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In a couple of month’s time, I will be in a play that will find me onstage and as naked as the day I was born. Naturally, were it not for the fact that I'm so damned sexy, I'd be sh!tting my pants to the point of overflowing. And predictably enough, everyone whom I've told has asked "Aren't you embarrassed?". To which the answer is "No; should I be? Do I have anything to be embarrassed about? It's my body, I'm rather fond of it, and if other people want to come along and have a look at it...well, more power to 'em!"
But, me being me, all those blushing and giggling questioners did set me off thinking; why do we seem to have such a huge hang up on body image in our society? Especially where women are concerned, but increasingly with men as well. I mean, we live in a time when the NHS farts and collapses every time there is a flu epidemic, but where men can also have operations to implant fake muscles into their chests. I'm a first class pervert, and am the first to admit that I have no problem with silicon breasts. But silicone pecs...is it just me, or does that seem like vanity taken to the point of parody?
Everyone, men and women, seems to feel that they are under increasing pressure to have a certain shaped body, a particular size waist, a specific weight range. Why is this? As far as I can see, it seems to be down to insecurity about ourselves and the way we look. But when did self-centred vanity become the accepted way to express this insecurity? Did we, as a society, inch slowly towards that all by ourselves? Or did we receive a helping hand along the way?
Naturally, when looking for something to blame for a fault in society, we will turn our attention to the media. The media gets a lot of bad press (if you'll pardon the pun) in this regard; I'm sure everyone is familiar with the somewhat schizophrenic approach taken by the print media towards body image. On page 4 we will be told of the anguish caused by the increase in anorexia and bulimia among young women, and what could perhaps be done to stop it. Then page 5 will, in scandalised tones, launch an epic flurry of claws and handbags at whichever celebrity happens to have been snapped with his/her stomach being anything less than washboard flat.
In the past, I've always had the same opinion when it comes to criticising any media for what they do; if you don't like it, don't read or watch it. There's not exactly a dearth of newspapers, lifestyle magazines, TV, or radio programs to choose from, so choose one more to your liking. After all, we're adults and are capable of making our own choices. That is still my opinion, but I have had cause to add a caveat to it; sometimes we have no choice in the matter. Sometimes something permeates so many different parts of the media on so many levels that we're left with little option but to be aware of it. There can't be many people in the UK who remain blissfully unaware of the continuing saga of Victoria Beckham, her appearance, her weight, and her husband (and anyone who has stayed unaware is a lucky, lucky person...). However, just because we are all aware of something, doesn't mean we have to actually pay any attention to it, or give it any credence.
(As a side note, I should really confess that I've found myself modifying my opinions of films or albums based on favourable write-ups in magazines. Curiously, I'm not really ashamed to admit that...maybe that's just because I've never read a magazine that's told me I should be)
The thing is though, if it is the media, then why do we go out and buy or watch the image-obsessed dross that is cluttering up newsagents and TV stations? I mean, they wouldn't be successful if we had no interest in them, yet we weekly spend a sum equivalent to the third world national debt on ladmags/'lifestyle' mags (as women insist on calling the froth that fills the pages of Cosmo et al)/scandal rags. It seems odd that the media gets so much of the blame for our growing obsession with body image, when one could build a convincing case that they are merely responding to what the public wants.
Which leads us to the obvious question; why is this what the public want? Why do we want the perfect body, even at the expense of having a remotely enjoyable life. I mean, I've known a few people with eating disorders, and the misery that they caused themselves trying to sculpt their body to someone else’s idea of perfection far outweighed any misery they had felt for being overweight/ugly. To me, it seems bizarre that no-one stops to think "Hang on; I only weigh as much as a packet of crisps now, I have hunger pains all the time, and my body chemistry is completely screwed due to malnutrition. Hmm...yeah, I must be happy with my weight!".
I'm taking the proverbial to an extent there; eating disorders are a mental illness, and expecting someone to think logically about anything when in the throes of mental illness is unreasonable of me. Couldn't we therefore say that society's body image hang up is a widespread form of mental illness? Well...perhaps, but not everyone with an obsession over body image ends up with an eating disorder. So perhaps it is a mistake for me to think of this hang up of society as something to be diagnosed and then treated.
I'm starting to ramble more than usual, so I shall draw things to a close now. And as per usual, I find that I've raised more questions in my own head than have been answered. The one thing I remain sure of, and hope I've gone some way to impressing on you, is that society is spending a disproportionate amount of its time being concerned with what is not much more than petty vanity. Surely we're all better than that.
Aren't we?
But, me being me, all those blushing and giggling questioners did set me off thinking; why do we seem to have such a huge hang up on body image in our society? Especially where women are concerned, but increasingly with men as well. I mean, we live in a time when the NHS farts and collapses every time there is a flu epidemic, but where men can also have operations to implant fake muscles into their chests. I'm a first class pervert, and am the first to admit that I have no problem with silicon breasts. But silicone pecs...is it just me, or does that seem like vanity taken to the point of parody?
Everyone, men and women, seems to feel that they are under increasing pressure to have a certain shaped body, a particular size waist, a specific weight range. Why is this? As far as I can see, it seems to be down to insecurity about ourselves and the way we look. But when did self-centred vanity become the accepted way to express this insecurity? Did we, as a society, inch slowly towards that all by ourselves? Or did we receive a helping hand along the way?
Naturally, when looking for something to blame for a fault in society, we will turn our attention to the media. The media gets a lot of bad press (if you'll pardon the pun) in this regard; I'm sure everyone is familiar with the somewhat schizophrenic approach taken by the print media towards body image. On page 4 we will be told of the anguish caused by the increase in anorexia and bulimia among young women, and what could perhaps be done to stop it. Then page 5 will, in scandalised tones, launch an epic flurry of claws and handbags at whichever celebrity happens to have been snapped with his/her stomach being anything less than washboard flat.
In the past, I've always had the same opinion when it comes to criticising any media for what they do; if you don't like it, don't read or watch it. There's not exactly a dearth of newspapers, lifestyle magazines, TV, or radio programs to choose from, so choose one more to your liking. After all, we're adults and are capable of making our own choices. That is still my opinion, but I have had cause to add a caveat to it; sometimes we have no choice in the matter. Sometimes something permeates so many different parts of the media on so many levels that we're left with little option but to be aware of it. There can't be many people in the UK who remain blissfully unaware of the continuing saga of Victoria Beckham, her appearance, her weight, and her husband (and anyone who has stayed unaware is a lucky, lucky person...). However, just because we are all aware of something, doesn't mean we have to actually pay any attention to it, or give it any credence.
(As a side note, I should really confess that I've found myself modifying my opinions of films or albums based on favourable write-ups in magazines. Curiously, I'm not really ashamed to admit that...maybe that's just because I've never read a magazine that's told me I should be)
The thing is though, if it is the media, then why do we go out and buy or watch the image-obsessed dross that is cluttering up newsagents and TV stations? I mean, they wouldn't be successful if we had no interest in them, yet we weekly spend a sum equivalent to the third world national debt on ladmags/'lifestyle' mags (as women insist on calling the froth that fills the pages of Cosmo et al)/scandal rags. It seems odd that the media gets so much of the blame for our growing obsession with body image, when one could build a convincing case that they are merely responding to what the public wants.
Which leads us to the obvious question; why is this what the public want? Why do we want the perfect body, even at the expense of having a remotely enjoyable life. I mean, I've known a few people with eating disorders, and the misery that they caused themselves trying to sculpt their body to someone else’s idea of perfection far outweighed any misery they had felt for being overweight/ugly. To me, it seems bizarre that no-one stops to think "Hang on; I only weigh as much as a packet of crisps now, I have hunger pains all the time, and my body chemistry is completely screwed due to malnutrition. Hmm...yeah, I must be happy with my weight!".
I'm taking the proverbial to an extent there; eating disorders are a mental illness, and expecting someone to think logically about anything when in the throes of mental illness is unreasonable of me. Couldn't we therefore say that society's body image hang up is a widespread form of mental illness? Well...perhaps, but not everyone with an obsession over body image ends up with an eating disorder. So perhaps it is a mistake for me to think of this hang up of society as something to be diagnosed and then treated.
I'm starting to ramble more than usual, so I shall draw things to a close now. And as per usual, I find that I've raised more questions in my own head than have been answered. The one thing I remain sure of, and hope I've gone some way to impressing on you, is that society is spending a disproportionate amount of its time being concerned with what is not much more than petty vanity. Surely we're all better than that.
Aren't we?
Page:
Sdrawkcab wrote:
> But, when you say in films all evil people are ugly, I'm sure I can
> remember a film where beautiful people were "baddies."
>
>
>
> Wait a second, it'll come back to me.
Stepford Wives?
> But, when you say in films all evil people are ugly, I'm sure I can
> remember a film where beautiful people were "baddies."
>
>
>
> Wait a second, it'll come back to me.
Stepford Wives?
But, when you say in films all evil people are ugly, I'm sure I can remember a film where beautiful people were "baddies."
Wait a second, it'll come back to me.
Wait a second, it'll come back to me.
The sagacious one wrote:
> Ah Yoda be strong in the force and ugly he is. In fact the Jedis are a
> pretty ropey bunch of ugs, apart from the humans. Why are xenomorphs
> always portrayed as uggers?
To reinforce the idea that the alien is literally 'alien' ie different from us, the considered normal.
Think of it like this, how do we define people as being human ? We find the differences in others to us, we are human because we are not something else. Same as you define xenomorphs as 'uggers', they are like that because they look different.
In Star Wars the Jedi may well contain many aliens but the ones doing the plot advancing actions are for the most part human, the others such as Yoda impart advice - apart from Yoda's one lightsaber outing - but otherwise stay away, removed from the viewers gaze.
Goatboy mentioned Lucas's role in the production of Star Wars, but it is entirely possible that the meanings from Star Wars are not those he originally intended as each generation draws different meaning from the product of another. We find a meaning ourselves, and certain ideas are so embedded in our culture that they are subconciously forgotten as being anything other than ideas and instead become the norm.
> Ah Yoda be strong in the force and ugly he is. In fact the Jedis are a
> pretty ropey bunch of ugs, apart from the humans. Why are xenomorphs
> always portrayed as uggers?
To reinforce the idea that the alien is literally 'alien' ie different from us, the considered normal.
Think of it like this, how do we define people as being human ? We find the differences in others to us, we are human because we are not something else. Same as you define xenomorphs as 'uggers', they are like that because they look different.
In Star Wars the Jedi may well contain many aliens but the ones doing the plot advancing actions are for the most part human, the others such as Yoda impart advice - apart from Yoda's one lightsaber outing - but otherwise stay away, removed from the viewers gaze.
Goatboy mentioned Lucas's role in the production of Star Wars, but it is entirely possible that the meanings from Star Wars are not those he originally intended as each generation draws different meaning from the product of another. We find a meaning ourselves, and certain ideas are so embedded in our culture that they are subconciously forgotten as being anything other than ideas and instead become the norm.
Ah Yoda be strong in the force and ugly he is. In fact the Jedis are a pretty ropey bunch of ugs, apart from the humans. Why are xenomorphs always portrayed as uggers?
Well, I disagree a lot with the Star Wars thing - Vader wore a helmet because he was disfigured and it did look menacing etc, not sure about the colour of the droids idea but then I'm not Lucas so I could be wrong.
But the original point you made and Light discussed was body image - not good vs evil and siding with the forces of good. Of course, you can argue about Jabba being overweight and portrayed as evil but that could have just been an aesthetic decision.
But I'll agree 100% with the portrayal of acceptable (whatever the hell that is) body size in the media. It's in print ads, commercials, magazines, movies etc. It's everywhere and has been, in my opinion, one of the worst culprits for self-image problems in women. And it's now starting to target men, more and more men workout to get "the perfect body".
This is what I'm currently working on for work, and it disgusts me that such onus is placed on physical appearance - but unfortunately that's the way the world works.
As for attractiveness, it *is* in the eye of the beholder.
Like I said, I dont find silicone, bleach-blonde women attractive at all - but thousands do.
And just as I dont find overweight people attractive, thousands do.
The difference is I dont say it's wrong to be that size - the media does.
....wow, who'd a thunk it - me agreeing with Bell.
*shrugs*
A reasonable discussion with personal ideas being put forward.
But the original point you made and Light discussed was body image - not good vs evil and siding with the forces of good. Of course, you can argue about Jabba being overweight and portrayed as evil but that could have just been an aesthetic decision.
But I'll agree 100% with the portrayal of acceptable (whatever the hell that is) body size in the media. It's in print ads, commercials, magazines, movies etc. It's everywhere and has been, in my opinion, one of the worst culprits for self-image problems in women. And it's now starting to target men, more and more men workout to get "the perfect body".
This is what I'm currently working on for work, and it disgusts me that such onus is placed on physical appearance - but unfortunately that's the way the world works.
As for attractiveness, it *is* in the eye of the beholder.
Like I said, I dont find silicone, bleach-blonde women attractive at all - but thousands do.
And just as I dont find overweight people attractive, thousands do.
The difference is I dont say it's wrong to be that size - the media does.
....wow, who'd a thunk it - me agreeing with Bell.
*shrugs*
A reasonable discussion with personal ideas being put forward.
Work that crotch.
Baby.
Baby.
Tis true Practical magic, ugly people are evil.
Light wrote:
> Okay, but that doesn't address the point I made about if it is the
> media that is responsible, how did they persuade us all that image was
> everything? For once, I'm not saying you're necessarily wrong, but as
> per usual I AM asking you to explain yourself.
Association. Through films, music, televisions, magazines, advertising. I highlighted the case of teen films, and someone pointed out this was just in one genre. But even so the same kinds of images persist in other film genres.
Science Fiction - Star Wars, the good guys are, in context of the film's original release period, not your average person with the exceptance of Chewbacca. Even the droids are coloured symbolically - gold suggesting richness, wealth, a prized object, and white for purity, cleaness and peace. But back to the characters. So we have the trademark 'beautiful people' set against the Dark Side of the force. The Emperor, a wizened old man who hides away in robes away from the world, Darth Vader who has to hide his disfigured self through a space age mask, and the stormtroopers, indentikit clones with no identity. Which side do most people look to ? The good guys, the nice looking people.
Fantasy - Lord Of The Rings ? You have Gollum, so disfigured by his experiences he must hide away in the mountains, living alone, and Bilbo steals from him despite being a 'good character'. The evil side, the forces of Sauron, are horrid looking orcs, goblins, uruk hai - all like wild beast - and Sauron, again like Darth Vader he is faceless. Arrayed against them, the good guys ? The Elves, eternally young, the Wood Elves likewise, the young hobbits who despite the hobbit races predilection for food are surprisingly slim, and so on. Success lies with the nice looking people.
Even within war films, the casualties are mostly the unknown characters. in other forms of conflict the same kind of message is there. Take the scene in the Matrix where Cypher betrays the group. Who dies ? The techy slighly wierd kid, the white haired woman, betrayed by the blad moustachioed guy, whilst Neo and trinity, arguably the best looking of the bunch, survive. The good looking guy gets the good looking girl once more.
In advertising there has long been the association of 'beautiful people' with consumer items, hence PCFormat always features a woman on it's cover despite only 5% of it's readership being women, XGamer does likewise, as do others, yet the more serious, lower readership Edge and Games TM do not. And the same applies to just about every consumer item you can think of. Advertisers know that physical beauty is nearly always eye catching to the opposite sex, or at least a high enough demographic to make the item sell. Same goes for the music industry ? Would pop be so 'popular' if it were not mainly sung by semi clad teens for the most part ? Extend the idea to a favourite subject of forumers, pornography. How many have images of fat naked people ? I'll bet none, and I'm not saying you should, but how many of you are nothing like, in terms of body, many of the people/person in the images you have seen ? Sexiness is linked to physical beauty, and this is reinforced by the lads/lifestyle mags also. As you point out, Light, if a celebrity such as Kate Winslow (she was in Titanic, sure I have her name wrong) says anything contrary to the washboard stomach syndrome of Hollywood then it makes news.
How did we define what we see as beauty ? that is something much deeper, but something I feel is ultimately lost to us now anyway, the image perpetutates because it is recycled and rarely challenged. Undoubtedly how we came to define physical beauty as usually meaning slim and other features is linked to psychology, not something I've studied ever !
There are exceptions, I've noticed in much of the anime I watch, and in other Japanese media sources that the same does not always hold true over there. The messages in anime are often that it is what a person is really like that matters, that physical beauty is immaterial.
Ironically, in Western cultures where physical beauty dominates the population is moving into a geriatric dominated phase, where the old outnumber the young. Such a time may force a change in thinking but it is doubtful.
Sorry if this has garbled a bit...
> Okay, but that doesn't address the point I made about if it is the
> media that is responsible, how did they persuade us all that image was
> everything? For once, I'm not saying you're necessarily wrong, but as
> per usual I AM asking you to explain yourself.
Association. Through films, music, televisions, magazines, advertising. I highlighted the case of teen films, and someone pointed out this was just in one genre. But even so the same kinds of images persist in other film genres.
Science Fiction - Star Wars, the good guys are, in context of the film's original release period, not your average person with the exceptance of Chewbacca. Even the droids are coloured symbolically - gold suggesting richness, wealth, a prized object, and white for purity, cleaness and peace. But back to the characters. So we have the trademark 'beautiful people' set against the Dark Side of the force. The Emperor, a wizened old man who hides away in robes away from the world, Darth Vader who has to hide his disfigured self through a space age mask, and the stormtroopers, indentikit clones with no identity. Which side do most people look to ? The good guys, the nice looking people.
Fantasy - Lord Of The Rings ? You have Gollum, so disfigured by his experiences he must hide away in the mountains, living alone, and Bilbo steals from him despite being a 'good character'. The evil side, the forces of Sauron, are horrid looking orcs, goblins, uruk hai - all like wild beast - and Sauron, again like Darth Vader he is faceless. Arrayed against them, the good guys ? The Elves, eternally young, the Wood Elves likewise, the young hobbits who despite the hobbit races predilection for food are surprisingly slim, and so on. Success lies with the nice looking people.
Even within war films, the casualties are mostly the unknown characters. in other forms of conflict the same kind of message is there. Take the scene in the Matrix where Cypher betrays the group. Who dies ? The techy slighly wierd kid, the white haired woman, betrayed by the blad moustachioed guy, whilst Neo and trinity, arguably the best looking of the bunch, survive. The good looking guy gets the good looking girl once more.
In advertising there has long been the association of 'beautiful people' with consumer items, hence PCFormat always features a woman on it's cover despite only 5% of it's readership being women, XGamer does likewise, as do others, yet the more serious, lower readership Edge and Games TM do not. And the same applies to just about every consumer item you can think of. Advertisers know that physical beauty is nearly always eye catching to the opposite sex, or at least a high enough demographic to make the item sell. Same goes for the music industry ? Would pop be so 'popular' if it were not mainly sung by semi clad teens for the most part ? Extend the idea to a favourite subject of forumers, pornography. How many have images of fat naked people ? I'll bet none, and I'm not saying you should, but how many of you are nothing like, in terms of body, many of the people/person in the images you have seen ? Sexiness is linked to physical beauty, and this is reinforced by the lads/lifestyle mags also. As you point out, Light, if a celebrity such as Kate Winslow (she was in Titanic, sure I have her name wrong) says anything contrary to the washboard stomach syndrome of Hollywood then it makes news.
How did we define what we see as beauty ? that is something much deeper, but something I feel is ultimately lost to us now anyway, the image perpetutates because it is recycled and rarely challenged. Undoubtedly how we came to define physical beauty as usually meaning slim and other features is linked to psychology, not something I've studied ever !
There are exceptions, I've noticed in much of the anime I watch, and in other Japanese media sources that the same does not always hold true over there. The messages in anime are often that it is what a person is really like that matters, that physical beauty is immaterial.
Ironically, in Western cultures where physical beauty dominates the population is moving into a geriatric dominated phase, where the old outnumber the young. Such a time may force a change in thinking but it is doubtful.
Sorry if this has garbled a bit...
Don't laugh. I can't afford to pay for an enlargement operation, so I've had someone etch a nude drawing of Halle Berry onto my eyeballs with a penknife, in order for me to walk around with a constant semi-lob on.
Mwahahahahahahaha!
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