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"And so it begins..."

Firefighters slack off work, and people die. No doubt, they expect that now a price can be put on life itself.

Does no-one understand who has replaced them? Kids, getting paid far less than firefighters get NOW. They do it why? Because they want to save lives? Because they want fame? Because they want money?

No. They're doing it because it is their duty to serve. These are the people I want as my fireservice. Not people who would have me burn should the dollar not tip their hand.

That the firefighters have stood down from their duties is, to me, disgusting, and the whole lot of them are held i contempt.

£30,000 a year? These people don't deserve to be fed pig testes.

Have done and agree 100%
Apologies.

Go to FOG chat. Read.

Insane Bartender wrote:
> So perhaps instead of putting people's lives on the line, these union
> puppets should instead seek out a new vocation in life.

--

It must be nice to see the world in such simple black and white.
Why can't everybody be so clued in eh?

*shakes head and chuckles*

Insane Bartender wrote:
> Well, that's contemptable in its own right, but no less contempatble
> than dereliction of duty and ransoming the country because your too
> greedy to compromise.

I have to say that the fact that the unions aren't allowing anyone but the fire fighters to have access to proper fire vehicles. It is almost the same as the Lorry drivers who cut off petrol to the country and in my mind at least these are both little better than acts of terrorism. It may not be down to average fireman, but certainly some higher officials and union bosses are to blame

The real scum in this are the 100s of people making hoax calls at a time like this.

Goatboy - I'm sure all the firemen are really under the evil influence of the Union (I have no love of unions whatsoever), and personally, the idea of ever striking to squeeze more money out of someone is disgusting. I'd never do it. If I thought I wasn't getting paid enough for the job I was doing, I'd do something else.

That's how the market works you see. If the job isn't paid enough, supply of labour for the job will thin below the demand for it. When this happens, the wages go up to encourage more labour.

So perhaps instead of putting people's lives on the line, these union puppets should instead seek out a new vocation in life.

Mr. Happy wrote:
> It appears that the firefighters who were picketing during the New
> Wales fire in which a woman died, actually broke their strike to go
> and help. So they are not quite as worthy of contempt as you imply.

Really? Standing by swinging pickets and suddenly realising your not doing your job and possibly costing someone's life as a result? Personally, if I found that a relative of mine had died because some twit realised too late that he wasn't doing the duty for which he is paid, I would sue.


> That said, it's illegal for the police and ambulance crews to go on
> strike, and I don't see why it should be any different for the fire
> service. It is true that they are underpaid, and when MP's vote to
> give themselves a 40% pay-rise (though you should note in the
> parliamentary context a 40% increase is by no means greedy), it can
> grate.

Personally, I didn't exactly want the MPs to give themselves a pay rise, but just because one person gets a payrise, why should that mean everyone else deserves one?



> Many firefighters do want to continue working, but they're caught
> between breaking a picket line and low wages. Perhaps if their Union
> had actually done its job and increased wages incrementally over the
> past years then we wouldn't be in this situation.

And this is what they're being offered! Proper salary schemes leading to decent pay for EXPERIENCED firefighters. The firefighters seem to expect veteran pay for rookie workers, and that's ludicrous. Train drivers get paid more because they are immediately responsible for the live of people far more often, and far more in number than any firefighter ever will be. Hence the argument that firefighters should get paid more is nothing short of dumb.



> I agree that it's a sorry situation, but perhaps you should save your
> bile for the real scum - some inconceivably idiotic people who are
> deliberately making hoax calls to the fire service because it is now
> so stretched.

Well, that's contemptable in its own right, but no less contempatble than dereliction of duty and ransoming the country because your too greedy to compromise.

*nods at Belldandy*

Yep.
My personal take on the situation:

Firefighters, like nurses and teachers, is not a well paid job. It's more of a vocation than a job. You have to really want to do it, the rewards financially are tiny compared to the input required from you.
These are jobs that directly affect the outcome of people's lives.
I'm not saying being a train-driver/politician etc is any less "worthy", but when you consider the effect firemen have (as do nurses, teachers, police etc) then I feel they should be recognised as such.
You couldn't pay me enough to risk my life on a phone call from someone in danger. I just dont have that in me, but these guys do.

But, IB - before you start getting red-faced and spittle-lipped, not all firemen agree with this strike. Our bass-player thinks it's disgusting that any fireman would strike, putting people at risk. But do you break the strike? Risk being labelled as a "scab"? Some have, the crew mentioned last night for instance.
And most of the day-to-day firemen dont even know what's going on, they have to watch the news like we do to find out the status of things. Their Union is not communicating except through the press.

So before you condemn firemen everywhere with sweeping statements of ignorant posturing, do some reading and learn what's actually going on.
Cheers!

ps - any agreement with Belldandy on anything except the colour of the sky is purely coincidental and should not be taken as a sign I want to hold him in the shower or anything.

Insane Bartender wrote:

> What other job in the world, bar lab rat, can someone walk in
> unqualified and earn that kind of money. Getting away without some
> kind of salry scheme is nothing short of ransoming the country.

Politician
Civil Service Graduate positions
Train Driver
Builder
Plumber
Electrician

A fireman is just as qualified as the above, and just because they do not need A Levels and the like they do have to have other qualifications which you cannot get on paper....

~~Belldandy~~

It appears that the firefighters who were picketing during the New Wales fire in which a woman died, actually broke their strike to go and help. So they are not quite as worthy of contempt as you imply.

That said, it's illegal for the police and ambulance crews to go on strike, and I don't see why it should be any different for the fire service. It is true that they are underpaid, and when MP's vote to give themselves a 40% pay-rise (though you should note in the parliamentary context a 40% increase is by no means greedy), it can grate.

Many firefighters do want to continue working, but they're caught between breaking a picket line and low wages. Perhaps if their Union had actually done its job and increased wages incrementally over the past years then we wouldn't be in this situation.

I agree that it's a sorry situation, but perhaps you should save your bile for the real scum - some inconceivably idiotic people who are deliberately making hoax calls to the fire service because it is now so stretched.

Insane Bartender wrote:
> What other job in the world, bar lab rat, can someone walk in
> unqualified and earn that kind of money.

Train driver.