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Even with the rumours that *good old* J.R (i.e retarded hick boy) might be leaving the RAW commentary team and being replaced by Mike Goldberg from UFC (which would then give the interesting scenario of Joey Styles maybe taking the hot seat there seeing as his contract only extends to professional wrestling) i still felt women's wrestling was the right subject to write about this week if only because we did actually have a 3 on 2 bra and panties match on RAW and at the moment the rumours about J.R are just that, rumours.
So yes this week, coming under the incredibly critical eye of the forums resident Yankee Doodle Kawada, are the women of the sport we like so much.
Other than Japan, women's wrestling hasn't been that big over here in the west. It is seen more of a side show, a break from the action so the males in the audience can have something nice to look at for 5 or so minutes before the sweaty men come back out again. Women are the side piece, the ones who accompany the male stars or get in the ring to fill 5 minutes in a show because the booker couldn't think of anything else. They're usually only there for sexual appeal, attracting that all important 18-49 male demographic each wrestling organisation strives so hard to obtain.
In other words, the average fan cares about as much for the actual wrestling in a women's match as much as they care about another exciting masterlock challenge.................and thank god for the WWE they do.
I'll get to the atrocious WWE women's roster in a bit but right now let me take you back when women's wrestling at least had some credibility in the States. Back in the days of people like Donna Christanello, Barbie Dahl, Gladys Gillem, Penny Banner and yes of course Mae Young and Moolah. These women knew how to wrestle and fight and put on matches that weren't botch fests and were actually enjoyable to watch. They were beginning to smash open the doors that had been previously closed and made promoters and the public actually take notice of women's wrestling and think to themselves *hey these women can actually wrestle some* and think of them as something more than just a pretty thing on the end of a male wrestler's arm. It was quite a golden age of women's wrestling.
And then Andy Kaufman came along.
The star of Taxi and Saturday Night Live began wrestling women in 1979 and pretty much made a laughing stock of women everywhere with his act of clowning around and embarrasing them and became the first ever inter-gender wrestling champion and retired having never lost a match. It pretty much put women's wrestling back to square one at trying to be respected.
Then in the mid to late 80's G.L.O.W (Gorgeous Ladies of Wrestling) arrived on tv. A real hit and miss affair that offered some good matches but was mostly a camp, over the top affair that was women's wrestling equivalent to Graham Norton. To its credit though it did get people back interested in women's wrestling and gave decent performers like Ivory a place to show off their skills while wrestlers like Candi Devine, Sherri Martel and Wendi Richter enjoyed the revitalised interest people had in women's wrestling as it began to build back it's shattered reputation.
In the early 90's women's wrestling was going pretty strong with competitors like Alundra Blayze and Brandi Alexander locking up, or in Francine's case, fighting :-D. However Alundra Blayze would be responsible for starting the countdown to the end of women's wrestling in the west.
Originally brought in by Vince to kickstart a women's division to capitalise on the interest she eventually got disenchanted by the standard of competition in the WWF and in November 1995 showed up on Nitro and publicly threw the WWF women's title in a trash can, an incident that some people believe is why Vince decided to screw Bret in Montreal. This incident not only discredited Vince and the WWF but also the women's title and women's wrestling as a whole itself, a blatant act of disrespect and distain shown towards the biggest company in the industry's belt and therefore the most important belt a female wrestler can hold. (Like Joey Styles said *i hate to say it, but it's the truth*)
Vince tried to carry on with wrestlers like Jazz, Molly Holly and Victoria but it was evident women wrestlers were becoming replaced by *divas* A step up from valet's like Miss Elizabeth but still nowhere near as good as the women of yesteryear or the women who were and are currently wrestling in Japan and local indy fed's (Alexis Laree, Gail Kim and Victoria exceptions)
Then came the darkest day of women's wrestling, 8th July 2002 - The day Women's wrestling officially died and what little credibility was left was wiped away, in the Western world anyway. Just in case some of you don't remember that date let me take you back
Bradshaw & Stratus vs Nowinski and Gayda. Ring any bells? Probably the most embarrasing, worst, god awful match in the history of wrestling. Virtually everything the two women did resulted in a botch, from a botched drop toe hold, a botched irish whip and a botched finish where it took Jackie about 6 months before realising she was meant to fall down after a top rope bulldog (and even then fell backwards instead of the more logical forwards direction) leaving everyone either in a state of shock or fits of laughter. These 2 had managed to do in 4 minutes what it took Kaufman 4 years to do and to a much larger degree then he could ever have hoped to achieve, a complete embarrasment to women wrestlers everywhere.
It's little wonder that in the last couple of years Vince has decided to scrap the idea of proper wrestling matches and gone for matches which include - chocolate pudding matches, bra and panties matches and paddle on a pole matches and of course the horrible diva contests.
Luckily though places like ROH haven't given up on women's wrestling and still put on good exciting matches and of course anyone after some good female wrestling action only has to look to Japan to see how it's done. Wrestlers like Manami Toyota, Ayako Hamada, Aja Kong, Bull Nakano, Devil Masami, Megumi Kudo, Sugar Sato, Sumie Sakai etc etc show us it is very possible for women to entertain us in the squared circle and put on 3 to 5 star matches that put most of the male superstars of the WWE to shame.
So for those who actually expect women who are in a wrestling company to actually wrestle instead of doing what any low rate xxx-rated tv channel does far better it may look like women's wrestling died during that night in July 2002. However it's still going strong thanks to our Japanese cousins and there's always stars out on the indy circuit to see and who knows, with TNA signing Gail Kim we could see an influx of female WRESTLERS into mainstream western tv again, which is extremely possible what with GAEA closing and it could soon rise from the ashes. Here's hoping.
Next week - The commentary teams get Kriticised
So yes this week, coming under the incredibly critical eye of the forums resident Yankee Doodle Kawada, are the women of the sport we like so much.
Other than Japan, women's wrestling hasn't been that big over here in the west. It is seen more of a side show, a break from the action so the males in the audience can have something nice to look at for 5 or so minutes before the sweaty men come back out again. Women are the side piece, the ones who accompany the male stars or get in the ring to fill 5 minutes in a show because the booker couldn't think of anything else. They're usually only there for sexual appeal, attracting that all important 18-49 male demographic each wrestling organisation strives so hard to obtain.
In other words, the average fan cares about as much for the actual wrestling in a women's match as much as they care about another exciting masterlock challenge.................and thank god for the WWE they do.
I'll get to the atrocious WWE women's roster in a bit but right now let me take you back when women's wrestling at least had some credibility in the States. Back in the days of people like Donna Christanello, Barbie Dahl, Gladys Gillem, Penny Banner and yes of course Mae Young and Moolah. These women knew how to wrestle and fight and put on matches that weren't botch fests and were actually enjoyable to watch. They were beginning to smash open the doors that had been previously closed and made promoters and the public actually take notice of women's wrestling and think to themselves *hey these women can actually wrestle some* and think of them as something more than just a pretty thing on the end of a male wrestler's arm. It was quite a golden age of women's wrestling.
And then Andy Kaufman came along.
The star of Taxi and Saturday Night Live began wrestling women in 1979 and pretty much made a laughing stock of women everywhere with his act of clowning around and embarrasing them and became the first ever inter-gender wrestling champion and retired having never lost a match. It pretty much put women's wrestling back to square one at trying to be respected.
Then in the mid to late 80's G.L.O.W (Gorgeous Ladies of Wrestling) arrived on tv. A real hit and miss affair that offered some good matches but was mostly a camp, over the top affair that was women's wrestling equivalent to Graham Norton. To its credit though it did get people back interested in women's wrestling and gave decent performers like Ivory a place to show off their skills while wrestlers like Candi Devine, Sherri Martel and Wendi Richter enjoyed the revitalised interest people had in women's wrestling as it began to build back it's shattered reputation.
In the early 90's women's wrestling was going pretty strong with competitors like Alundra Blayze and Brandi Alexander locking up, or in Francine's case, fighting :-D. However Alundra Blayze would be responsible for starting the countdown to the end of women's wrestling in the west.
Originally brought in by Vince to kickstart a women's division to capitalise on the interest she eventually got disenchanted by the standard of competition in the WWF and in November 1995 showed up on Nitro and publicly threw the WWF women's title in a trash can, an incident that some people believe is why Vince decided to screw Bret in Montreal. This incident not only discredited Vince and the WWF but also the women's title and women's wrestling as a whole itself, a blatant act of disrespect and distain shown towards the biggest company in the industry's belt and therefore the most important belt a female wrestler can hold. (Like Joey Styles said *i hate to say it, but it's the truth*)
Vince tried to carry on with wrestlers like Jazz, Molly Holly and Victoria but it was evident women wrestlers were becoming replaced by *divas* A step up from valet's like Miss Elizabeth but still nowhere near as good as the women of yesteryear or the women who were and are currently wrestling in Japan and local indy fed's (Alexis Laree, Gail Kim and Victoria exceptions)
Then came the darkest day of women's wrestling, 8th July 2002 - The day Women's wrestling officially died and what little credibility was left was wiped away, in the Western world anyway. Just in case some of you don't remember that date let me take you back
Bradshaw & Stratus vs Nowinski and Gayda. Ring any bells? Probably the most embarrasing, worst, god awful match in the history of wrestling. Virtually everything the two women did resulted in a botch, from a botched drop toe hold, a botched irish whip and a botched finish where it took Jackie about 6 months before realising she was meant to fall down after a top rope bulldog (and even then fell backwards instead of the more logical forwards direction) leaving everyone either in a state of shock or fits of laughter. These 2 had managed to do in 4 minutes what it took Kaufman 4 years to do and to a much larger degree then he could ever have hoped to achieve, a complete embarrasment to women wrestlers everywhere.
It's little wonder that in the last couple of years Vince has decided to scrap the idea of proper wrestling matches and gone for matches which include - chocolate pudding matches, bra and panties matches and paddle on a pole matches and of course the horrible diva contests.
Luckily though places like ROH haven't given up on women's wrestling and still put on good exciting matches and of course anyone after some good female wrestling action only has to look to Japan to see how it's done. Wrestlers like Manami Toyota, Ayako Hamada, Aja Kong, Bull Nakano, Devil Masami, Megumi Kudo, Sugar Sato, Sumie Sakai etc etc show us it is very possible for women to entertain us in the squared circle and put on 3 to 5 star matches that put most of the male superstars of the WWE to shame.
So for those who actually expect women who are in a wrestling company to actually wrestle instead of doing what any low rate xxx-rated tv channel does far better it may look like women's wrestling died during that night in July 2002. However it's still going strong thanks to our Japanese cousins and there's always stars out on the indy circuit to see and who knows, with TNA signing Gail Kim we could see an influx of female WRESTLERS into mainstream western tv again, which is extremely possible what with GAEA closing and it could soon rise from the ashes. Here's hoping.
Next week - The commentary teams get Kriticised
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Kawada wrote:
> I'm going to have so much fun (and headaches) writing promos for Dusty
> in Promo Wars :-D
Probably won't be for long though as looking at him on the RAW homecoming show it won't be long before he has a Connery.
> I'm going to have so much fun (and headaches) writing promos for Dusty
> in Promo Wars :-D
Probably won't be for long though as looking at him on the RAW homecoming show it won't be long before he has a Connery.
I'm going to have so much fun (and headaches) writing promos for Dusty in Promo Wars :-D
Kawada wrote:
> Hehe, can you imagine Schiavone on RAW.
Unfortunately I can. *Shudders*
> Hehe, can you imagine Schiavone on RAW.
Unfortunately I can. *Shudders*
Hehe, can you imagine Schiavone on RAW, after an amazing (ahem) main event of Snitsky vs Masters
*BEST RAW EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!* (well until next week anyway)
*BEST RAW EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!* (well until next week anyway)
Kawada wrote:
> I say given the recent signing they should put Dusty in JR's place.
> Instead of a slobberknocker we'll get such wisdom like *He be
> clubberin' him Kingfish, he be clubberin' him, laying down a beating
> if you weeeeeeeeel*
Heh. I remember WCWs three-man commentary team of Schiavone, Heenan and Rhodes. I also remember how hard Heenan had to work to carry his stooges, sorry, I mean co-commentators.
> I say given the recent signing they should put Dusty in JR's place.
> Instead of a slobberknocker we'll get such wisdom like *He be
> clubberin' him Kingfish, he be clubberin' him, laying down a beating
> if you weeeeeeeeel*
Heh. I remember WCWs three-man commentary team of Schiavone, Heenan and Rhodes. I also remember how hard Heenan had to work to carry his stooges, sorry, I mean co-commentators.
I say given the recent signing they should put Dusty in JR's place. Instead of a slobberknocker we'll get such wisdom like *He be clubberin' him Kingfish, he be clubberin' him, laying down a beating if you weeeeeeeeel*
I take it that the Jim Ross 'firing' angle will now be dropped? Shame, they could just go ahead as planned and give Styles the spot :-)
Grandprix wrote:
> I'm going to reply to the topic because I haven't done that yet.
>
> Interesting read, particularly about Andy Kaufman. I wasn't really
> aware he had such an impact on women's wrestling.
Well it was around the time feminism was really picking up steam and then along comes Kaufman who spits right in its face and makes a mockery of the whole thing by constantly not only beating the women he wrestled but embarrasing them as well. Although the women he faced weren't proper wrestlers it gave all the old schoolers in wrestling all the ammunition they needed to say *hey we were right all along, the men are better wrestlers let's stop wasting time on the women*
> The only way I feel it could get accepted again is for other
> companies in the west to show talented women (not based on looks) can
> wrestle and compete at a high level.
>
> That's my opinion on it anyway.
Indeed, i saw a ROH show on TWC the other week with a 4 way dance between the ladies and they put on a good match and the fans cheered for it (quite an accomplishment in ROH) so there's obviously a market for it if they could be bothered to hire good wrestlers to put on good matches, however it's far easier to just hire some model after her 15 minutes of fame to strut around half naked and pose in playboy to gain more publicity.
> On a side note, I read today that Mike Goldberg rejected the deal and
> is staying with UFC, meaning JR keeps his job for now.
Yup the reason i read for why he turned them down was he didn't like what he heard about how McMahon conducts business and treats employees. Shame really i'd have liked to have heard Styles call a UFC show. Hopefully this will mean that Vince sees sense and realise he has the best play by play guy ever in the business under contract and gives Styles the announcer spot, although he might be in the same bracket as Heyman as being too unpredictable.
> I'm going to reply to the topic because I haven't done that yet.
>
> Interesting read, particularly about Andy Kaufman. I wasn't really
> aware he had such an impact on women's wrestling.
Well it was around the time feminism was really picking up steam and then along comes Kaufman who spits right in its face and makes a mockery of the whole thing by constantly not only beating the women he wrestled but embarrasing them as well. Although the women he faced weren't proper wrestlers it gave all the old schoolers in wrestling all the ammunition they needed to say *hey we were right all along, the men are better wrestlers let's stop wasting time on the women*
> The only way I feel it could get accepted again is for other
> companies in the west to show talented women (not based on looks) can
> wrestle and compete at a high level.
>
> That's my opinion on it anyway.
Indeed, i saw a ROH show on TWC the other week with a 4 way dance between the ladies and they put on a good match and the fans cheered for it (quite an accomplishment in ROH) so there's obviously a market for it if they could be bothered to hire good wrestlers to put on good matches, however it's far easier to just hire some model after her 15 minutes of fame to strut around half naked and pose in playboy to gain more publicity.
> On a side note, I read today that Mike Goldberg rejected the deal and
> is staying with UFC, meaning JR keeps his job for now.
Yup the reason i read for why he turned them down was he didn't like what he heard about how McMahon conducts business and treats employees. Shame really i'd have liked to have heard Styles call a UFC show. Hopefully this will mean that Vince sees sense and realise he has the best play by play guy ever in the business under contract and gives Styles the announcer spot, although he might be in the same bracket as Heyman as being too unpredictable.
I'm going to reply to the topic because I haven't done that yet.
Interesting read, particularly about Andy Kaufman. I wasn't really aware he had such an impact on women's wrestling.
I don't think, in the WWE's current climate, that women's wrestling will ever be fully accepted in the WWE. The Diva search, the releasing of all the talent (as little as there was), the silly gimmick matches etc have all hurt the image of women's wrestling in the WWE.
The only way I feel it could get accepted again is for other companies in the west to show talented women (not based on looks) can wrestle and compete at a high level.
That's my opinion on it anyway.
On a side note, I read today that Mike Goldberg rejected the deal and is staying with UFC, meaning JR keeps his job for now.
Interesting read, particularly about Andy Kaufman. I wasn't really aware he had such an impact on women's wrestling.
I don't think, in the WWE's current climate, that women's wrestling will ever be fully accepted in the WWE. The Diva search, the releasing of all the talent (as little as there was), the silly gimmick matches etc have all hurt the image of women's wrestling in the WWE.
The only way I feel it could get accepted again is for other companies in the west to show talented women (not based on looks) can wrestle and compete at a high level.
That's my opinion on it anyway.
On a side note, I read today that Mike Goldberg rejected the deal and is staying with UFC, meaning JR keeps his job for now.
snake10 wrote:
> im actually 11 very metal.
in that case, you DON'T have a beard.
> and anyway,why would i lie about that.
you be amazed at some of the crap people have done on these forums.
Timmargh's an olympic sprinter for example.
> i mean if i lied,i would have said i was a wrestler my self and i was
> going to go get him,now wouldnt I?:)
if you wanted to be laughed out you could've done.
why don't you start training?
we have a juniors class at the academy :)
> im actually 11 very metal.
in that case, you DON'T have a beard.
> and anyway,why would i lie about that.
you be amazed at some of the crap people have done on these forums.
Timmargh's an olympic sprinter for example.
> i mean if i lied,i would have said i was a wrestler my self and i was
> going to go get him,now wouldnt I?:)
if you wanted to be laughed out you could've done.
why don't you start training?
we have a juniors class at the academy :)
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