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I’ve spent the morning playing and swearing at my N64, is he going mad? I hear you say, well yes and no, I’ve been fighting the most annoying boss you could ever imagine, the game is Turok 3 the boss is a fat muther of a bug. The amount of times I’ve tried to beat this bsterd is getting stupid now, I really don’t know how the heck I’m going to ever do it, as soon as you get his energy bar right down to the bottom, for some unknown reason he regenerates it all. Then it dawned on me, why do games developers bother with bosses? I’m sorry but only on the rare occasion have I actually enjoyed fighting them, otherwise they’re just a pain in the backside, they always seem to get in the way of the fun game play. You fight your way through a massive level and by the time you get to the end you’re pretty much out of health and ammunition, then you’re forced to fight some 5 storey hard as nails chimp, with enough firepower to start a world war (or in Nintendo’s case a big fluffy Bunny that tries to jump on you) which tends to kill you straight away sending you back to the beginning of the level. There’s no skill involved in fighting most of these 10-ton freaks, it’s usually a case of dodging fire while shooting like a mad man and probably dieing in about 30 seconds. I really really hate them, you get the occasional game that has enjoyable bosses, e.g. Zelda but the only reason they’re enjoyable is because there not too hard to kill, couple of goes and they tend to be dead.
I doubt I’m alone when I say I hate bosses with a passion, I can understand having an end of game boss, but some of these things are just far too damn hard too beat. It seems to me that the only company’s (from a Ninty view don’t know about Sony) that realise that people just don’t enjoy these fights which you have to keep playing over and over again, are Nintendo and Rare. Games like Banjo Tooie and Zelda have good boss fights, they’re not too hard, they’re not too easy, they’re challenging enough, but they’re not so hard that they get annoying. But when you get these bosses that take far too long too kill it really is just annoying, a good example of a very crap and annoying boss is in the original Turok, the level three boss is one of the hardest enemies I’ve ever had to confront. First of all you have to fight a jeep when that eventually blows you think you’ve done it, but no another Jeep starts too attack you, by the time that’s blown up you’ve pretty much used up all your good ammunition, then to your amazement some guy appears from the jeep, with enough energy to ummmm make a Lucozade Drink, what follows is one of the most boring, annoying, repetitive boss fights in gaming history. As you’re low on ammo it’s a case of strafing his fire while moving backwards and trying to shoot the somersaulting gimp with a gun that would be better suited to a Fairground. It’s not clever and it certainly isn’t fun, okay you get a massive feeling of triumph when you eventually kill them, but half the time it annoys me so much that I find myself almost forced to use cheat codes.
From the dawn of gaming time (well at least as far back as I can remember) bosses have always been the most annoying part of games. Games such as Xenon 2 on the Atari ST where good fun, up until the point where you have to confront a massive screen filling alien, what really used to extract the urine on these games was that you had to start the whole game again when you died, at least we don’t have that problem anymore, usually on games like this you would get to the boss with maybe 1 or 2 lives, the first life you would waste straight away cause you're so shocked about the size of the thing and have no idea what to do, the second would be wasted frantically dodging the fire while attempting to work what part of this big alien monkey your supposed to shoot, this would usually follow with a dirty great GAME OVER message,at this point I tended to punch the TV Screen, which kind of hurt. Can anyone honestly say they used to enjoy the bosses on the old skool Shoot em ups? Only a select bunch I bet. Even on cutesy games like Rainbow Islands bosses have always been a pain in the posterior.
I can name most the games with good “fun” bosses in a few minutes, the majority of end of level bosses are just there to be annoying, there should be a warning before half of these gimps saying “warning this enemy will make you swear A LOT”. What really tends to rub it in is on games such as Banjo Kazooie (one Rare boss that I hate) the final boss battle, must take about 50 goes to complete, every time you die you get sent back to the beginning and you have to keep playing the same bits over and over and over again until you’re blue in the face.
What I’m trying to say is game developers if you have to have bosses in your games, don’t make them so damn hard, no one likes fighting the same boss over and over again, take a leaf out of Rare or Nintendo’s book, make them challenging but not the kind of thing that’s going to take hours to beat.
Anyway enough of my moaning i'm off to swear at Turok 3 a bit more.
Tiltawhirl :hating bosses with a passion
I doubt I’m alone when I say I hate bosses with a passion, I can understand having an end of game boss, but some of these things are just far too damn hard too beat. It seems to me that the only company’s (from a Ninty view don’t know about Sony) that realise that people just don’t enjoy these fights which you have to keep playing over and over again, are Nintendo and Rare. Games like Banjo Tooie and Zelda have good boss fights, they’re not too hard, they’re not too easy, they’re challenging enough, but they’re not so hard that they get annoying. But when you get these bosses that take far too long too kill it really is just annoying, a good example of a very crap and annoying boss is in the original Turok, the level three boss is one of the hardest enemies I’ve ever had to confront. First of all you have to fight a jeep when that eventually blows you think you’ve done it, but no another Jeep starts too attack you, by the time that’s blown up you’ve pretty much used up all your good ammunition, then to your amazement some guy appears from the jeep, with enough energy to ummmm make a Lucozade Drink, what follows is one of the most boring, annoying, repetitive boss fights in gaming history. As you’re low on ammo it’s a case of strafing his fire while moving backwards and trying to shoot the somersaulting gimp with a gun that would be better suited to a Fairground. It’s not clever and it certainly isn’t fun, okay you get a massive feeling of triumph when you eventually kill them, but half the time it annoys me so much that I find myself almost forced to use cheat codes.
From the dawn of gaming time (well at least as far back as I can remember) bosses have always been the most annoying part of games. Games such as Xenon 2 on the Atari ST where good fun, up until the point where you have to confront a massive screen filling alien, what really used to extract the urine on these games was that you had to start the whole game again when you died, at least we don’t have that problem anymore, usually on games like this you would get to the boss with maybe 1 or 2 lives, the first life you would waste straight away cause you're so shocked about the size of the thing and have no idea what to do, the second would be wasted frantically dodging the fire while attempting to work what part of this big alien monkey your supposed to shoot, this would usually follow with a dirty great GAME OVER message,at this point I tended to punch the TV Screen, which kind of hurt. Can anyone honestly say they used to enjoy the bosses on the old skool Shoot em ups? Only a select bunch I bet. Even on cutesy games like Rainbow Islands bosses have always been a pain in the posterior.
I can name most the games with good “fun” bosses in a few minutes, the majority of end of level bosses are just there to be annoying, there should be a warning before half of these gimps saying “warning this enemy will make you swear A LOT”. What really tends to rub it in is on games such as Banjo Kazooie (one Rare boss that I hate) the final boss battle, must take about 50 goes to complete, every time you die you get sent back to the beginning and you have to keep playing the same bits over and over and over again until you’re blue in the face.
What I’m trying to say is game developers if you have to have bosses in your games, don’t make them so damn hard, no one likes fighting the same boss over and over again, take a leaf out of Rare or Nintendo’s book, make them challenging but not the kind of thing that’s going to take hours to beat.
Anyway enough of my moaning i'm off to swear at Turok 3 a bit more.
Tiltawhirl :hating bosses with a passion
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I think they (bosses) are a pretty necessary climax to a level, imagine if there was a hard bit, then it got a little easier, then it just finished. I know i'd feel like something was missing. Also, it means you get a conclusion without stretching out a lame storyline. Boss is dead, therefore you win.
Playing through the whole level (or even game) because you failed to finish off the very last job sucks though. Hence i think the prefect balance is a testing (but not too hard) boss, where you can save the game just before you go in to deal with him.
The last challenge in a game (and to a much lesser extent, a level) should always be a bit special though. I don't think you could get that feeling of satisfaction from finishing a game without it.
Playing through the whole level (or even game) because you failed to finish off the very last job sucks though. Hence i think the prefect balance is a testing (but not too hard) boss, where you can save the game just before you go in to deal with him.
The last challenge in a game (and to a much lesser extent, a level) should always be a bit special though. I don't think you could get that feeling of satisfaction from finishing a game without it.
I think that a boss should be tough.
Especially a last boss.
BUT, if they're so hard that you continually die against them, you don't want to have to start that level from the very beginning.
Take Mizar (Jet Force Gamini), damn hard to beat but very rewarding when you do finish him.
He's incredibly hard and beating such a challenge is immensely satisfying.
It would've been seriously annoying if I'd had to have restarted the entire level everytime I lost though.
Especially a last boss.
BUT, if they're so hard that you continually die against them, you don't want to have to start that level from the very beginning.
Take Mizar (Jet Force Gamini), damn hard to beat but very rewarding when you do finish him.
He's incredibly hard and beating such a challenge is immensely satisfying.
It would've been seriously annoying if I'd had to have restarted the entire level everytime I lost though.
"Bosses - you either hate them or they're easy"
Unless you like your job. Or they're mingers. Or men.
: )
Unless you like your job. Or they're mingers. Or men.
: )
lol @ the Duck with the PHD
I'm sure someone mentioned it below but the final boss is like the climax to the level, the thought of their being some huge ugly grotesque muther that has gone without is dinner for a week waiting for you adds a sense or atmosphere to the level.
Although agreed, no boss should ever require repeated attempts to defeat and I can't speak for the Turok 3 bosses but i've played Turok 1 and 2 and i'm guessing there their same and those bosses were stupidly difficult, big, but difficult.
Oh and while were on the subject of bosses ever noticed how on the final, final boss you don't kill it of conventional methods? You always seem to have to shoot it's limbs off (maybe) and then blow the planet up or use the scenery or surroundings to kill it (Perfect Dark) maybe it's because there stronger or something, ah well.
Although agreed, no boss should ever require repeated attempts to defeat and I can't speak for the Turok 3 bosses but i've played Turok 1 and 2 and i'm guessing there their same and those bosses were stupidly difficult, big, but difficult.
Oh and while were on the subject of bosses ever noticed how on the final, final boss you don't kill it of conventional methods? You always seem to have to shoot it's limbs off (maybe) and then blow the planet up or use the scenery or surroundings to kill it (Perfect Dark) maybe it's because there stronger or something, ah well.
I'm not completely against bosses, I just hate the near too impossible boss fights in games such as Turok, I can understand the final boss being hard, but the one in Turok 3 just takes the mick, you can stand for hours shooting the big ugly freak and for some reason it looses no health.
I've had plenty of good boss fights, one good one that springs to mind was the fight in Banjo Tooie against the blowup Dinosaur in Witchy World, it was challenging but it wasn't too hard to get annoying, also the way you killed it was fun, flying around a big circus tent shooting him with eggs. I'm just against these no brain bosses with far too much health, that you just have to keep pummeling with no particular strategy until they die.
I've had plenty of good boss fights, one good one that springs to mind was the fight in Banjo Tooie against the blowup Dinosaur in Witchy World, it was challenging but it wasn't too hard to get annoying, also the way you killed it was fun, flying around a big circus tent shooting him with eggs. I'm just against these no brain bosses with far too much health, that you just have to keep pummeling with no particular strategy until they die.
Yeah, like the final boss in Half-Life! He's well hard, and requires a huge amount of skill to complete, but you always have a chance. It never feels like the boss is cheating or anything, but it can still be frustrating!
This makes a good boss. Being hard, but not making the player feel that it is too hard (impossible in some cases :D) or that the boss is 'cheating' or breaking any of the games rules. Also they must be BIG! or they just suk ;-)
This makes a good boss. Being hard, but not making the player feel that it is too hard (impossible in some cases :D) or that the boss is 'cheating' or breaking any of the games rules. Also they must be BIG! or they just suk ;-)
Sibs wrote:
> Yeah, like the final boss in Half-Life! He's well hard, and requires a huge
> amount of skill to complete, but you always have a chance. It never feels like
> the boss is cheating or anything, but it can still be frustrating!
God damnit that Boss is hard. I fired everything I had in my arsenal and he still wouldn't go down. One shot of that toxic stuff and you're dead. As you said Sibs, it's damn hard, but that's how the final boss of a game should be. You didn't spend hours and hours of shooting just to get to some panzy boss that can be beaten in 3 minutes. We want a long battle. Final Fantasy 7 has the right idea, with a long, hard battle with Sephiroph (excuse the spelling!). All FF games have this right, but FF7 really captures the spirit of it. Alone In The Dark 4 really annoyed me with this. After going through a couple of discs, you get something that can be killed with ease - pathetic! I hope that a lot of the next-generation games utilize this idea to their advantage over the earlier games.
Firebalt.
> Yeah, like the final boss in Half-Life! He's well hard, and requires a huge
> amount of skill to complete, but you always have a chance. It never feels like
> the boss is cheating or anything, but it can still be frustrating!
God damnit that Boss is hard. I fired everything I had in my arsenal and he still wouldn't go down. One shot of that toxic stuff and you're dead. As you said Sibs, it's damn hard, but that's how the final boss of a game should be. You didn't spend hours and hours of shooting just to get to some panzy boss that can be beaten in 3 minutes. We want a long battle. Final Fantasy 7 has the right idea, with a long, hard battle with Sephiroph (excuse the spelling!). All FF games have this right, but FF7 really captures the spirit of it. Alone In The Dark 4 really annoyed me with this. After going through a couple of discs, you get something that can be killed with ease - pathetic! I hope that a lot of the next-generation games utilize this idea to their advantage over the earlier games.
Firebalt.
Also in FF7 there was some of the best boss music! Whenever you were facing one you instantly knew by the beefy music that came on that was plain cool!
PS for the half-life boss here is what you need to do..(as far as I can remeber anyway. My half-life days were a long time ago)
You shoot those three prongs sticking out on various levels, and then quick save so you don't need to keep doing it. When that funny warp shot thing is fired at you then if you shoot the prongs then, with that gun that is charged up and fires a burining laser then you will fly backwards and avoid getting hit by the warp thing. After that shoot the boss with a machine gun until all the flying balls around him are gone. If all three prongs are gone he won't be able to recharge em again!
Then you need to get to the top, and as he looks like he's gonna shoot a warp shot jump onto that thing that makes you jump up really high and whip out your fattest gun (preferably the laser guided rocket thingy) and shoot his brain as you go over. This is one way of killing it, but you can also kill it by jumping INTO its brai, but then you die to. (I think that way you get a different ending but I can't quite remember) Can anyone else shed light on that, or I'll have to play through Half-Life again... any excuse...
:-)
PS for the half-life boss here is what you need to do..(as far as I can remeber anyway. My half-life days were a long time ago)
You shoot those three prongs sticking out on various levels, and then quick save so you don't need to keep doing it. When that funny warp shot thing is fired at you then if you shoot the prongs then, with that gun that is charged up and fires a burining laser then you will fly backwards and avoid getting hit by the warp thing. After that shoot the boss with a machine gun until all the flying balls around him are gone. If all three prongs are gone he won't be able to recharge em again!
Then you need to get to the top, and as he looks like he's gonna shoot a warp shot jump onto that thing that makes you jump up really high and whip out your fattest gun (preferably the laser guided rocket thingy) and shoot his brain as you go over. This is one way of killing it, but you can also kill it by jumping INTO its brai, but then you die to. (I think that way you get a different ending but I can't quite remember) Can anyone else shed light on that, or I'll have to play through Half-Life again... any excuse...
:-)
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