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"Berlusconi’s Slight of Hand"

So, Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi has offended Germany *and* refused to apologise, as he heads into a 6 month Italian EU Parliament presidency.

Timing was.. interesting, after hearing very little in international news, as the Italian presidency starts attention falls on Berlusconi's bad moral track record.
Alongside his control over most of the country's media, he's forced through criminal immunity laws to protect himself from prosecution for charges of bribery.

And as attention falls on him, he loses his rag with a barracking politician (acting as could be predicted) and makes remarks that ‘sort of’ offend a whole country. Then inflames the situation by refusing to back down or apologise.

I feel like I’m watching a cheap magician, waving one hand around, drawing attention, while the other goes unnoticed in its work.

I find it hard to believe a man capable of becoming the Prime Minister of Italy does not have the intelligence or self-control to avoid making comments heard from him in the past couple of days.
So the rouse seems like the only explanation.


But we don’t just see it in Italy. The announcement for the examination of evidence used as the basis for going to war comes as Beckham hi-jacks all news stories. When that doesn’t manage to submerge the story, attention is shifted (as I’ve pointed out before) to a completely irrelevant angle – how quickly could Hussein have launched an attack, while the basis for war was that his weapons could get to other peoples’ hands. Everyone admitted he’d not use them himself.

And that’s just the latest example of it happening. I always used to look on claims of such a degree of governmental deceit with a lot of scepticism. But things don’t add up, people who’ve made it to the height of government power aren’t sufficiently stupid for these kinds of things to be purely accidental.
I know politicians are well practised in not answering questions, but this takes the pish.

I no longer trust.

Changing the subject entirely...

With reference to the EU, I keep quite an open mind about joining it, until I learned some startling facts concerning England becoming a member of Europe.

Unfortunately, I left my notes at home, but I'll bring them in tomorrow and fill you all in. One example is the proposed new police force, Europol will be "immune from criminal prosecution" for their actions. Yes, you heard right. The proposed new European police force will be able to operate with impunity, knowing that whatever illegal actions its' members takes, it won't be subject to trial.

Shocking business.

Practical Magic wrote:
> Either way, he did not compare him to a Nazi.

Do you even know what a Kapo is? I suggest you remove your head from your ass and go learn about The Holocaust.
Kapos were Block Guards, responsible for the running of individual huts and work divisions. Drawn from prisoners, although not Jews - usually "undesirables" and political prisoners. They were treated with some favour by the Germans but still curried favour by brutally overseeing their duties.
The most notorious Kapos ran the "Ka Be", the camp hospitals. They were responsible for hiding preferred prisoners when selection times came and held the highest position amongst those that had to fight, lie, cheat and steal to survive each day.
Kapos were considered Nazis by the prisoners, and many were hanged when liberated, many fled to Austria and many,many more begged forgiveness.

For you to suggest that labelling someone a Kapo does not state, in no uncertain terms, that a Kapo is a Nazi is offensive in the extreme. It displays not only naivete (excusable if you'd admit it), but also extreme insensitivity to a situation that you are clearly unaware of. And I dont mean from scanning Google and looking at quotes.
Learn your history, learn what a Kapo is and think before you try and excuse the actions of a corrupt Italian politician.
Where that me who had been called Kapo, I would have ignored rules and assaulted that odious man.

This is not "Goatboy Vs Bell", this is someone sitting in a rage that some poxy 21yr old English kid can try and twist the meaning of "Kapo".
How dare you demean that word and how dare you apply your not-aware-of-the-history thinking to defend such actions.

May I suggest you visit Birkenau and Auschwitz, may I suggest you sit with pensioners that even to this day, are reduced to tears and night-terrors because of what Kapos helped do.
Shame on you.

Blank wrote:
> Practical Magic wrote:
> Either way, he did not compare him to a Nazi.
>
> Now you're just taking the p*ss.

Listen, if he compares him to a prisoner chosen by the SS to be a camp guard then he is not being compared to a Nazi. Where this occured in real life during the time of the camps prisoner's would be hated by their own kind for what seemed like betrayal, and by the German's who saw them still, ultimately, as a prisoner.

And yet again Bell's refusal to admit he was wrong sees a thread descending into parody.
You are The Black Knight from Holy Grail.

"No it's not"
"I chopped your arm off"
"No you didn't"
"Look!"
"Tis but a flesh wound"

Practical Magic wrote:
> Aplogies to Dr Duck for being involved in this semi hijacking of the
> topic...

Heh. Kind of ironic that a topic about people being diverted by certain news stories becomes diverted itself by the story it used as an example :^)

But to go with the flow:

Whatever the specifics of the insult, Berlusconi likened Schulz to a soldier or soldier-like person working in a German concentration camp.
Ultimately, Berlusconi compares him to someone who is a part of the German WWII forces, which I believe is as good as calling him a nazi.
(IMO)

Practical Magic wrote:
> Either way, he did not compare him to a Nazi.

Now you're just taking the p*ss.

And here is two more quotes of what he said;

"Mr. Schulz, I know there is a producer in Italy who is making a film on the Nazi concentration camps. I will suggest you for the role of kapo, Berlusconi snapped back. You’d be perfect."

http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/933940.asp?0si=-

"Mr Schulz, I know there is in Italy a man producing a film on the Nazi concentration camps. I would like to suggest you for the role of Kapo. You'd be perfect."

June 3, 2003, in response to criticism from German Social Democratic MEP Martin Schulz over an alleged conflict of interest between his political role and media holdings.

http://www.schools.channel4.co.uk /news/2003/07/week_1/02_italy.html#1

Notice the Channel 4 quote includes the context in which the quote was said, again something most media outlets have conveniently chosen to ignore.

Either way, he did not compare him to a Nazi.

And whilst we're all still having a barney over this, Aceh still rumbles on between ceasefires and a US team is flying out to Liberia. But someone supposedly called someone else a Nazi, so who cares eh ?

Aplogies to Dr Duck for being involved in this semi hijacking of the topic...

Practical Magic wrote:
> Now, someone, anyone, find the word Nazi there ?

Right here: (I've highlighted it for you - and this is what you quoted)

> "I know there is a man producing a film on the **NAZI** concentration
> camps," Mr Berlusconi exclaimed. "I shall put you forward
> for the role of Kapo (guard chosen from among the prisoners) - you
> would be perfect."


But THIS is the real quote:

"Mr Schulz, I know there is a producer in Italy who is making a film on Nazi concentration camps. I will suggest you for the role of commandant. You'd be perfect."

There. Nazi. Concentration camps. Commandant. The lot.

Blank wrote:
> I think you're missing the point (first time for everything). He
> didn't say "You are a commandant" he said "You would be
> perfect for the part of Nazi commandant".
>

So you say that the wording was "You would be perfect for the part of Nazi commandant"

Goatboy say's its "would be "perfect" for the role of a guard in a film about a Nazi concentration camp" and that "that the German minister would be perfect for the part of a Nazi Commandant in a motion picture being made about concentration camps"

However, as we are all so keen on referencing stuff here, let us turn to the ever wonderful BBC website at http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/ europe/3044866.stm

Mr Berlusconi's exact words were;

"I know there is a man producing a film on the Nazi concentration camps," Mr Berlusconi exclaimed. "I shall put you forward for the role of Kapo (guard chosen from among the prisoners) - you would be perfect."

Now, someone, anyone, find the word Nazi there ? The MP he round on is not compared to a Nazi, or a guard, ( I was wrong, comandant was never used ) but in actual fact a prisoner in the camp, putting a whole new twist on it.

I think you're missing the point (first time for everything). He didn't say "You are a commandant" he said "You would be perfect for the part of Nazi commandant".

And I don't think there is necessarily an obvious connection between Nazi and commandant.