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Is it just me or are Nintendo's programmers some of the worst around? Allow me to lend some examples...
Zelda OOT, one of the most revolutionary games ever, but HOW long did it take to make? FOUR YEARS! Now, that would be absolutely fine if that time was spent on introducing the revolutionary camera and battle features- but it wasn't at all! In fact anyone who followed the game's development will know that the first draft actually had most of these features in it, but was plagued by fog, lack of textures and poor sound. The four years development were mainly spent on getting the graphics engines right- something that plenty of other companies do in a fraction of the time with a fraction of the man power.
Nintendo have even PROVEN my point by announcing that the team that will code F-Zero on the GC will be... wait for it.... Amusment Vision- one of Sega's departments.
Now, why do you think that is? All AV have churned out of great interest is the stunning Rez, Super Monkey Ball and Space Channel 5- far cries from F Zero's style.
The answer to the riddle is that AV CHURNED out the games. They can code new graphics engines in no time (compared to Nintendo). They managed to create new engines for SMB, Rez, Planet Harrier and Space Channel 5 almost simaltaneously.
Maybe this is the reason that Ninty, despite having some of the biggest in house facilities ever, only release a handfull of games a year?
Sonic
Zelda OOT, one of the most revolutionary games ever, but HOW long did it take to make? FOUR YEARS! Now, that would be absolutely fine if that time was spent on introducing the revolutionary camera and battle features- but it wasn't at all! In fact anyone who followed the game's development will know that the first draft actually had most of these features in it, but was plagued by fog, lack of textures and poor sound. The four years development were mainly spent on getting the graphics engines right- something that plenty of other companies do in a fraction of the time with a fraction of the man power.
Nintendo have even PROVEN my point by announcing that the team that will code F-Zero on the GC will be... wait for it.... Amusment Vision- one of Sega's departments.
Now, why do you think that is? All AV have churned out of great interest is the stunning Rez, Super Monkey Ball and Space Channel 5- far cries from F Zero's style.
The answer to the riddle is that AV CHURNED out the games. They can code new graphics engines in no time (compared to Nintendo). They managed to create new engines for SMB, Rez, Planet Harrier and Space Channel 5 almost simaltaneously.
Maybe this is the reason that Ninty, despite having some of the biggest in house facilities ever, only release a handfull of games a year?
Sonic
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hey sorry man did'nt think it would bother u so much
I.love.gamecube wrote:
> they're only giving games to sega to do because sega is becoming part
> of nintendo, though they may not admit it
Clearly you know NOTHING of Sega. The company is split into 9 departments. Each is INDEPENDENT to do what they want. So, Sonic Team and AV are firmly in bed with the GC, while the bigger departments are aiming more at the PS2. Overall, 50% of Sega's games this year will be on the PS2, with the rest equally spread over the Xbox, GC, arcade and GBA.
> another reason is that they're not giving sega a gamecube f-zero game
> to make, they are giving them a triforce f-zero game to make 9the new
> nintendo/sega/namco arcade system, then they are going to port the
> game to the gamecube
errrrr.... Actually all the stuff ninty sites said about the Triforce was rubbish...
It was 100% developed by Sega, with investment from Namco, and obviously technology from Nintendo. Just like the Sega Naomi board is 100% developed by sega, but using a Hitachi chip.
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Cooky, I take your point, but as I said, almost all the gameplay in Zelda was ready after the 1st year. Much of the rest was adding the textured graphics.
Now, as the reply below you said, the N64 was too hard to develop for, and this is probably why the team struggled so much. BUT id the GC hardware is so much better, then WHY must Ninty ask other developers to make games. Ok, fine it it's 2nd party developers (like Starfox to Rare), but to give a game to a COMPLETELY separate developer is just unheard of.
Like I said, Ninty have one of the biggest in house development teams in the world, with loads of production lines. Even if they couldn't find the space to make F Zero, I'm sure that ONE of their 2nd party companies could?
If not, then I expect about 100 first and second party Ninty games to be released ever year- that's how big their resources are!
Sonic
> they're only giving games to sega to do because sega is becoming part
> of nintendo, though they may not admit it
Clearly you know NOTHING of Sega. The company is split into 9 departments. Each is INDEPENDENT to do what they want. So, Sonic Team and AV are firmly in bed with the GC, while the bigger departments are aiming more at the PS2. Overall, 50% of Sega's games this year will be on the PS2, with the rest equally spread over the Xbox, GC, arcade and GBA.
> another reason is that they're not giving sega a gamecube f-zero game
> to make, they are giving them a triforce f-zero game to make 9the new
> nintendo/sega/namco arcade system, then they are going to port the
> game to the gamecube
errrrr.... Actually all the stuff ninty sites said about the Triforce was rubbish...
It was 100% developed by Sega, with investment from Namco, and obviously technology from Nintendo. Just like the Sega Naomi board is 100% developed by sega, but using a Hitachi chip.
_____________________________________________
Cooky, I take your point, but as I said, almost all the gameplay in Zelda was ready after the 1st year. Much of the rest was adding the textured graphics.
Now, as the reply below you said, the N64 was too hard to develop for, and this is probably why the team struggled so much. BUT id the GC hardware is so much better, then WHY must Ninty ask other developers to make games. Ok, fine it it's 2nd party developers (like Starfox to Rare), but to give a game to a COMPLETELY separate developer is just unheard of.
Like I said, Ninty have one of the biggest in house development teams in the world, with loads of production lines. Even if they couldn't find the space to make F Zero, I'm sure that ONE of their 2nd party companies could?
If not, then I expect about 100 first and second party Ninty games to be released ever year- that's how big their resources are!
Sonic
===SONICRAV---> wrote:
> Is it just me or are Nintendo's programmers some of the worst around?
> Allow me to lend some examples...
>
> Sonic
And what sold more copies???
Zelda OOT or SMB, Space Channel 5, Rez, Planet Harrier???
Which of the above is regarded as one of THE greatest games of all time???
:p
> Is it just me or are Nintendo's programmers some of the worst around?
> Allow me to lend some examples...
>
> Sonic
And what sold more copies???
Zelda OOT or SMB, Space Channel 5, Rez, Planet Harrier???
Which of the above is regarded as one of THE greatest games of all time???
:p
hmmm, sonicrav, u hav sum good points, but if ZELDA OOT took 4 years to make, ninty obviously wanted it to be perfect. the N64 was difficult to code for, which would hav increased the development time quite a bit. but if u think about it, OOT was one of the best, maybe even THE best N64 game, and i will bet anything that u bought it, even after the 4 year wait, am i right?
jus because it took a while to make, that dusn't make the developers crap, and i doubt whether anyone else would hav dun it much faster, and wouldn't hav dun it as well as nintendo.
anyways, the gc is way easier to develop games for, cos the dev kits are much better than on the N64
jus because it took a while to make, that dusn't make the developers crap, and i doubt whether anyone else would hav dun it much faster, and wouldn't hav dun it as well as nintendo.
anyways, the gc is way easier to develop games for, cos the dev kits are much better than on the N64
I guess youve got a little bit of a point but then agin oot was the greatest game of all time and you dont make games like that in 6 monthes!
screw you guys!
they're only giving games to sega to do because sega is becoming part of nintendo, though they may not admit it
another reason is that they're not giving sega a gamecube f-zero game to make, they are giving them a triforce f-zero game to make 9the new nintendo/sega/namco arcade system, then they are going to port the game to the gamecube
another reason is that they're not giving sega a gamecube f-zero game to make, they are giving them a triforce f-zero game to make 9the new nintendo/sega/namco arcade system, then they are going to port the game to the gamecube
We can but speculate...
All good points, but I still don't agree about Ninty working on all these new games (thus giving some franchises away).
Like I said, Ninty must have over a dozen production lines- perhaps over 20. So, what are they doing with them?
Sonic
Like I said, Ninty must have over a dozen production lines- perhaps over 20. So, what are they doing with them?
Sonic
Sonic, if you think that's bad, read a thread called Paper Zelda!
I see what you mean about the graphics. To simply put across another point of view, I would assert that the first year was spent getting the game engine perfected and the camera and controls tweaked, BEFORE they spent time on graphics that would otherwise may have to be changed. Look at the sunset and sunrise in Zelda - whatever the graphics once were, they were simply the best graphics around at the time of release. So Nintendo must be doing something right.
As for the F-Zero point and the point that Metroid, Starfox etc are being given to other companies, I would say this. Miyamoto and Nintendo have said that they don't like to rest on their laurels - they want to find new, innovative ground breaking games, and constantly develop new series, as has been seen in Pikmin. But Nintendo can't neglect their hugely popular franchises. There is massive demand for these titles. So what they have done, (cleverly in my opinion), is develop the most popular ones themselves, such as Mario, Mario Kart and Zelda, and farm out the lesser known ones to other, more than capable developers who will do justice to them, leaving Nintendo with room to develop new series.
I await your response...
I see what you mean about the graphics. To simply put across another point of view, I would assert that the first year was spent getting the game engine perfected and the camera and controls tweaked, BEFORE they spent time on graphics that would otherwise may have to be changed. Look at the sunset and sunrise in Zelda - whatever the graphics once were, they were simply the best graphics around at the time of release. So Nintendo must be doing something right.
As for the F-Zero point and the point that Metroid, Starfox etc are being given to other companies, I would say this. Miyamoto and Nintendo have said that they don't like to rest on their laurels - they want to find new, innovative ground breaking games, and constantly develop new series, as has been seen in Pikmin. But Nintendo can't neglect their hugely popular franchises. There is massive demand for these titles. So what they have done, (cleverly in my opinion), is develop the most popular ones themselves, such as Mario, Mario Kart and Zelda, and farm out the lesser known ones to other, more than capable developers who will do justice to them, leaving Nintendo with room to develop new series.
I await your response...
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