play games, get one based on an ATI or Nvidia chip. Current
> bottom of the range ATI is the 9200SE and can be gotten for around
> £30. The reason I say this is that you will always be able to
> get drivers for an ATI or Nvidia card more easily than something
> based on the Savage S8 or some other scraping the barrel budget
> card.
Ah, I guess you're right about the HDD. It'd hardly make sense to upgrade to something £10 more expensive than my original one, if I did upgrade.
Is a Radeon graphics card okay? If I pay for the £10 extra option for everything I buy then this'll get expensive!
You could even get a stick of cheapass crucial DDR333.
Basically buy the fastest RAM your machine can support, as that way you won't encounter as many bandwith overheads if you decide to upgrade to a higher fsb processor later, and the difference in price these days is miniscule.
Loquacious Duck wrote:
> Can I mix and match
>
> DDR 266
> with
> DDR 333
>
> ram in my future pc?
>
> I'd like to start with cheap stuff, but move on to better gear
> later...
It depends what type of processor you are going to be using.
I don't know how much you know, so I'll be basic here.
The processor speed is the Front Side Bus (FSB) x the multiplier.
So for a 2 GHz processor, you might have the FSB at 200 MHz and the multiplier at 10. Which gives you the 2000 MHz / 2 GHz.
Point of this is that DDR is 2 x the FSB. So DDR 333 memory runs at 166 MHz FSB. DDR 266 runs at 133 MHz FSB.
So if you mix and match memory, you can only go as fast as the slowest bit of memory.
On Intel processors you can't change the multiplier. On recent AMD chips you can't either. But it is still possible to get the hold of some that were made when you could. So if you had one of those older chips, you could set the FSB to 133 and then use a bigger multiplier. Going back to the earlier 2 GHz example, you could do 133 MHz FSB x 15 multiplier.
However, this does depend on the processor.
As for hard drives... for £10, go with the bigger one. Sure, you might not need it now, you might think you would never need it, but it gives you the option. You never know, you might decide to do video editting or something one day and need the space.
As for graphics cards, do yourself a favour. Even if you are never going to play games, get one based on an ATI or Nvidia chip. Current bottom of the range ATI is the 9200SE and can be gotten for around £30. The reason I say this is that you will always be able to get drivers for an ATI or Nvidia card more easily than something based on the Savage S8 or some other scraping the barrel budget card.
And if you so desired, you could even play games on it.
Any questions, feel free to ask. Quite a few of us have built a PC from scratch.
> Can I mix and match
>
> DDR 266
> with
> DDR 333
>
> ram in my future pc?
>
> I'd like to start with cheap stuff, but move on to better gear
> later...
It depends what type of processor you are going to be using.
I don't know how much you know, so I'll be basic here.
The processor speed is the Front Side Bus (FSB) x the multiplier.
So for a 2 GHz processor, you might have the FSB at 200 MHz and the multiplier at 10. Which gives you the 2000 MHz / 2 GHz.
Point of this is that DDR is 2 x the FSB. So DDR 333 memory runs at 166 MHz FSB. DDR 266 runs at 133 MHz FSB.
So if you mix and match memory, you can only go as fast as the slowest bit of memory.
On Intel processors you can't change the multiplier. On recent AMD chips you can't either. But it is still possible to get the hold of some that were made when you could. So if you had one of those older chips, you could set the FSB to 133 and then use a bigger multiplier. Going back to the earlier 2 GHz example, you could do 133 MHz FSB x 15 multiplier.
However, this does depend on the processor.
As for hard drives... for £10, go with the bigger one. Sure, you might not need it now, you might think you would never need it, but it gives you the option. You never know, you might decide to do video editting or something one day and need the space.
As for graphics cards, do yourself a favour. Even if you are never going to play games, get one based on an ATI or Nvidia chip. Current bottom of the range ATI is the 9200SE and can be gotten for around £30. The reason I say this is that you will always be able to get drivers for an ATI or Nvidia card more easily than something based on the Savage S8 or some other scraping the barrel budget card.
And if you so desired, you could even play games on it.
Any questions, feel free to ask. Quite a few of us have built a PC from scratch.
Page: