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How do you judge a console? By it's games?
Well, personally, I think there's a bit more to it than that. After all, the Neo Geo may have boasted perfect arcade games, but at obver £200 per game(!) you could hardly say that the console was that great! So pricing is also an important factor.
Another is treating customers well- a console with good games, but erratic release dates, massive price variations and no structure to sales can't be considered a great console... the Saturn is just one example of this.
So, when taking all these points into account, and some more, how does the N64 sum up?
Well, on the games front, the console has mixed success. There were some completely revolutionary games- Mario 64, Goldeneye and Zelda must feature as some of the best consoles games ever. For that reason alone, the N64 will be a must have for any serious console enthusiast.
However, during the life of the consoles, quality game releases were erratic. There could be months at a time without a really good game being released. Month between revolutionary games is fine and pretty normal, but months between quality games is just disapointing.
There was also the serious problem of missing support meaning that genres like Realistic Racers and Realistic Fighters were completely missing from the console. Even big genres like RPGs had games few and far between.
Well, moving away from that games, what about the pricing of the console?
I think anyone will agree that games were far too expensive. The only reason for this being that Ninty had decided to use a medium that stored less data but cost more to make.
OK, so there's more to it than that- no loading times vs higher price. Piracy vs more FMV sequences.
But when the other consoles are offering £35 for a new game, and £20 for a platinum game, £50 is far too much for anyone to afford regular games (although by the time a good game came out, you'd probably have saved enough!).
However, one big problem with the console was the marketting- releasing it at £250 and then dropping it to £150 within 2 weeks destroyed customer confidence. In fact, the console only released with 1 game in Japan anyway (with only 4 games 3 months later), and only 3 games in the UK!
So, my views on the console?
In the long term, it is certainly a classic all time must have. Games like Zelda and Mario just say it all!
However, during the console's life itself, the console wasn't anywhere near as great as people made out. Releases alwasy on the horizon and months of waiting just made it unbearable!
Sonic
Well, personally, I think there's a bit more to it than that. After all, the Neo Geo may have boasted perfect arcade games, but at obver £200 per game(!) you could hardly say that the console was that great! So pricing is also an important factor.
Another is treating customers well- a console with good games, but erratic release dates, massive price variations and no structure to sales can't be considered a great console... the Saturn is just one example of this.
So, when taking all these points into account, and some more, how does the N64 sum up?
Well, on the games front, the console has mixed success. There were some completely revolutionary games- Mario 64, Goldeneye and Zelda must feature as some of the best consoles games ever. For that reason alone, the N64 will be a must have for any serious console enthusiast.
However, during the life of the consoles, quality game releases were erratic. There could be months at a time without a really good game being released. Month between revolutionary games is fine and pretty normal, but months between quality games is just disapointing.
There was also the serious problem of missing support meaning that genres like Realistic Racers and Realistic Fighters were completely missing from the console. Even big genres like RPGs had games few and far between.
Well, moving away from that games, what about the pricing of the console?
I think anyone will agree that games were far too expensive. The only reason for this being that Ninty had decided to use a medium that stored less data but cost more to make.
OK, so there's more to it than that- no loading times vs higher price. Piracy vs more FMV sequences.
But when the other consoles are offering £35 for a new game, and £20 for a platinum game, £50 is far too much for anyone to afford regular games (although by the time a good game came out, you'd probably have saved enough!).
However, one big problem with the console was the marketting- releasing it at £250 and then dropping it to £150 within 2 weeks destroyed customer confidence. In fact, the console only released with 1 game in Japan anyway (with only 4 games 3 months later), and only 3 games in the UK!
So, my views on the console?
In the long term, it is certainly a classic all time must have. Games like Zelda and Mario just say it all!
However, during the console's life itself, the console wasn't anywhere near as great as people made out. Releases alwasy on the horizon and months of waiting just made it unbearable!
Sonic
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Lol... oddly enough lots of people say that I make them laugh... or at least I used to before I became a reclusive Mathematition doing 6 A levels... hmmmm...
Anyway, you're right about Tekken. Oh, and I was a bit wary of mentioning it because Virtua Fighter came first anyway! But hey, if a statistics worth quoting, it's worth making up! (Got me an A grade in GCSE history! Did you know that 80% of under 18 soldiers died in WW1?) ;)
Sonic
Anyway, you're right about Tekken. Oh, and I was a bit wary of mentioning it because Virtua Fighter came first anyway! But hey, if a statistics worth quoting, it's worth making up! (Got me an A grade in GCSE history! Did you know that 80% of under 18 soldiers died in WW1?) ;)
Sonic
Sonic that made me laugh... but I must disagree on one point, about the Tekken was the ultimate 3D fighter thing...
It's been said before, but Tekken is 3D in appearance only... There is not 3D gameplay, the only implementation of 3D is allowing you to sidestep or side roll, which adds VERY little to gameplay... as it's been said, it is a 2D game with 3D graphics...
It's been said before, but Tekken is 3D in appearance only... There is not 3D gameplay, the only implementation of 3D is allowing you to sidestep or side roll, which adds VERY little to gameplay... as it's been said, it is a 2D game with 3D graphics...
BenKaye wrote:
"Um, was someone just comparing the playstation with the n64? With all due respect (wow, I sound sicilian), the ps1 was not a proper games console. Disregarding the n64 termporarily (don't worry, this is going somewhere), the ps1 was an after-pub thingy that attracted a lot of 1st time console owners, lairy old divorced men looking for a quick-fix way to make them feel younger, and of course the obligatory mid-20s."
WHAT TOSH! The PS was designed to be aimed at the young adult market: the 20-somethings that have disposable income. It hit this market perfectly in terms of image, games and sales.
Of course, there is the notion that the PS is an "after pub" console, and therefore not a "real game console" at all. However, this couldn't be further from the truth. In fact, the 20-something audience were the people who grew up during the golden age of gaming. The PS saw some of gaming's finest moments: massmarket acceptance of gaming; increase in the number of gamers allowing more and more expensive games to be made; some excellent games.
To completely disregard the PS as not being a serious console is ust plain arrogant. I could equally as easily say: "N64 was a kids console".
_____________________________________________
"To actually play the games was akin to watching extremely boring paint, that had just won Most Boring Paint Competition on a very boring planet, teach in a very slow and methodical way, how to bore paint-enthusiasts to very small pots of boring paint. "
OK, this has to be one of the STUPIDEST things I have ever read on these forums. There were some boring, rubbish PS games. Then again, there were some boring N64 games too. There were also plenty of gems- Final Fantasy is easily a cometitor for the greatest RPG series ever, GT has set the standard in racing games, Tekken is the definative 3d fighter etc etc....
_____________________________________
"So to return to my initial argument, whatever the hell it was..."
Proving you were an arrogant moron perhaps???
"...it doesn't matter about the minutiae of the n64's foibles, because a clockwork paint-stripper with a dicky timing belt (you'll have to excuse me, my ford fiesta has had more work done to it than michael jackson's face, and I'm semi-fluent in mechanic) is better than that overblown cd player (and crap at that too!)."
What nonsense. Yes, the PS plays CDs. However, this came as a byproduct of using the CD medium to begin with. Do you know WHY Sony entered into the console market?
Answer: NINTENDO asked Sony to help them make the sequal to the SNES (codename: PSX), which would be CD based. They wanted Cds because they were CHEAP to make and had MORE memory which was great for sound and fmv sequences.
The deal broke off for a number of reasons (both sides were at fault), and Sony turned the idea into the Playstation.
__________________________
"By the way, I'm new to special reserve's chatroom, so you'll be sure to hear plenty from my gob about utter crap. So get used to it."
A newbie who ADMITS he's going to talk absolute rubbish! Wow, maybe honesty isn't a lost cause!
"Um, was someone just comparing the playstation with the n64? With all due respect (wow, I sound sicilian), the ps1 was not a proper games console. Disregarding the n64 termporarily (don't worry, this is going somewhere), the ps1 was an after-pub thingy that attracted a lot of 1st time console owners, lairy old divorced men looking for a quick-fix way to make them feel younger, and of course the obligatory mid-20s."
WHAT TOSH! The PS was designed to be aimed at the young adult market: the 20-somethings that have disposable income. It hit this market perfectly in terms of image, games and sales.
Of course, there is the notion that the PS is an "after pub" console, and therefore not a "real game console" at all. However, this couldn't be further from the truth. In fact, the 20-something audience were the people who grew up during the golden age of gaming. The PS saw some of gaming's finest moments: massmarket acceptance of gaming; increase in the number of gamers allowing more and more expensive games to be made; some excellent games.
To completely disregard the PS as not being a serious console is ust plain arrogant. I could equally as easily say: "N64 was a kids console".
_____________________________________________
"To actually play the games was akin to watching extremely boring paint, that had just won Most Boring Paint Competition on a very boring planet, teach in a very slow and methodical way, how to bore paint-enthusiasts to very small pots of boring paint. "
OK, this has to be one of the STUPIDEST things I have ever read on these forums. There were some boring, rubbish PS games. Then again, there were some boring N64 games too. There were also plenty of gems- Final Fantasy is easily a cometitor for the greatest RPG series ever, GT has set the standard in racing games, Tekken is the definative 3d fighter etc etc....
_____________________________________
"So to return to my initial argument, whatever the hell it was..."
Proving you were an arrogant moron perhaps???
"...it doesn't matter about the minutiae of the n64's foibles, because a clockwork paint-stripper with a dicky timing belt (you'll have to excuse me, my ford fiesta has had more work done to it than michael jackson's face, and I'm semi-fluent in mechanic) is better than that overblown cd player (and crap at that too!)."
What nonsense. Yes, the PS plays CDs. However, this came as a byproduct of using the CD medium to begin with. Do you know WHY Sony entered into the console market?
Answer: NINTENDO asked Sony to help them make the sequal to the SNES (codename: PSX), which would be CD based. They wanted Cds because they were CHEAP to make and had MORE memory which was great for sound and fmv sequences.
The deal broke off for a number of reasons (both sides were at fault), and Sony turned the idea into the Playstation.
__________________________
"By the way, I'm new to special reserve's chatroom, so you'll be sure to hear plenty from my gob about utter crap. So get used to it."
A newbie who ADMITS he's going to talk absolute rubbish! Wow, maybe honesty isn't a lost cause!
Pantoffel wrote:
> Strafex, that would be a damn good idea, pitting all three console players
> against each other, it would be revolutionary! However, I doubt that Sony would
> win, and doubt even more that Nintendo would win, as X Box have them
> outnumbered, I would think. This is purely my sentiments, but I would think that
> more of the X Box's gamers are PC gamers also than any other console, hence
> they're probably better at shooters, hence this will help them when playing
> against PS2 and GC gamers, as they will have an advantage.
The way I see it, the more Xbox owners that join the game, the higher my kill count becomes! ;-)
Seriously though, even if the majority of online gamers are Xbox owners, games will normally consist of 8 Vs 8 teams so we won't have to take them all at once.
Unfortunately, Nintendo are being deliberately awkward over the online business. Luckily, Sega are pushing them into releasing the modem for Phatasy Star online.
Now if Gamecube's can log onto Sega for Sega games, there's no reason why companies (like Acclaim - Turok Evolution), can't run their own servers for their own games (most already do for PC games!).
So seeing as (Acclaim in this example) are develloping (Turok Evolution in this case) multiformat, they could design it so all 4 formats (Xbox, PS2, GC and PC) can play against each other across Acclaims server.
It's a nice idea but will they bother?
> Strafex, that would be a damn good idea, pitting all three console players
> against each other, it would be revolutionary! However, I doubt that Sony would
> win, and doubt even more that Nintendo would win, as X Box have them
> outnumbered, I would think. This is purely my sentiments, but I would think that
> more of the X Box's gamers are PC gamers also than any other console, hence
> they're probably better at shooters, hence this will help them when playing
> against PS2 and GC gamers, as they will have an advantage.
The way I see it, the more Xbox owners that join the game, the higher my kill count becomes! ;-)
Seriously though, even if the majority of online gamers are Xbox owners, games will normally consist of 8 Vs 8 teams so we won't have to take them all at once.
Unfortunately, Nintendo are being deliberately awkward over the online business. Luckily, Sega are pushing them into releasing the modem for Phatasy Star online.
Now if Gamecube's can log onto Sega for Sega games, there's no reason why companies (like Acclaim - Turok Evolution), can't run their own servers for their own games (most already do for PC games!).
So seeing as (Acclaim in this example) are develloping (Turok Evolution in this case) multiformat, they could design it so all 4 formats (Xbox, PS2, GC and PC) can play against each other across Acclaims server.
It's a nice idea but will they bother?
eskimo-bob2000 wrote:
1. Zelda:OOT is not "kiddy"
> just because it's not got blood squirting all over the place.
I think it is.
2. It's not a
> rip off from MGS & Tomb Raider because the first Zelda was out way before
> any of them came out.
I'm talking about Ocarina of Time not the early NES titles.
3. It's not average its way better than any of the
> games that will ever come out on the PS & PS2.
whatever you say but I found playing Devil May Cry and Metal Gear Solid 2 a relief from the fuzzy graphics, irratating analog stick and arcade like sounds.
So get your facts straight
> before u start dissing nintendo.
I'm not dissing Nintendo, I happen to like their games but just feel dissapointed if these are all those "classics" everyone's always talking about.
On the other hand Perfect Dark is quite awesome :-)
1. Zelda:OOT is not "kiddy"
> just because it's not got blood squirting all over the place.
I think it is.
2. It's not a
> rip off from MGS & Tomb Raider because the first Zelda was out way before
> any of them came out.
I'm talking about Ocarina of Time not the early NES titles.
3. It's not average its way better than any of the
> games that will ever come out on the PS & PS2.
whatever you say but I found playing Devil May Cry and Metal Gear Solid 2 a relief from the fuzzy graphics, irratating analog stick and arcade like sounds.
So get your facts straight
> before u start dissing nintendo.
I'm not dissing Nintendo, I happen to like their games but just feel dissapointed if these are all those "classics" everyone's always talking about.
On the other hand Perfect Dark is quite awesome :-)
At the moment ist's called Perfect Dark Zero
Strafex, that would be a damn good idea, pitting all three console players against each other, it would be revolutionary! However, I doubt that Sony would win, and doubt even more that Nintendo would win, as X Box have them outnumbered, I would think. This is purely my sentiments, but I would think that more of the X Box's gamers are PC gamers also than any other console, hence they're probably better at shooters, hence this will help them when playing against PS2 and GC gamers, as they will have an advantage.
Before I confuse you anymore, does anyone know what the title of the GameCube Perfect Dark actually is? I heard it was After Dark from a mate or something, but that sounds a little strange to me, it makes it sound like a kiddies game, not letting them play out after dark. Is it just me or is that anyone elses view on it? Anyway, I'm still expecting Rare to deliver an absolute corker of a game, and I'm sure that we'll see something that the other consoles will have to gun for.
Before I confuse you anymore, does anyone know what the title of the GameCube Perfect Dark actually is? I heard it was After Dark from a mate or something, but that sounds a little strange to me, it makes it sound like a kiddies game, not letting them play out after dark. Is it just me or is that anyone elses view on it? Anyway, I'm still expecting Rare to deliver an absolute corker of a game, and I'm sure that we'll see something that the other consoles will have to gun for.
Res€vilfan wrote:
>Zelda:Ocarina of Time scored a perfect 10 over on
> gamespot and was classed as flawless, hmmm the whole thing feels a bit kiddy,
> it's plainly ripped off ideas from MGS and Tomb Raider and overall it's just
> above average and starting miles from where you left off everytime is painfully irratating.
1. Zelda:OOT is not "kiddy" just because it's not got blood squirting all over the place.
2. It's not a rip off from MGS & Tomb Raider because the first Zelda was out way before any of them came out.
3. It's not average its way better than any of the games that will ever come out on the PS & PS2.
So get your facts straight before u start dissing nintendo.
>Zelda:Ocarina of Time scored a perfect 10 over on
> gamespot and was classed as flawless, hmmm the whole thing feels a bit kiddy,
> it's plainly ripped off ideas from MGS and Tomb Raider and overall it's just
> above average and starting miles from where you left off everytime is painfully irratating.
1. Zelda:OOT is not "kiddy" just because it's not got blood squirting all over the place.
2. It's not a rip off from MGS & Tomb Raider because the first Zelda was out way before any of them came out.
3. It's not average its way better than any of the games that will ever come out on the PS & PS2.
So get your facts straight before u start dissing nintendo.
Perfect Dark took a little bit of adjusting to but then it ruled... until the horrible slowdown kicked in...
Hopefully, Perfect Dark on the Gamecube will be running at a constant 60 FPS.
With a bit of luck, we'll have online play too.
Good online news. Sega are releasing Phantasy Star online complete with a Modem.
Hopefully we'll get broadband options in the west and now the online parts are being released, newer games (like Turok) will support them.
Wouldn't it be great if on Turok we could play against PS2 and Xbox owners! Then we could show them who the REAL gamers are! ;-)
Hopefully, Perfect Dark on the Gamecube will be running at a constant 60 FPS.
With a bit of luck, we'll have online play too.
Good online news. Sega are releasing Phantasy Star online complete with a Modem.
Hopefully we'll get broadband options in the west and now the online parts are being released, newer games (like Turok) will support them.
Wouldn't it be great if on Turok we could play against PS2 and Xbox owners! Then we could show them who the REAL gamers are! ;-)
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