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I've titled this post "Xbox - an opinion". I was going call it "Xbox - a verdict" but that sounds conceited, and gives the impression that my thoughts are final and correct. That's not the case, so I stress that this is my *opinion*. You may agree, you may not; but don't rant at me about it. I do not care if you agree or disagree, I am simply giving my thoughts in the hope that you find them useful in deciding whether or not to buy one for yourself.
-----
I was looking at screens and videos of Halo on the Xbox all day yesterday, and got a strong urge to buy one.
So, after I got home from work, I went to my local Tesco's and bought one, together with a second controller, Halo and Project Gotham Racing.
I plugged everything in and powered it up. First thing you're presented with is the settings screen - very similar to the PS2's in what it offers, the main difference being that you can set 60Hz mode here, which is then used for all games - pretty cool. My major dislike about the menus and front-end is that it's all in shades of green, but that's just personal taste.
Other minor things I noticed were that (a) the machine is just as noisy as my PS2 (i.e. not very) and (b) there is a constant clickling sound from within - which I assume is the hard disk - but which you don't notice once a game is playing.
First game loaded up was Project Gotham Racing. This is the game that, according to Xbox magazine (not the official one) "makes GT3 look dump".
I can categorically say that this is not the case. The cars are well realised, but they just don't have the polish (no pun intended) that the cars in GT3 have. They're good, accurate models, but somehow don't have that 'real' look to them; they're more 'very lifelike cartoon' than photorealistic. The colours are bold and strong, rather than the subtleties of GT3.
Tracks are well designed, but the scenery again looks a little bland. There's plenty there, but the textures aren't particularly well detailed, with colour used in 'blocks'.
Replays are good, though again not up to GT3 standards. Reflections in the cars are a little blocky, and tend to move quite jerkily overy the surface of the car. And believe it or not, I did see pop-up in certain areas, and jaggies are just as evident here as in GT3; i.e. they are there, but are not significant. In terms of appearance, it probably falls somewhere between Ridge Racer V and GT3.
In terms of gameplay, it's good enough. The handling isn't anything like GT3, but then it's not supposed to be, as this is more of an arcade racer. It falls somewhere between GT3 and Burnout, I'd say. As with GT3, there are only 5 other cars in the race. Driver AI is also similar to GT3 in that cars will hit you if you're in their way - you can turn into a corner nice and smooth, and cars around you don't really deviate from their pre-determined racing line.
I have also found a fairly major bug! Quite frequently, when re-starting a race and having an automatic gearbox, the car suddenly goes into reverse gear and revs the engine without me touching a thing! Then when the countdown reaches "Go!" the car takes off backwards! I have found that some frantic pressing of the left (brake)and right (accelerate) trigger buttons solves the problem, but it gives the other cars one heck of a head start, and many times I've had to re-start the race again immediately.
Over all though, it's a solid arcade racer, similar to MSR on the Dreamcast. The only area this does have an advantage is the sound, because the music is presented as radio stations you can listen to, as in GT3 - but *real* radio stations, such as Capital FM and XFM. But in all honesty, I don't believe the over-all product is a patch on GT3.
Next up is Halo, the reason I bought the machine. The mother of all FPS games, apparently. And it really is rather good. You know how FPS games play, so I won't go into great details. What takes most getting used to is that you can only carry two weapons at any time, adding a significant strategy element to the game. As far as I have played, this hasn't really been an issue, as I've so far only had pistols and assault rifles in various forms; this may well become more of a factor later in the game.
At certain points you must control vehicles - so far I've only encountered the Warthog, and this is proving fairly difficult to control; you control acceleration with the left analogue stick, and steer by rotating the camera with the right analogue stick. Sounds easy, but wait until you try it... it's not!
While Halo certainly is a very good FPS game, I stand by my earlier claim that Edge magazine got it wrong; it's not 10/10 for me. The enemy AI is good - enemies duck for cover behind structures and shields - but it's not perfect; when they do come out, so far they have tended to run pretty much in straight lines and be fairly easy to kill. The main problem comes from the numbers that can attack at any one time. It is a very good game, but so far I wouldn't say that it is significantly better than Medal of Honour: Allied Assault or a few other PC FPS games. It certainly doesn't acheive anything that the PS2 (and probably Gamecube) couldn't do.
And finally, a few words on the controller. It is a little on the large side, and I find it a little painful after prolonged play. It's okay using the analogue sticks (though it feels very odd with them being offset as they are), but when needing to use the A, B, X or Y buttons, I find I have to re-adjust the grip of my right hand, otherwise it stretches the muscle between my thumb and forefinger, which eventually leads to cramp. I get the feeling that they could have reduced the size of the pad by about a third if they'd done away with that bloody great Xbox logo in the middle.
The A, B, X and Y buttons are also too close together for my liking, and I find myself distracted and having to look down at the pad to make sure I'm pressing the right one. When you consider the size of the pad, this seems quite ridiculous. Still, hopefully I'll get used to it.
The 'rumble effect' built into the pad is also not as good as that of the DualShock 2; it is very weak in comparison, and - for example - does not give the same level of feedback in PGR as the DualShock 2 does in GT3.
So, what about the over-all package?
Well, after my first play of both games, I was left feeling a little flat, not really knowing what to think. It certainly didn't 'wow' me as the PS2 did when I first got it. In fact, after an hour, I turned it off to watch some TV, and at one point contemplated returning it.
But after a few more hours playing time, I've pretty much decided against that, although I don't think I'll be buying any more games for it for a while; I'll just have to see what comes along. It *is* a good machine, but I've not yet seen anything that I don't believe could be done on the other platforms.
Others have mentioned that they plan to sell their PS2 to help fund an Xbox. That's their choice, but I would say don't be too hasty. Get some quality play time on some of the games available first, because you may not be as impressed as you think. I am lucky that I could afford an Xbox without trading in; I can tell you in all honesty now that, had I traded my PS2 for the Xbox, I would be kicking myself and regretting it severely.
This is my honest, unbiased opinion as an owner of both machines. Make of it what you will.
-----
I was looking at screens and videos of Halo on the Xbox all day yesterday, and got a strong urge to buy one.
So, after I got home from work, I went to my local Tesco's and bought one, together with a second controller, Halo and Project Gotham Racing.
I plugged everything in and powered it up. First thing you're presented with is the settings screen - very similar to the PS2's in what it offers, the main difference being that you can set 60Hz mode here, which is then used for all games - pretty cool. My major dislike about the menus and front-end is that it's all in shades of green, but that's just personal taste.
Other minor things I noticed were that (a) the machine is just as noisy as my PS2 (i.e. not very) and (b) there is a constant clickling sound from within - which I assume is the hard disk - but which you don't notice once a game is playing.
First game loaded up was Project Gotham Racing. This is the game that, according to Xbox magazine (not the official one) "makes GT3 look dump".
I can categorically say that this is not the case. The cars are well realised, but they just don't have the polish (no pun intended) that the cars in GT3 have. They're good, accurate models, but somehow don't have that 'real' look to them; they're more 'very lifelike cartoon' than photorealistic. The colours are bold and strong, rather than the subtleties of GT3.
Tracks are well designed, but the scenery again looks a little bland. There's plenty there, but the textures aren't particularly well detailed, with colour used in 'blocks'.
Replays are good, though again not up to GT3 standards. Reflections in the cars are a little blocky, and tend to move quite jerkily overy the surface of the car. And believe it or not, I did see pop-up in certain areas, and jaggies are just as evident here as in GT3; i.e. they are there, but are not significant. In terms of appearance, it probably falls somewhere between Ridge Racer V and GT3.
In terms of gameplay, it's good enough. The handling isn't anything like GT3, but then it's not supposed to be, as this is more of an arcade racer. It falls somewhere between GT3 and Burnout, I'd say. As with GT3, there are only 5 other cars in the race. Driver AI is also similar to GT3 in that cars will hit you if you're in their way - you can turn into a corner nice and smooth, and cars around you don't really deviate from their pre-determined racing line.
I have also found a fairly major bug! Quite frequently, when re-starting a race and having an automatic gearbox, the car suddenly goes into reverse gear and revs the engine without me touching a thing! Then when the countdown reaches "Go!" the car takes off backwards! I have found that some frantic pressing of the left (brake)and right (accelerate) trigger buttons solves the problem, but it gives the other cars one heck of a head start, and many times I've had to re-start the race again immediately.
Over all though, it's a solid arcade racer, similar to MSR on the Dreamcast. The only area this does have an advantage is the sound, because the music is presented as radio stations you can listen to, as in GT3 - but *real* radio stations, such as Capital FM and XFM. But in all honesty, I don't believe the over-all product is a patch on GT3.
Next up is Halo, the reason I bought the machine. The mother of all FPS games, apparently. And it really is rather good. You know how FPS games play, so I won't go into great details. What takes most getting used to is that you can only carry two weapons at any time, adding a significant strategy element to the game. As far as I have played, this hasn't really been an issue, as I've so far only had pistols and assault rifles in various forms; this may well become more of a factor later in the game.
At certain points you must control vehicles - so far I've only encountered the Warthog, and this is proving fairly difficult to control; you control acceleration with the left analogue stick, and steer by rotating the camera with the right analogue stick. Sounds easy, but wait until you try it... it's not!
While Halo certainly is a very good FPS game, I stand by my earlier claim that Edge magazine got it wrong; it's not 10/10 for me. The enemy AI is good - enemies duck for cover behind structures and shields - but it's not perfect; when they do come out, so far they have tended to run pretty much in straight lines and be fairly easy to kill. The main problem comes from the numbers that can attack at any one time. It is a very good game, but so far I wouldn't say that it is significantly better than Medal of Honour: Allied Assault or a few other PC FPS games. It certainly doesn't acheive anything that the PS2 (and probably Gamecube) couldn't do.
And finally, a few words on the controller. It is a little on the large side, and I find it a little painful after prolonged play. It's okay using the analogue sticks (though it feels very odd with them being offset as they are), but when needing to use the A, B, X or Y buttons, I find I have to re-adjust the grip of my right hand, otherwise it stretches the muscle between my thumb and forefinger, which eventually leads to cramp. I get the feeling that they could have reduced the size of the pad by about a third if they'd done away with that bloody great Xbox logo in the middle.
The A, B, X and Y buttons are also too close together for my liking, and I find myself distracted and having to look down at the pad to make sure I'm pressing the right one. When you consider the size of the pad, this seems quite ridiculous. Still, hopefully I'll get used to it.
The 'rumble effect' built into the pad is also not as good as that of the DualShock 2; it is very weak in comparison, and - for example - does not give the same level of feedback in PGR as the DualShock 2 does in GT3.
So, what about the over-all package?
Well, after my first play of both games, I was left feeling a little flat, not really knowing what to think. It certainly didn't 'wow' me as the PS2 did when I first got it. In fact, after an hour, I turned it off to watch some TV, and at one point contemplated returning it.
But after a few more hours playing time, I've pretty much decided against that, although I don't think I'll be buying any more games for it for a while; I'll just have to see what comes along. It *is* a good machine, but I've not yet seen anything that I don't believe could be done on the other platforms.
Others have mentioned that they plan to sell their PS2 to help fund an Xbox. That's their choice, but I would say don't be too hasty. Get some quality play time on some of the games available first, because you may not be as impressed as you think. I am lucky that I could afford an Xbox without trading in; I can tell you in all honesty now that, had I traded my PS2 for the Xbox, I would be kicking myself and regretting it severely.
This is my honest, unbiased opinion as an owner of both machines. Make of it what you will.
Page:
You really want a fight, don't you...
savatt1668 wrote:
> ½pint wrote:
> Oh dear. Now I'm mad.
--------
Because of the
> one fact that the N64 was on cartridges.
> Which resulted in developers
> going for the PlayStation, which was easier to
> develop for. That resulted
> in the PS having far more games, which were also
> cheaper. It is just
> because of having more games.
--------
Exactly, I was arguing over the fact
> that someone said that Nintendo are some kind of console king. The fact that
> developers switched to the PS1 because it was easier to develop for kinda
> underlines the fact that Nintendo aren't as spectacular as a lot of bitter
> Ninty's would have you believe.
**********
But you seem to misunderstand. The N64 was better than the PlayStation, but the reason that everybody got a PlayStation instead was because of the games. Popularity doesn't constitute quality, look at S-Club 7.
**********
--------
This is pure bigotism. Nintendo
> are holding out
> because they need to actually make the consoles before
> they sell them. If you
> actually had any kind of gaming knowledge, and
> actually looked into it, you
> would find that Ninty has many reasons for
> releasing the GC when it
> is.
--------
Come on then oh master of gaming
> knowledge, tell us why Nintendo is holding back while Microsoft and Sony take
> the risks.
**********
How do you mean, 'taking the risks'. If anything, its Nintendo that are taking the risks, since people will buy an Xbox rather than wait for a GameCube. I'm sure that if they could, they would release the GameCube tomorrow. Its a bit like fine wine, it takes time to mature...
**********
--------
That is just stupid. Sure, franchises such as
>
> Mario and Zelda are becoming a mere cash cow, but I'd sure as hell rather
> run
> around as Mario than some stupid genetically altered cyber-marine
> with
> bad-ass-big-gun things. Nintendo actually goes for fun games, rather
> than
> realism, and it is common knowledge that realism takes away a lot of
> the fun.
> Look at the Sims for a prime example...
--------
Ssshhhhh,
> don't tell anyone, but between you and me, I don't think everyone wants to run
> around as a cartoon plumber who looks like a German porn star constantly
> either.
And quite how you can compare Halo to The Sims is very
> "interesting". So if running round as a cyber marine is realistic and
> not fun, I guess that makes Resident Evil and Rogue Leader pretty pants too
> right ?
**********
Halo is in a minority, because Halo is fun. But, I find realistic games much more boring than cartoony games. Like Gran Turismo. There was a big following of people with this game because it was so realistic. There was also a lot of people who thought it was dull. The Sims gets very boring, because it simulates life, which is dull at the best of times. I'd rather be running around in fantasy than the real world, after all, have you ever read a non-fiction book that beats the likes of JRR Tolkien and JK Rowling?
**********
--------
This whole shape and size thing is silly. You buy a
> console
> to play games, not to look at. The Xbox is just the right size
> for a console,
> and fits snugly on top of a VCR or DVD player. As for the
> GameCube, a square
> shape isn't the most ergonomical, and as for having a
> top-opening lid...
But
> why argue about the actual shape of a
> console?
--------
Exactly, which is why I said if he wants to get a small
> portable console, get a GBA or something.
--------
No, this is where
> Microsoft are
> milking the cash cow. There is no proper reason why the
> Xbox couldn't be
> £200, except for extortion. It isn't broadband
> ready, and the hard drive
> only takes up about £20 of the price, not
> extra. You're getting this
> whole 'expensive hard drive' malarky from the
> price of the PS2
> one.
--------
Theres no reason the PS2 had to be
> £300 when it came out. Theres certainly no poxy reason the N64 had to be
> £250 when it came out. The Gamecube might be cheap, but if they ever
> decide to bring out a hard drive to enhance your gaming experience, do you
> really think they will put it out for £20 ? If your answer is yes then
> you have a cheek going on about my intellect. In this little world of pricing
> fairness of yours, shouldn't this make the Gamecube memory cards around
> £1.99 each ?
The hard drive isn't just about saving games, not as far
> as Microsoft are concerned anyway. A hard drive can improve loading times as
> well as add new things to games. When your playing a FPS like Halo, bodies,
> bullet holes and blood staines stay where they are. They don't just disappear
> after a few seconds making a room look perfect again. In a game such as an RPG,
> things you do early in the game can have concequences later on and effect
> certain things. If you cut someones face, they can go on to have a permanent
> scar on their face.
You can copy music from CD's onto the hard drive to use
> in certain games and once online, you can download things like new levels,
> costumes for characters, skins for an FPS, the list goes on. Enhancments like
> these would soon fill a small memory card, especially if other games are on it
> as well as the one that your trying to download extras
> for.
**********
You're right, the hard drive is much more. What I meant by the £20 thing, is that it only costs the producers an extra £20 or so to put a hard drive in a console. I don't disagree that its great keeping such extra detail like bullet holes in the walls, but would YOU spend an extra £150 for this little detail? I don't think so, and neither would the average Joe. And anyway, Consoles do have memory, so why not just increase this memory capacity, than have a hard drive? I don't think that an extra £150 constitutes all of this extra stuff. If you want to divulge in face-mapping, costumes and skins, why don't you stick to PC gaming. The same goes for downloading things. And anyway, in most games you can save all your new costumes and skins onto memory cards, not to mention having demo discs with the saves on them to transfer to the memory card.
**********
--------
Sarcasm is the
> lowest form of wit. And I'm still
> surprised that you have managed to use it in
> some form, judging by the
> rest of your intellect.
--------
Sometimes its the best way to communicate
> with blind Ninty's that only see what their machine is good at and whats crap
> about everything else. And don't talk to me like your some gaming guru cause
> your quite clearly not. Just another Ninty who thinks that they have signed up
> to an army who must defend Nintendo at all costs.
**********
What always seems funny to me is the way that people think they're better than everybody else. I see it everywhere; at school, on TV, and on Special Reserve. I'm not a blind ninty, and I know that the Xbox is a great console. I don't think its crap, and never have done. In fact, its due to your surprisingly small IQ that you've jumped to the conclusion that I hate the Xbox. I was merely saying how wrong you were about the GameCube, which is also a great console. I'm not a Ninty, never have been, never will be. I don't believe I'm a 'gaming guru' as you so clearly put it, although I do pride myself in the fact that I know what's what about gaming, and obviously you don't. Go clear your head of all this crap that you're spewing about Microsoft. The Xbox is great, the GameCube is great, so you should expand on your single-minded opinion that the Xbox is great and everything else is crap. A wise person once told me that you should judge a console by what it has to offer, not what it seems to lack.
**********
--------
Bill Gates
> hasn't done a damn thing about the
> Xbox, except by saying something along
> the lines of 'lets make a console and
> dominate that industry too'.
>
> Comprende?
--------
And of course Nintendo are in it for their
> "fans" right ? If Nintendo could dominate the gaming industry
> tomorrow, taking away Sony and Microsoft, they would of course refuse. When
> Sega went out of the hardware area, it was a real shame cause although they had
> flops, they always tried new ideas. Microsoft has come into the competition and
> are looking to take Sega's place in experimenting with various ideas to enhance
> a gamers experience with their games.
Nintendo are quite happy to just pump
> out the usual stuff, same s***, new wrapping as the saying goes.
The most
> adventurous Ninty seem to get when it comes to hardware is maybe a new
> controller. They refused to take the risk with Sony when they were paired
> together to go out of the cartridge format and look where that got them.
>
Microsoft might be a huge company, but at the same time thats no reason to
> hate them. Thats so typical of people over here - the build em up then knock em
> down attitude.
Of course Microsoft want to make money on this, but at least
> they're being adventurous with the console. They want to maximise the potential
> of the X-Box and are urging companies to use the consoles capabilities when
> developing for it. If Nintendo get stung again this time round, they'll have
> knowone to blame but themselves.
**********
Its funny the way you talk about Nintendo. I tell you, when it comes to the 'fans', Nintendo are much more friendly than everybody else. To think that Microsoft are the innovators in the industry is a plain lie, and to actually believe that Nintendo are just about maximising profits is absolutely laudable. Remember who are the innovator's? Who re-invented the analogue stick? Who first put to use rumble packs? Who were the first people to use microphones to communicate in games? And most of all, who are the people that are behind many of the new genres you see today, including kart racing, party games, 3D platformers etc. You think that Xbox are the originators, yet the only thing they've introduced is a compulsory hard drive which adds an extra £100 to the price. Very um... 'innovative'. Yeah right.
I usually get annoyed with people who go on about the PS2 being the best console, but to find an Xbox fan with such a one-track mind is surprising. I know what's what about the Xbox, and the GameCube, and the PlayStation 2. The only valid points which you like to say about the Xbox, is that the hard drive makes the console better than others, and constitues a massive price increase. I didn't realise that the mark-up was 800%. Realism is rarely fun, yet you'd have somebody believe that Jesus was going to be reincarnated the way you go on about Halo. Halo is a great game, yet it still isn't realistic in the boring way that Gran Turismo is. Have you ever encountered Aliens hiding behind laser-induced light shields? Nope.
As I've said, the Xbox is a great console, but you really ought to see other consoles for what they have. The fact that they're lacking a hard drive doesn't make them crap by any means.
**********
:D
--------
:(
--------
I find it so funny when people have to resort to their imaginations when finding a plausable argument for or against something.
savatt1668 wrote:
> ½pint wrote:
> Oh dear. Now I'm mad.
--------
Because of the
> one fact that the N64 was on cartridges.
> Which resulted in developers
> going for the PlayStation, which was easier to
> develop for. That resulted
> in the PS having far more games, which were also
> cheaper. It is just
> because of having more games.
--------
Exactly, I was arguing over the fact
> that someone said that Nintendo are some kind of console king. The fact that
> developers switched to the PS1 because it was easier to develop for kinda
> underlines the fact that Nintendo aren't as spectacular as a lot of bitter
> Ninty's would have you believe.
**********
But you seem to misunderstand. The N64 was better than the PlayStation, but the reason that everybody got a PlayStation instead was because of the games. Popularity doesn't constitute quality, look at S-Club 7.
**********
--------
This is pure bigotism. Nintendo
> are holding out
> because they need to actually make the consoles before
> they sell them. If you
> actually had any kind of gaming knowledge, and
> actually looked into it, you
> would find that Ninty has many reasons for
> releasing the GC when it
> is.
--------
Come on then oh master of gaming
> knowledge, tell us why Nintendo is holding back while Microsoft and Sony take
> the risks.
**********
How do you mean, 'taking the risks'. If anything, its Nintendo that are taking the risks, since people will buy an Xbox rather than wait for a GameCube. I'm sure that if they could, they would release the GameCube tomorrow. Its a bit like fine wine, it takes time to mature...
**********
--------
That is just stupid. Sure, franchises such as
>
> Mario and Zelda are becoming a mere cash cow, but I'd sure as hell rather
> run
> around as Mario than some stupid genetically altered cyber-marine
> with
> bad-ass-big-gun things. Nintendo actually goes for fun games, rather
> than
> realism, and it is common knowledge that realism takes away a lot of
> the fun.
> Look at the Sims for a prime example...
--------
Ssshhhhh,
> don't tell anyone, but between you and me, I don't think everyone wants to run
> around as a cartoon plumber who looks like a German porn star constantly
> either.
And quite how you can compare Halo to The Sims is very
> "interesting". So if running round as a cyber marine is realistic and
> not fun, I guess that makes Resident Evil and Rogue Leader pretty pants too
> right ?
**********
Halo is in a minority, because Halo is fun. But, I find realistic games much more boring than cartoony games. Like Gran Turismo. There was a big following of people with this game because it was so realistic. There was also a lot of people who thought it was dull. The Sims gets very boring, because it simulates life, which is dull at the best of times. I'd rather be running around in fantasy than the real world, after all, have you ever read a non-fiction book that beats the likes of JRR Tolkien and JK Rowling?
**********
--------
This whole shape and size thing is silly. You buy a
> console
> to play games, not to look at. The Xbox is just the right size
> for a console,
> and fits snugly on top of a VCR or DVD player. As for the
> GameCube, a square
> shape isn't the most ergonomical, and as for having a
> top-opening lid...
But
> why argue about the actual shape of a
> console?
--------
Exactly, which is why I said if he wants to get a small
> portable console, get a GBA or something.
--------
No, this is where
> Microsoft are
> milking the cash cow. There is no proper reason why the
> Xbox couldn't be
> £200, except for extortion. It isn't broadband
> ready, and the hard drive
> only takes up about £20 of the price, not
> extra. You're getting this
> whole 'expensive hard drive' malarky from the
> price of the PS2
> one.
--------
Theres no reason the PS2 had to be
> £300 when it came out. Theres certainly no poxy reason the N64 had to be
> £250 when it came out. The Gamecube might be cheap, but if they ever
> decide to bring out a hard drive to enhance your gaming experience, do you
> really think they will put it out for £20 ? If your answer is yes then
> you have a cheek going on about my intellect. In this little world of pricing
> fairness of yours, shouldn't this make the Gamecube memory cards around
> £1.99 each ?
The hard drive isn't just about saving games, not as far
> as Microsoft are concerned anyway. A hard drive can improve loading times as
> well as add new things to games. When your playing a FPS like Halo, bodies,
> bullet holes and blood staines stay where they are. They don't just disappear
> after a few seconds making a room look perfect again. In a game such as an RPG,
> things you do early in the game can have concequences later on and effect
> certain things. If you cut someones face, they can go on to have a permanent
> scar on their face.
You can copy music from CD's onto the hard drive to use
> in certain games and once online, you can download things like new levels,
> costumes for characters, skins for an FPS, the list goes on. Enhancments like
> these would soon fill a small memory card, especially if other games are on it
> as well as the one that your trying to download extras
> for.
**********
You're right, the hard drive is much more. What I meant by the £20 thing, is that it only costs the producers an extra £20 or so to put a hard drive in a console. I don't disagree that its great keeping such extra detail like bullet holes in the walls, but would YOU spend an extra £150 for this little detail? I don't think so, and neither would the average Joe. And anyway, Consoles do have memory, so why not just increase this memory capacity, than have a hard drive? I don't think that an extra £150 constitutes all of this extra stuff. If you want to divulge in face-mapping, costumes and skins, why don't you stick to PC gaming. The same goes for downloading things. And anyway, in most games you can save all your new costumes and skins onto memory cards, not to mention having demo discs with the saves on them to transfer to the memory card.
**********
--------
Sarcasm is the
> lowest form of wit. And I'm still
> surprised that you have managed to use it in
> some form, judging by the
> rest of your intellect.
--------
Sometimes its the best way to communicate
> with blind Ninty's that only see what their machine is good at and whats crap
> about everything else. And don't talk to me like your some gaming guru cause
> your quite clearly not. Just another Ninty who thinks that they have signed up
> to an army who must defend Nintendo at all costs.
**********
What always seems funny to me is the way that people think they're better than everybody else. I see it everywhere; at school, on TV, and on Special Reserve. I'm not a blind ninty, and I know that the Xbox is a great console. I don't think its crap, and never have done. In fact, its due to your surprisingly small IQ that you've jumped to the conclusion that I hate the Xbox. I was merely saying how wrong you were about the GameCube, which is also a great console. I'm not a Ninty, never have been, never will be. I don't believe I'm a 'gaming guru' as you so clearly put it, although I do pride myself in the fact that I know what's what about gaming, and obviously you don't. Go clear your head of all this crap that you're spewing about Microsoft. The Xbox is great, the GameCube is great, so you should expand on your single-minded opinion that the Xbox is great and everything else is crap. A wise person once told me that you should judge a console by what it has to offer, not what it seems to lack.
**********
--------
Bill Gates
> hasn't done a damn thing about the
> Xbox, except by saying something along
> the lines of 'lets make a console and
> dominate that industry too'.
>
> Comprende?
--------
And of course Nintendo are in it for their
> "fans" right ? If Nintendo could dominate the gaming industry
> tomorrow, taking away Sony and Microsoft, they would of course refuse. When
> Sega went out of the hardware area, it was a real shame cause although they had
> flops, they always tried new ideas. Microsoft has come into the competition and
> are looking to take Sega's place in experimenting with various ideas to enhance
> a gamers experience with their games.
Nintendo are quite happy to just pump
> out the usual stuff, same s***, new wrapping as the saying goes.
The most
> adventurous Ninty seem to get when it comes to hardware is maybe a new
> controller. They refused to take the risk with Sony when they were paired
> together to go out of the cartridge format and look where that got them.
>
Microsoft might be a huge company, but at the same time thats no reason to
> hate them. Thats so typical of people over here - the build em up then knock em
> down attitude.
Of course Microsoft want to make money on this, but at least
> they're being adventurous with the console. They want to maximise the potential
> of the X-Box and are urging companies to use the consoles capabilities when
> developing for it. If Nintendo get stung again this time round, they'll have
> knowone to blame but themselves.
**********
Its funny the way you talk about Nintendo. I tell you, when it comes to the 'fans', Nintendo are much more friendly than everybody else. To think that Microsoft are the innovators in the industry is a plain lie, and to actually believe that Nintendo are just about maximising profits is absolutely laudable. Remember who are the innovator's? Who re-invented the analogue stick? Who first put to use rumble packs? Who were the first people to use microphones to communicate in games? And most of all, who are the people that are behind many of the new genres you see today, including kart racing, party games, 3D platformers etc. You think that Xbox are the originators, yet the only thing they've introduced is a compulsory hard drive which adds an extra £100 to the price. Very um... 'innovative'. Yeah right.
I usually get annoyed with people who go on about the PS2 being the best console, but to find an Xbox fan with such a one-track mind is surprising. I know what's what about the Xbox, and the GameCube, and the PlayStation 2. The only valid points which you like to say about the Xbox, is that the hard drive makes the console better than others, and constitues a massive price increase. I didn't realise that the mark-up was 800%. Realism is rarely fun, yet you'd have somebody believe that Jesus was going to be reincarnated the way you go on about Halo. Halo is a great game, yet it still isn't realistic in the boring way that Gran Turismo is. Have you ever encountered Aliens hiding behind laser-induced light shields? Nope.
As I've said, the Xbox is a great console, but you really ought to see other consoles for what they have. The fact that they're lacking a hard drive doesn't make them crap by any means.
**********
:D
--------
:(
--------
I find it so funny when people have to resort to their imaginations when finding a plausable argument for or against something.
Meh, again we decsend nto console wars.
Can't we try to keep this thread about what we think about the Xbox?
I played Amped to day, and the feeling of general underwhelment (that IS a word, honest) remains.
Apparently the game takes some getting used to, but it just seemed really basic to me, and it had to slow down mid way through a course to load more data, (or that's what I assume it was and not Megadrive style slowdown)
And I didn't think they used the pad as they should have done for that game, the triggers shouldn't have made the guy turn, it didn't seem right.
But anyway, it's another game I've played in a genre i don't overly like.
But that's my problem with the Xbox, where are the adventures?
Can't we try to keep this thread about what we think about the Xbox?
I played Amped to day, and the feeling of general underwhelment (that IS a word, honest) remains.
Apparently the game takes some getting used to, but it just seemed really basic to me, and it had to slow down mid way through a course to load more data, (or that's what I assume it was and not Megadrive style slowdown)
And I didn't think they used the pad as they should have done for that game, the triggers shouldn't have made the guy turn, it didn't seem right.
But anyway, it's another game I've played in a genre i don't overly like.
But that's my problem with the Xbox, where are the adventures?
true but now it is out people have seen that it is isn't as big as people thought and it is decent
Strange how that, now it is actually out, the X-box is more popular here. Before, everyone was against it.
Anyway, I probably wont get any of the next gen consoles. Tired of games.
Anyway, I probably wont get any of the next gen consoles. Tired of games.
That is the reason i am probly going to chose a XBOX over a GameCube, the XBOX has got a lot of support behind them and has a lot of space in it.
Nintendo are too arrogant. They are relying simply on their reputation and legions of fans in order to sell consoles. That, and the fact that parents will be more willing to shell out £170 for an GC for their kiddies, than £300 for an XBox.
To be honest, unless I see some first class non-cartoony releases for the GC, I'll be far more likely to get an XBox.
To be honest, unless I see some first class non-cartoony releases for the GC, I'll be far more likely to get an XBox.
Judging by the situation since Sony arrived on the scene, Shigsy quite clearly doesn't. ;-)
Seriously though, he is great at what he does, but Nintendo need more than him if they are going to claw they're way back to a good position. A lot more.
Seriously though, he is great at what he does, but Nintendo need more than him if they are going to claw they're way back to a good position. A lot more.
Stop the replt quote thing!
Shigsy Rules.... the END!
Shigsy Rules.... the END!
½pint wrote:
> Oh dear. Now I'm mad.
--------
Because of the one fact that the N64 was on cartridges.
> Which resulted in developers going for the PlayStation, which was easier to
> develop for. That resulted in the PS having far more games, which were also
> cheaper. It is just because of having more games.
--------
Exactly, I was arguing over the fact that someone said that Nintendo are some kind of console king. The fact that developers switched to the PS1 because it was easier to develop for kinda underlines the fact that Nintendo aren't as spectacular as a lot of bitter Ninty's would have you believe.
--------
This is pure bigotism. Nintendo are holding out
> because they need to actually make the consoles before they sell them. If you
> actually had any kind of gaming knowledge, and actually looked into it, you
> would find that Ninty has many reasons for releasing the GC when it
> is.
--------
Come on then oh master of gaming knowledge, tell us why Nintendo is holding back while Microsoft and Sony take the risks.
--------
That is just stupid. Sure, franchises such as
> Mario and Zelda are becoming a mere cash cow, but I'd sure as hell rather run
> around as Mario than some stupid genetically altered cyber-marine with
> bad-ass-big-gun things. Nintendo actually goes for fun games, rather than
> realism, and it is common knowledge that realism takes away a lot of the fun.
> Look at the Sims for a prime example...
--------
Ssshhhhh, don't tell anyone, but between you and me, I don't think everyone wants to run around as a cartoon plumber who looks like a German porn star constantly either.
And quite how you can compare Halo to The Sims is very "interesting". So if running round as a cyber marine is realistic and not fun, I guess that makes Resident Evil and Rogue Leader pretty pants too right ?
--------
This whole shape and size thing is silly. You buy a console
> to play games, not to look at. The Xbox is just the right size for a console,
> and fits snugly on top of a VCR or DVD player. As for the GameCube, a square
> shape isn't the most ergonomical, and as for having a top-opening lid...
But
> why argue about the actual shape of a console?
--------
Exactly, which is why I said if he wants to get a small portable console, get a GBA or something.
--------
No, this is where Microsoft are
> milking the cash cow. There is no proper reason why the Xbox couldn't be
> £200, except for extortion. It isn't broadband ready, and the hard drive
> only takes up about £20 of the price, not extra. You're getting this
> whole 'expensive hard drive' malarky from the price of the PS2
> one.
--------
Theres no reason the PS2 had to be £300 when it came out. Theres certainly no poxy reason the N64 had to be £250 when it came out. The Gamecube might be cheap, but if they ever decide to bring out a hard drive to enhance your gaming experience, do you really think they will put it out for £20 ? If your answer is yes then you have a cheek going on about my intellect. In this little world of pricing fairness of yours, shouldn't this make the Gamecube memory cards around £1.99 each ?
The hard drive isn't just about saving games, not as far as Microsoft are concerned anyway. A hard drive can improve loading times as well as add new things to games. When your playing a FPS like Halo, bodies, bullet holes and blood staines stay where they are. They don't just disappear after a few seconds making a room look perfect again. In a game such as an RPG, things you do early in the game can have concequences later on and effect certain things. If you cut someones face, they can go on to have a permanent scar on their face.
You can copy music from CD's onto the hard drive to use in certain games and once online, you can download things like new levels, costumes for characters, skins for an FPS, the list goes on. Enhancments like these would soon fill a small memory card, especially if other games are on it as well as the one that your trying to download extras for.
--------
Sarcasm is the
> lowest form of wit. And I'm still surprised that you have managed to use it in
> some form, judging by the rest of your intellect.
--------
Sometimes its the best way to communicate with blind Ninty's that only see what their machine is good at and whats crap about everything else. And don't talk to me like your some gaming guru cause your quite clearly not. Just another Ninty who thinks that they have signed up to an army who must defend Nintendo at all costs.
--------
Bill Gates hasn't done a damn thing about the
> Xbox, except by saying something along the lines of 'lets make a console and
> dominate that industry too'.
> Comprende?
--------
And of course Nintendo are in it for their "fans" right ? If Nintendo could dominate the gaming industry tomorrow, taking away Sony and Microsoft, they would of course refuse. When Sega went out of the hardware area, it was a real shame cause although they had flops, they always tried new ideas. Microsoft has come into the competition and are looking to take Sega's place in experimenting with various ideas to enhance a gamers experience with their games.
Nintendo are quite happy to just pump out the usual stuff, same s***, new wrapping as the saying goes.
The most adventurous Ninty seem to get when it comes to hardware is maybe a new controller. They refused to take the risk with Sony when they were paired together to go out of the cartridge format and look where that got them.
Microsoft might be a huge company, but at the same time thats no reason to hate them. Thats so typical of people over here - the build em up then knock em down attitude.
Of course Microsoft want to make money on this, but at least they're being adventurous with the console. They want to maximise the potential of the X-Box and are urging companies to use the consoles capabilities when developing for it. If Nintendo get stung again this time round, they'll have knowone to blame but themselves.
:D
--------
:(
--------
> Oh dear. Now I'm mad.
--------
Because of the one fact that the N64 was on cartridges.
> Which resulted in developers going for the PlayStation, which was easier to
> develop for. That resulted in the PS having far more games, which were also
> cheaper. It is just because of having more games.
--------
Exactly, I was arguing over the fact that someone said that Nintendo are some kind of console king. The fact that developers switched to the PS1 because it was easier to develop for kinda underlines the fact that Nintendo aren't as spectacular as a lot of bitter Ninty's would have you believe.
--------
This is pure bigotism. Nintendo are holding out
> because they need to actually make the consoles before they sell them. If you
> actually had any kind of gaming knowledge, and actually looked into it, you
> would find that Ninty has many reasons for releasing the GC when it
> is.
--------
Come on then oh master of gaming knowledge, tell us why Nintendo is holding back while Microsoft and Sony take the risks.
--------
That is just stupid. Sure, franchises such as
> Mario and Zelda are becoming a mere cash cow, but I'd sure as hell rather run
> around as Mario than some stupid genetically altered cyber-marine with
> bad-ass-big-gun things. Nintendo actually goes for fun games, rather than
> realism, and it is common knowledge that realism takes away a lot of the fun.
> Look at the Sims for a prime example...
--------
Ssshhhhh, don't tell anyone, but between you and me, I don't think everyone wants to run around as a cartoon plumber who looks like a German porn star constantly either.
And quite how you can compare Halo to The Sims is very "interesting". So if running round as a cyber marine is realistic and not fun, I guess that makes Resident Evil and Rogue Leader pretty pants too right ?
--------
This whole shape and size thing is silly. You buy a console
> to play games, not to look at. The Xbox is just the right size for a console,
> and fits snugly on top of a VCR or DVD player. As for the GameCube, a square
> shape isn't the most ergonomical, and as for having a top-opening lid...
But
> why argue about the actual shape of a console?
--------
Exactly, which is why I said if he wants to get a small portable console, get a GBA or something.
--------
No, this is where Microsoft are
> milking the cash cow. There is no proper reason why the Xbox couldn't be
> £200, except for extortion. It isn't broadband ready, and the hard drive
> only takes up about £20 of the price, not extra. You're getting this
> whole 'expensive hard drive' malarky from the price of the PS2
> one.
--------
Theres no reason the PS2 had to be £300 when it came out. Theres certainly no poxy reason the N64 had to be £250 when it came out. The Gamecube might be cheap, but if they ever decide to bring out a hard drive to enhance your gaming experience, do you really think they will put it out for £20 ? If your answer is yes then you have a cheek going on about my intellect. In this little world of pricing fairness of yours, shouldn't this make the Gamecube memory cards around £1.99 each ?
The hard drive isn't just about saving games, not as far as Microsoft are concerned anyway. A hard drive can improve loading times as well as add new things to games. When your playing a FPS like Halo, bodies, bullet holes and blood staines stay where they are. They don't just disappear after a few seconds making a room look perfect again. In a game such as an RPG, things you do early in the game can have concequences later on and effect certain things. If you cut someones face, they can go on to have a permanent scar on their face.
You can copy music from CD's onto the hard drive to use in certain games and once online, you can download things like new levels, costumes for characters, skins for an FPS, the list goes on. Enhancments like these would soon fill a small memory card, especially if other games are on it as well as the one that your trying to download extras for.
--------
Sarcasm is the
> lowest form of wit. And I'm still surprised that you have managed to use it in
> some form, judging by the rest of your intellect.
--------
Sometimes its the best way to communicate with blind Ninty's that only see what their machine is good at and whats crap about everything else. And don't talk to me like your some gaming guru cause your quite clearly not. Just another Ninty who thinks that they have signed up to an army who must defend Nintendo at all costs.
--------
Bill Gates hasn't done a damn thing about the
> Xbox, except by saying something along the lines of 'lets make a console and
> dominate that industry too'.
> Comprende?
--------
And of course Nintendo are in it for their "fans" right ? If Nintendo could dominate the gaming industry tomorrow, taking away Sony and Microsoft, they would of course refuse. When Sega went out of the hardware area, it was a real shame cause although they had flops, they always tried new ideas. Microsoft has come into the competition and are looking to take Sega's place in experimenting with various ideas to enhance a gamers experience with their games.
Nintendo are quite happy to just pump out the usual stuff, same s***, new wrapping as the saying goes.
The most adventurous Ninty seem to get when it comes to hardware is maybe a new controller. They refused to take the risk with Sony when they were paired together to go out of the cartridge format and look where that got them.
Microsoft might be a huge company, but at the same time thats no reason to hate them. Thats so typical of people over here - the build em up then knock em down attitude.
Of course Microsoft want to make money on this, but at least they're being adventurous with the console. They want to maximise the potential of the X-Box and are urging companies to use the consoles capabilities when developing for it. If Nintendo get stung again this time round, they'll have knowone to blame but themselves.
:D
--------
:(
--------
All they needed Bill Gates for was to market it... because he is so famous it will sell.
It sat back in his comfy computerised home and maybe just maybe gave sommat like 3 ideas to the cause!
It sat back in his comfy computerised home and maybe just maybe gave sommat like 3 ideas to the cause!
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