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I think, like many other Star Wars babies, I was disappointed in The Phantom Menace.
Not because of Jar-Jar or that stupid wide-faced Anakin-mannequin.
But because it was boring. Lucas said this is the 1st instalment, designed to introduce us to the characters and set-up for the next two movies. But nothing happened.
And then I wondered why Star Wars/Empire/Jedi hold such a grip, even after 20+ years. For me, it introduced me to cinema. I saw Star Wars when I was 4, I remember sitting in the big cinema and watching the curtains go back, reading the scrawl at the start and not paying any attention to it.
And most of all, I remember the Star Destroyer coming into view with a huge rumble.
For a 4yr old, that is like witnessing creation itself.
And the ride that followed. Luke, Han, Chewie etc saving the universe, making friends and defeating the baddie. Everything a kid wants to do at that age. It had excitement, action, adventure, cool creatures, spaceships and Darth Vader. Good vs Evil, pure and simple.
Obi-Wan, the kind old man that looked out for Luke and taught him Jedi stuff. But he’s dead?! NO! This can’t be, me and my mates were just as shocked and upset as Luke was when Vader lopped Kenobi in half.
I wanted to be Han Solo, cocky and cynical, a loveable rogue with an 8ft dog for a sidekick.
Empire Strikes Back came out three years later, and it was like revisiting old friends.
This was before the invention of video, so you never saw a movie once it left the cinema screen again until 6-7yrs later when it appeared on tv.
You created Star Wars for yourself with the toys, made your own sequels on many an weekend and night with your mates in houses and gardens up and down the country.
And there was Han Solo again, and he was still rescuing Luke Skywalker from death, and there’s Chewie. And Leia! This is perfect.
And then AT-AT Walkers came and snowspeeders for the Hoth Battle. This is magic, pure nirvana for a kid. All those characters you loved and had the toys for were back in front of you.
And there’s Darth Vader, still being evil and with another Death Star being built.
And some green thing called Yoda? But here’s Obi-Wan again.
Oh can this get any better?
Han Solo gets frozen in carbonite and given to Boba Fett. Boo! Hiss! Bad Boba Fett.
Luke decides to smash Vader to bits and gives it some.
This kid was grinning from ear to ear at the thought of Luke Skywalker, who I had watched go from a farm-boy orphan on Tattooine to a Jedi apprentice finally going to defeat Vader.
But what? Vader cuts his hand off? This can’t be happening, 1st Solo gets screwed over and now Luke is going to get his?
And then the defining cinema moment for my generation, the lines that had playgrounds buzzing for months, “Luke, I am your father.”
?!?!?!?!?
Vader, the prince of darkness is Luke’s dad? This is worse than being told there is no Father Christmas.
He cant be Luke’s dad, no way!
So, I am 7 and I have to wait to find out what is happening to my friends?
Han Solo, my hero is gone, frozen forever.
Luke has his hand chopped off and finds out Vader is his dad? And Empire ends here?
This is torture, this is worse than Xmas Eve when you can’t sleep. What is happening to Solo and Luke? Surely Vader can’t win?
And we wait for 3 years to find out what will happen.
I can’t tell you the joy at sitting there with my mate as “Return of The Jedi” started. We had waited 3 years to find out what will happen. The events of Empire are still fresh in our minds, Vader is Luke’s dad, Solo is gone. God only knows what’s going to happen in this one.
And it starts with Jabba laughing at Solo in carbonite. And there’s Lando, and Leia! They’re going to rescue Han. No, they get captured and Leia is forced to wear that outfit? (A 10yr old boy suddenly realises that girls aren’t icky and boy, do they look different to us).
Doom, certain doom for everyone I have grown up watching and played the toys of.
But here comes Luke.
Rescues everyone, stupid Ewoks turn up and Luke has the mother of all showdowns with his dad, redeeming himself and this 10yr old boy watched Vader, childhood villain, die as an old man.
Three perfect films for growing up with. I started at 4 and finished at 10. These were characters that I had the toys of, the books, characters that me and my mates played out for ourselves (I always got to be Han, that was the rule).
I had seen a farm-boy go from a hopeful star-pilot wannabe to a Jedi Master. Vader, Dark Lord of Sith died a frail old man, begging for forgiveness from his son. Han and Leia got it together!
These people developed over 10 years, my formative years and yielded surprise after surprise. I knew these people well and went along with them on their journey.
And then The Phantom Menace came out.
And it sucked. Not totally, but it was just not good.
And I know why, for me, Phantom Menace failed as a Star Wars movie.
I already knew the ending to the story.
Phantom Menace, Attack of The Clones and Episode 3. Doesn’t matter how good they are, we already know what happens at the end.
It removes any element of surprise or “Christ I don’t believe it!” moments like Vader being Luke’s dad.
Obi-Wan is never in danger, we’ve seen him die already. We know Anakin will become Vader and die at the hands of his son.
We know he will have two kids, and we know their fates.
There is nothing you can surprise us with, simply because we’ve seen how it ends already.
We know The Empire will fall, we know Jedi will prevail, we know Yoda is The Daddy.
We know Boba Fett dies, we know every single outcome to the next 3 films.
They’re redundant.
Doesn’t matter how in jeopardy the main players get, we have already seen the end.
Sure, use minor characters and explain the history, but it’s like someone tells you the ending of a book and then starts to read.
Every little incident, you think “Oh right, so that’s why so-and-so happened”, but you’re just waiting for the end, waiting to see how it ties together.
The Phantom Menace/Attack of The Clones/Episode 3 are pointless. They may be nice films but the main characters that we grew up with are missing.
But most importantly for me, no Han Solo.
He doesn’t show up until Episode 4. And it’s the first time he meets Obi-Wan and Luke, doesn’t believe in The Force and has never met any of the other characters, so you can’t squeeze him into the prequals.
Phantom Menace just didn’t say anything or hold any surprises at all, same is true with Attack of The Clones and Episode 3.
You can’t get excited about something you already know the ending to.
Not because of Jar-Jar or that stupid wide-faced Anakin-mannequin.
But because it was boring. Lucas said this is the 1st instalment, designed to introduce us to the characters and set-up for the next two movies. But nothing happened.
And then I wondered why Star Wars/Empire/Jedi hold such a grip, even after 20+ years. For me, it introduced me to cinema. I saw Star Wars when I was 4, I remember sitting in the big cinema and watching the curtains go back, reading the scrawl at the start and not paying any attention to it.
And most of all, I remember the Star Destroyer coming into view with a huge rumble.
For a 4yr old, that is like witnessing creation itself.
And the ride that followed. Luke, Han, Chewie etc saving the universe, making friends and defeating the baddie. Everything a kid wants to do at that age. It had excitement, action, adventure, cool creatures, spaceships and Darth Vader. Good vs Evil, pure and simple.
Obi-Wan, the kind old man that looked out for Luke and taught him Jedi stuff. But he’s dead?! NO! This can’t be, me and my mates were just as shocked and upset as Luke was when Vader lopped Kenobi in half.
I wanted to be Han Solo, cocky and cynical, a loveable rogue with an 8ft dog for a sidekick.
Empire Strikes Back came out three years later, and it was like revisiting old friends.
This was before the invention of video, so you never saw a movie once it left the cinema screen again until 6-7yrs later when it appeared on tv.
You created Star Wars for yourself with the toys, made your own sequels on many an weekend and night with your mates in houses and gardens up and down the country.
And there was Han Solo again, and he was still rescuing Luke Skywalker from death, and there’s Chewie. And Leia! This is perfect.
And then AT-AT Walkers came and snowspeeders for the Hoth Battle. This is magic, pure nirvana for a kid. All those characters you loved and had the toys for were back in front of you.
And there’s Darth Vader, still being evil and with another Death Star being built.
And some green thing called Yoda? But here’s Obi-Wan again.
Oh can this get any better?
Han Solo gets frozen in carbonite and given to Boba Fett. Boo! Hiss! Bad Boba Fett.
Luke decides to smash Vader to bits and gives it some.
This kid was grinning from ear to ear at the thought of Luke Skywalker, who I had watched go from a farm-boy orphan on Tattooine to a Jedi apprentice finally going to defeat Vader.
But what? Vader cuts his hand off? This can’t be happening, 1st Solo gets screwed over and now Luke is going to get his?
And then the defining cinema moment for my generation, the lines that had playgrounds buzzing for months, “Luke, I am your father.”
?!?!?!?!?
Vader, the prince of darkness is Luke’s dad? This is worse than being told there is no Father Christmas.
He cant be Luke’s dad, no way!
So, I am 7 and I have to wait to find out what is happening to my friends?
Han Solo, my hero is gone, frozen forever.
Luke has his hand chopped off and finds out Vader is his dad? And Empire ends here?
This is torture, this is worse than Xmas Eve when you can’t sleep. What is happening to Solo and Luke? Surely Vader can’t win?
And we wait for 3 years to find out what will happen.
I can’t tell you the joy at sitting there with my mate as “Return of The Jedi” started. We had waited 3 years to find out what will happen. The events of Empire are still fresh in our minds, Vader is Luke’s dad, Solo is gone. God only knows what’s going to happen in this one.
And it starts with Jabba laughing at Solo in carbonite. And there’s Lando, and Leia! They’re going to rescue Han. No, they get captured and Leia is forced to wear that outfit? (A 10yr old boy suddenly realises that girls aren’t icky and boy, do they look different to us).
Doom, certain doom for everyone I have grown up watching and played the toys of.
But here comes Luke.
Rescues everyone, stupid Ewoks turn up and Luke has the mother of all showdowns with his dad, redeeming himself and this 10yr old boy watched Vader, childhood villain, die as an old man.
Three perfect films for growing up with. I started at 4 and finished at 10. These were characters that I had the toys of, the books, characters that me and my mates played out for ourselves (I always got to be Han, that was the rule).
I had seen a farm-boy go from a hopeful star-pilot wannabe to a Jedi Master. Vader, Dark Lord of Sith died a frail old man, begging for forgiveness from his son. Han and Leia got it together!
These people developed over 10 years, my formative years and yielded surprise after surprise. I knew these people well and went along with them on their journey.
And then The Phantom Menace came out.
And it sucked. Not totally, but it was just not good.
And I know why, for me, Phantom Menace failed as a Star Wars movie.
I already knew the ending to the story.
Phantom Menace, Attack of The Clones and Episode 3. Doesn’t matter how good they are, we already know what happens at the end.
It removes any element of surprise or “Christ I don’t believe it!” moments like Vader being Luke’s dad.
Obi-Wan is never in danger, we’ve seen him die already. We know Anakin will become Vader and die at the hands of his son.
We know he will have two kids, and we know their fates.
There is nothing you can surprise us with, simply because we’ve seen how it ends already.
We know The Empire will fall, we know Jedi will prevail, we know Yoda is The Daddy.
We know Boba Fett dies, we know every single outcome to the next 3 films.
They’re redundant.
Doesn’t matter how in jeopardy the main players get, we have already seen the end.
Sure, use minor characters and explain the history, but it’s like someone tells you the ending of a book and then starts to read.
Every little incident, you think “Oh right, so that’s why so-and-so happened”, but you’re just waiting for the end, waiting to see how it ties together.
The Phantom Menace/Attack of The Clones/Episode 3 are pointless. They may be nice films but the main characters that we grew up with are missing.
But most importantly for me, no Han Solo.
He doesn’t show up until Episode 4. And it’s the first time he meets Obi-Wan and Luke, doesn’t believe in The Force and has never met any of the other characters, so you can’t squeeze him into the prequals.
Phantom Menace just didn’t say anything or hold any surprises at all, same is true with Attack of The Clones and Episode 3.
You can’t get excited about something you already know the ending to.
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Meka_Dragon wrote:
> My kids don't get to see any Star Wars movies until they're all out, then
> they're watching them in the episodic order. That's 1 through 6.
From Parent...
I quite
> enjoyed TPM. It was just good to see people fight with light sabers again. The
> light saber scenes in TPM ruled.
To 6 year old...
In one easy post!
:)
> My kids don't get to see any Star Wars movies until they're all out, then
> they're watching them in the episodic order. That's 1 through 6.
From Parent...
I quite
> enjoyed TPM. It was just good to see people fight with light sabers again. The
> light saber scenes in TPM ruled.
To 6 year old...
In one easy post!
:)
Goatboy wrote:
>that stupid wide-faced Anakin-mannequin.
Mannequin Skywalker.
That's good.
>that stupid wide-faced Anakin-mannequin.
Mannequin Skywalker.
That's good.
My kids don't get to see any Star Wars movies until they're all out, then they're watching them in the episodic order. That's 1 through 6.
I quite enjoyed TPM. It was just good to see people fight with light sabers again. The light saber scenes in TPM ruled.
I quite enjoyed TPM. It was just good to see people fight with light sabers again. The light saber scenes in TPM ruled.
Yeah, but I know whats gonna happen at the end of my life.
Hasn't spoilt my fun so far....
Hasn't spoilt my fun so far....
Goatboy wrote:
> I talk Star Wars and you bring up elves and goblins?
What kind of man are
> you?
What kind of man are you, sobbing over broken childhood dreams? ;-)
> I talk Star Wars and you bring up elves and goblins?
What kind of man are
> you?
What kind of man are you, sobbing over broken childhood dreams? ;-)
I talk Star Wars and you bring up elves and goblins?
What kind of man are you?
What kind of man are you?
Mm. Well, the same thing happened to Lord of The Rings:
Hobbit, Lord of the Rings, Silmarilion : Quality fantasy series
Christopher Tolkeins folow-ons: Scum that is only useful for lighting fires.
Hobbit, Lord of the Rings, Silmarilion : Quality fantasy series
Christopher Tolkeins folow-ons: Scum that is only useful for lighting fires.
Bloody savage.
Star Wars - Thrilling entertainment for a kid
Empire Stikes Back - Dark, downbeat and nasty with THE major cinema twist in it.
Jedi - Jabba, Sarlaac pits, Speeder Bikes (Ewok almost ruin it)
TPM - Jar-Jar, Wattoo, Mannequin Skywalker, no stormtroopers, no Han Solo, no Chewbacca, no danger at any point for any of them because we've seen the ending.
TPM - Bunch of musty old pants.
Star Wars - Thrilling entertainment for a kid
Empire Stikes Back - Dark, downbeat and nasty with THE major cinema twist in it.
Jedi - Jabba, Sarlaac pits, Speeder Bikes (Ewok almost ruin it)
TPM - Jar-Jar, Wattoo, Mannequin Skywalker, no stormtroopers, no Han Solo, no Chewbacca, no danger at any point for any of them because we've seen the ending.
TPM - Bunch of musty old pants.
Yeah, well, anytime any kid says anything about Pokemon, I want to bowl them into a pond. But look at the Ninty scum creatures, you're getting beaten by a BOOK CHARACTER! Ahaha, and so on.
Back to the point, yeah, Lucas has a lot of discotinuities in TPM, and that's probably mucked it up. But never mind, no-one will disagree that the original trilogy is much better. Just go and watch the Battle of Endor again, and you'll feel much better ;-)
Back to the point, yeah, Lucas has a lot of discotinuities in TPM, and that's probably mucked it up. But never mind, no-one will disagree that the original trilogy is much better. Just go and watch the Battle of Endor again, and you'll feel much better ;-)
True, but if you looked at the crowds lining up for Phantom Menace, it was 20-30 yr olds.
Same people bought the toys, all over magazines and websites. 20-30 yr olds waiting to revisit the films that defined our childhood.
To relive memories of playing Star Wars in the woods, or using the toys round each others houses.
Kids today don't even know about Star Wars.
My neighbour has 3 kids, and the youngest is 7.
I asked him if he was going to watch "The Phantom Menace" and he said "No, I want to see Pokemon."
It took all my reserve to not slap him stupid and shout "Stupid, stupid boy."
When all 3 new ones are out, I'll watch them all back to back and in order to see how it stands as a series.
The problem is, Star Wars is a self-contained film. It works for sequels but not for prequels.
In Star Wars, we are introduced to C3PO and R2, they kick off the whole saga with R2 having the plans inside him from Leia.
They mention, at no point, the fact they were built by Darth Vader at all.
Did he wipe their memory banks? Did they not remember that Leia is their Auntie?
When the droids are on Tattooine, they complain about the planet being inhospitable and nasty. But C3PO was created on Tattooine in TPM.
It just doesn't make sense or hold together very well.
Why is C3PO freaked by Jawas, when he is around them in TPM?
And Lucas has to use the "memory wipe" excuse, otherwise it's a joke.
Darth Vader just happens to be above the very planet he was born on in Star Wars? He makes no mention of this, not "Ooh lovely, home again".
Phantom Menace is smashing my childhood to bits and dammit, it's not right.
Same people bought the toys, all over magazines and websites. 20-30 yr olds waiting to revisit the films that defined our childhood.
To relive memories of playing Star Wars in the woods, or using the toys round each others houses.
Kids today don't even know about Star Wars.
My neighbour has 3 kids, and the youngest is 7.
I asked him if he was going to watch "The Phantom Menace" and he said "No, I want to see Pokemon."
It took all my reserve to not slap him stupid and shout "Stupid, stupid boy."
When all 3 new ones are out, I'll watch them all back to back and in order to see how it stands as a series.
The problem is, Star Wars is a self-contained film. It works for sequels but not for prequels.
In Star Wars, we are introduced to C3PO and R2, they kick off the whole saga with R2 having the plans inside him from Leia.
They mention, at no point, the fact they were built by Darth Vader at all.
Did he wipe their memory banks? Did they not remember that Leia is their Auntie?
When the droids are on Tattooine, they complain about the planet being inhospitable and nasty. But C3PO was created on Tattooine in TPM.
It just doesn't make sense or hold together very well.
Why is C3PO freaked by Jawas, when he is around them in TPM?
And Lucas has to use the "memory wipe" excuse, otherwise it's a joke.
Darth Vader just happens to be above the very planet he was born on in Star Wars? He makes no mention of this, not "Ooh lovely, home again".
Phantom Menace is smashing my childhood to bits and dammit, it's not right.
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