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*Firstly, blatant fanboyism out of the way first* whilst I own every next-gen console, I’m a Nintendo fan first and foremost. I’ve enjoyed every Nintendo console greatly (except the Virtual Boy), and have an undying love for the company and the amazing games they produced and still keep producing to this very day. In short, I believe that although they may not be as well regarded as they were a few years ago, Nintendo still rule the gaming roost. *End of blatant fanboyism*
Despite knowing that Nintendo are the undisputed daddies of the games industry, I’ve recently started to wonder over the last few months whether Nintendo actually belong in the modern games industry.
Are they being left behind in terms of hardware and what gamers want to play nowadays?
Do they still have a place?
I know my and many other Nintendo fans answer to the second question is a categorical “YES”, because I feel that without Nintendo, there’d be no games industry, but you really have to wonder why they aren’t doing so well in the latest console war tussle. We all know the undeniable quality of Nintendo and their latest console, and although it hasn’t excelled in the games department as much as I’d hoped just yet, but why isn’t it selling as well as was hoped? How come the once mighty games giant is left languishing in a lowly position in the UK and US?
It’s all about consumer trends at the end of the day, with the current nature of many gamers not sympathetic or understanding to the style of Nintendo, as their games basically don’t appeal to the majority of modern gamers.
Ever since Sony brought gaming more to the mainstream, there has undeniably been a more ‘casual gamer’ approach to many games, with more emphasis on style over substance. Games like Ico, Rez and a whole host of Nintendo greats are well documented for being fantastically original and offer unique gaming experiences, yet they didn’t take off with the public and made little impact in the games charts. The reason is the casual gamer.
If you look at today’s charts, you’ll see them dominated with established (read cash-in) franchises. GTA, FIFA, The Sims, Sim City, James Bond, Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, Tony Hawk’s etc. There’s very little in the way of imagination in that group, and whilst many are good games (I love GTA, The Sims and Sim City), the trend for releasing add-ons or sequels to top selling franchises is ultimately affecting companies like Nintendo. Nintendo very rarely get a big chart buster these days, a game that stays at the top of the charts for any number of time, and this is due to the sheer amount of established franchises filling up the charts these days. Low sales figures of the Gamecube prove that Joe public would now prefer to play on more mainstream consoles and games with more simplified appeal instead of a game that challenges them to actually think and use more skill.
Despite what some people would have you believe, the modern games industry is all about one thing: money. Consumer cash is the Holy Grail for the majority of games firms, and as has already been proven with the absolutely awful The Getaway or Harry Potter, you no longer need a decent game to be at the top of the charts, all you need is a good advertising agency and plenty of gullible gamers.
Nintendo have improved their public relations over the last few years, advertising a lot more, sponsoring various events, having games master Shigeru Miyamoto making a rare appearance in the UK, and generally being a lot less secretive and more open than years gone by, but in terms of advertising and awareness, Sony have blown them away. The Playstation brand name has got into people’s consciousness like the Nintendo brand did a decade ago. The ‘Nintendo generation’ has now been superseded by the ‘Playstaion generation’, and that’s a fact whether we like it or not.
So what about the future?
By rights, 2003 should be the year of the Gamecube in the UK, with Zelda, Metroid Prime, Resident Evil Zero, Skies of Arcadia Legends and the prospects of 1080, F-Zero, Mario Kart GC, Mario Golf/Tennis, the big Capcom games and more top quality gaming treats to savour at some time in the future, but what’s the betting that the sales surge we hope for doesn’t appear. Despite the obvious quality on offer, gamers will still be transfixed with the latest FIFA or Tony Hawk’s games, and that’s a real shame.
Nintendo still makes enough profits to stay afloat thanks to the GameBoy and the Pokemon franchise, but in the future…
As the old song goes, “you don’t know what you’ve got ‘till it’s gone”. I hope this isn’t true with Nintendo, for it would be a shame if they disappeared one day only for the disrespectful gamers who hated them to realise how damn good they were and actually end up liking their games, only to find that they’ve gone never to return.
Think about it and give an honest and realistic answer: with the way it’s going, do you see a future for Nintendo in the games industry in ten years time?
Despite knowing that Nintendo are the undisputed daddies of the games industry, I’ve recently started to wonder over the last few months whether Nintendo actually belong in the modern games industry.
Are they being left behind in terms of hardware and what gamers want to play nowadays?
Do they still have a place?
I know my and many other Nintendo fans answer to the second question is a categorical “YES”, because I feel that without Nintendo, there’d be no games industry, but you really have to wonder why they aren’t doing so well in the latest console war tussle. We all know the undeniable quality of Nintendo and their latest console, and although it hasn’t excelled in the games department as much as I’d hoped just yet, but why isn’t it selling as well as was hoped? How come the once mighty games giant is left languishing in a lowly position in the UK and US?
It’s all about consumer trends at the end of the day, with the current nature of many gamers not sympathetic or understanding to the style of Nintendo, as their games basically don’t appeal to the majority of modern gamers.
Ever since Sony brought gaming more to the mainstream, there has undeniably been a more ‘casual gamer’ approach to many games, with more emphasis on style over substance. Games like Ico, Rez and a whole host of Nintendo greats are well documented for being fantastically original and offer unique gaming experiences, yet they didn’t take off with the public and made little impact in the games charts. The reason is the casual gamer.
If you look at today’s charts, you’ll see them dominated with established (read cash-in) franchises. GTA, FIFA, The Sims, Sim City, James Bond, Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, Tony Hawk’s etc. There’s very little in the way of imagination in that group, and whilst many are good games (I love GTA, The Sims and Sim City), the trend for releasing add-ons or sequels to top selling franchises is ultimately affecting companies like Nintendo. Nintendo very rarely get a big chart buster these days, a game that stays at the top of the charts for any number of time, and this is due to the sheer amount of established franchises filling up the charts these days. Low sales figures of the Gamecube prove that Joe public would now prefer to play on more mainstream consoles and games with more simplified appeal instead of a game that challenges them to actually think and use more skill.
Despite what some people would have you believe, the modern games industry is all about one thing: money. Consumer cash is the Holy Grail for the majority of games firms, and as has already been proven with the absolutely awful The Getaway or Harry Potter, you no longer need a decent game to be at the top of the charts, all you need is a good advertising agency and plenty of gullible gamers.
Nintendo have improved their public relations over the last few years, advertising a lot more, sponsoring various events, having games master Shigeru Miyamoto making a rare appearance in the UK, and generally being a lot less secretive and more open than years gone by, but in terms of advertising and awareness, Sony have blown them away. The Playstation brand name has got into people’s consciousness like the Nintendo brand did a decade ago. The ‘Nintendo generation’ has now been superseded by the ‘Playstaion generation’, and that’s a fact whether we like it or not.
So what about the future?
By rights, 2003 should be the year of the Gamecube in the UK, with Zelda, Metroid Prime, Resident Evil Zero, Skies of Arcadia Legends and the prospects of 1080, F-Zero, Mario Kart GC, Mario Golf/Tennis, the big Capcom games and more top quality gaming treats to savour at some time in the future, but what’s the betting that the sales surge we hope for doesn’t appear. Despite the obvious quality on offer, gamers will still be transfixed with the latest FIFA or Tony Hawk’s games, and that’s a real shame.
Nintendo still makes enough profits to stay afloat thanks to the GameBoy and the Pokemon franchise, but in the future…
As the old song goes, “you don’t know what you’ve got ‘till it’s gone”. I hope this isn’t true with Nintendo, for it would be a shame if they disappeared one day only for the disrespectful gamers who hated them to realise how damn good they were and actually end up liking their games, only to find that they’ve gone never to return.
Think about it and give an honest and realistic answer: with the way it’s going, do you see a future for Nintendo in the games industry in ten years time?
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Ahoy.
1: Its seems I have a contender for the 24th.
2: Everyones reply is really really long.
I feel so small compared to these word pimps.
1: Its seems I have a contender for the 24th.
2: Everyones reply is really really long.
I feel so small compared to these word pimps.
Well, to be honest, THQ aren't exactly the biggest daddies around, and although it does show some developers shying away, it probably won't affect the GC too much as THQ haven't been that great to the GC anyway. Sega still offer great support, with Monkey Ball games, Phantasy Star Online, the Sonic franchise etc, so losing the mostly rubbish Sega Sports titles isn't too big a loss (though a Virtua Tennis game would be missed, but Mario tennis GC will probably be better anyway).
Update2.01 wrote:
> Now Sega and THQ are reducing the number of games they have in
> development for GC - doesn't matter what those games are, what matters
> is that people will see this as manufacturers stopping support due to
> poor GC sales.
THQ aren't you retard, they're not happy with sales of their crappy games but they're not dropping Cube output.
> Now Sega and THQ are reducing the number of games they have in
> development for GC - doesn't matter what those games are, what matters
> is that people will see this as manufacturers stopping support due to
> poor GC sales.
THQ aren't you retard, they're not happy with sales of their crappy games but they're not dropping Cube output.
Now Sega and THQ are reducing the number of games they have in development for GC - doesn't matter what those games are, what matters is that people will see this as manufacturers stopping support due to poor GC sales.
A good post, Totoro, but have you really thought it all through as much as you could have?
You talk about established franchises dominating the charts, but - as Pasta has suggested - Nintendo have plenty of established franchises of their own, all of which have a far longer history than any of those on rival platforms. I would also suggest to you that the major franchises like FIFA, Sim City and Tony Hawks require infinitely more skill than any platform game, whether it be Mario Sunshine or Ratchet & Clank! I've only recently taken any real shine to platfomers, but I find them ridiculously easy when compared to other genres.
With the subject of established franchises comes the subject of originality, and you surely can't hold up Nintendo as some kind of beacon when they've essentially released the same games with slight tweaks and different names for the last 12 years or so. Diddy Kong Racing/Mario Kart, any 3D Mario platformer and so on. That's not to say they haven't been great games, but it's no different to FIFA, Tony Hawks, Tomb Raider or any other series of games - the same game/character, in a different environment, with improved and/or tweaked controls.
There's also the issue of gamers generally being older now, and again I concur with Pasta - it seems that many of the gamers who grew up on Mario etc. are now tired of playing what are essentially the same old games with a new gloss on them.
Nintendo are moving away from the kiddy image of old with some very adult-themed games, but maybe they're not moving quickly enough. Sony stormed in with a machine squarely aimed at people aged 18 and older, and look at what happened. The reaction to the original PS1 should have been fair warning to Nintendo that gamers attitudes were changing, but they've been slow to react. Now Microsoft have arrived with a very similar attitude to Sony, and they're benefiting from it too.
I think what we are seeing is that Nintendo have failed to grow up with their customers, and are now paying the price as those customers move on to systems which provide not only completely different games and challenges, but larger numbers of them.
For each 'adult themed' title on Gamecube, there are probably three or more of equal quality on the other platforms; and still Nintendo's machine is dominated by titles aimed predominantly at a younger audience.
I'm not saying that these games aren't fun, just that they're not enough on their own to tempt people into buying the machine. And those titles that are aimed at an older audience are mostly available in equal or better quality on the rival systems.
And while I'm no Nintendo historian, the treatment of European gamers seems to be a major factor with many people. People comment on the number of posts about PS2's supposed reliability problems, but in the time I've been here, there have been more complaints on these forums about Nintendo's lack of respect for European gamers.
> Despite what some people would have you believe, the modern games
> industry is all about one thing: money.
The games industry has only ever been about money - it's just that in modern times, the amounts are more substantial.
> By rights, 2003 should be the year of the Gamecube in the UK, with
> Zelda, Metroid Prime, Resident Evil Zero, Skies of Arcadia Legends and
> the prospects of 1080, F-Zero, Mario Kart GC, Mario Golf/Tennis
Another Zelda
An FPS with strategy elements (Deus Ex?)
Another Resi (even though I love them)
A remake/update of Skies of Arcadia (comprising - quoting Gamespot - "a remake of Dreamcast source material" and "a relative dearth of new content")
A snowboarding game
A Wipeout clone
Mario Kart (again... but with '64' replaced by 'GC')
A cartoon golf/tennis game starring Mario.
I'm making no comment as to the quality of any of these titles, but how can you have the cheek to hold these up as beacons of originality that only 'hardcore' gamers appreciate, while 'casual' gamers enjoy another FIFA/Tomb Raider/Tony Hawks?
Please explain to me why Nintendo are any more entitled to succeed with this line-up than either Sony or Microsoft.
I like the Gamecube, but it has now become the least used of my consoles, with no worthwhile games released (for me personally) since Eternal Darkness.
You talk about established franchises dominating the charts, but - as Pasta has suggested - Nintendo have plenty of established franchises of their own, all of which have a far longer history than any of those on rival platforms. I would also suggest to you that the major franchises like FIFA, Sim City and Tony Hawks require infinitely more skill than any platform game, whether it be Mario Sunshine or Ratchet & Clank! I've only recently taken any real shine to platfomers, but I find them ridiculously easy when compared to other genres.
With the subject of established franchises comes the subject of originality, and you surely can't hold up Nintendo as some kind of beacon when they've essentially released the same games with slight tweaks and different names for the last 12 years or so. Diddy Kong Racing/Mario Kart, any 3D Mario platformer and so on. That's not to say they haven't been great games, but it's no different to FIFA, Tony Hawks, Tomb Raider or any other series of games - the same game/character, in a different environment, with improved and/or tweaked controls.
There's also the issue of gamers generally being older now, and again I concur with Pasta - it seems that many of the gamers who grew up on Mario etc. are now tired of playing what are essentially the same old games with a new gloss on them.
Nintendo are moving away from the kiddy image of old with some very adult-themed games, but maybe they're not moving quickly enough. Sony stormed in with a machine squarely aimed at people aged 18 and older, and look at what happened. The reaction to the original PS1 should have been fair warning to Nintendo that gamers attitudes were changing, but they've been slow to react. Now Microsoft have arrived with a very similar attitude to Sony, and they're benefiting from it too.
I think what we are seeing is that Nintendo have failed to grow up with their customers, and are now paying the price as those customers move on to systems which provide not only completely different games and challenges, but larger numbers of them.
For each 'adult themed' title on Gamecube, there are probably three or more of equal quality on the other platforms; and still Nintendo's machine is dominated by titles aimed predominantly at a younger audience.
I'm not saying that these games aren't fun, just that they're not enough on their own to tempt people into buying the machine. And those titles that are aimed at an older audience are mostly available in equal or better quality on the rival systems.
And while I'm no Nintendo historian, the treatment of European gamers seems to be a major factor with many people. People comment on the number of posts about PS2's supposed reliability problems, but in the time I've been here, there have been more complaints on these forums about Nintendo's lack of respect for European gamers.
> Despite what some people would have you believe, the modern games
> industry is all about one thing: money.
The games industry has only ever been about money - it's just that in modern times, the amounts are more substantial.
> By rights, 2003 should be the year of the Gamecube in the UK, with
> Zelda, Metroid Prime, Resident Evil Zero, Skies of Arcadia Legends and
> the prospects of 1080, F-Zero, Mario Kart GC, Mario Golf/Tennis
Another Zelda
An FPS with strategy elements (Deus Ex?)
Another Resi (even though I love them)
A remake/update of Skies of Arcadia (comprising - quoting Gamespot - "a remake of Dreamcast source material" and "a relative dearth of new content")
A snowboarding game
A Wipeout clone
Mario Kart (again... but with '64' replaced by 'GC')
A cartoon golf/tennis game starring Mario.
I'm making no comment as to the quality of any of these titles, but how can you have the cheek to hold these up as beacons of originality that only 'hardcore' gamers appreciate, while 'casual' gamers enjoy another FIFA/Tomb Raider/Tony Hawks?
Please explain to me why Nintendo are any more entitled to succeed with this line-up than either Sony or Microsoft.
I like the Gamecube, but it has now become the least used of my consoles, with no worthwhile games released (for me personally) since Eternal Darkness.
There's so much fanboyism in this place, I can feel it.
In my opinion Nintendo do deserve a place in todays industry, if not just for the fact that they were the main backbone for the industry in the first place. Their games are maturing, but even when they reeked of the so-called "childish" games, most of them ended up being better than the overload of realistic violent ones.
With so many changes to their latter development, the Cube, Nintendo have proven that they are indeed worthy participants to modern gaming.
In my opinion Nintendo do deserve a place in todays industry, if not just for the fact that they were the main backbone for the industry in the first place. Their games are maturing, but even when they reeked of the so-called "childish" games, most of them ended up being better than the overload of realistic violent ones.
With so many changes to their latter development, the Cube, Nintendo have proven that they are indeed worthy participants to modern gaming.
But Nintendo also cash in on there own Franchises...
And thats why I bought a PS2 (then swapped it for an xbox cause it was breaking down).
Im of the Nintendo Generation, I've owned a NEs, SNES, GB, GBP, N64 and GBA
But I refuse to buy a gamecube.
Yes, There are some original games, Pikimin, Super Monkey Ball etc, which I would buy.
But I wouldn't buy Mario Kart GC, Mario Sunshine or Mario Party 4.
(But maybe I would Zelda)
Why?
Because I've had enough of them, I've played Mario, Zelda and Mario Kart over and over for almost 12 years.
I personally preferred diddy kong racing to Mario Kart 64, why?, It was a bit more original. Thats what I'm like.
Its time for a change for Nintendo - Bring out some new ideas with Mario,
Mario's Pro Plumber etc.
The thing is, the gameplay, although great (Nintendo's the best for this) is beginning to get boring. I need some new challenges, and Nintendo don't seem to have a lot of new ones coming out.
My Xbox collection reads as follows
FIFA 2003
Splinter Cell
Amped
Oddworld: Munch's Oddessyee
Jet Set Radio Furniture
THPS4
MK: Deadly Alliance
Dead Or Alive 3
Sega GT2002
Halo
Medal Of Honour Frontline.
Yes, many of these games can be bought on GC, But for the exclusives I love them, they are 'fresh' if you know what I mean.
No doubt that in 10 years time, i'll be moaning the same, when Halo 7 comes out. Another Generation of Consoles, and i'll give Nintendo Another shot.
And thats why I bought a PS2 (then swapped it for an xbox cause it was breaking down).
Im of the Nintendo Generation, I've owned a NEs, SNES, GB, GBP, N64 and GBA
But I refuse to buy a gamecube.
Yes, There are some original games, Pikimin, Super Monkey Ball etc, which I would buy.
But I wouldn't buy Mario Kart GC, Mario Sunshine or Mario Party 4.
(But maybe I would Zelda)
Why?
Because I've had enough of them, I've played Mario, Zelda and Mario Kart over and over for almost 12 years.
I personally preferred diddy kong racing to Mario Kart 64, why?, It was a bit more original. Thats what I'm like.
Its time for a change for Nintendo - Bring out some new ideas with Mario,
Mario's Pro Plumber etc.
The thing is, the gameplay, although great (Nintendo's the best for this) is beginning to get boring. I need some new challenges, and Nintendo don't seem to have a lot of new ones coming out.
My Xbox collection reads as follows
FIFA 2003
Splinter Cell
Amped
Oddworld: Munch's Oddessyee
Jet Set Radio Furniture
THPS4
MK: Deadly Alliance
Dead Or Alive 3
Sega GT2002
Halo
Medal Of Honour Frontline.
Yes, many of these games can be bought on GC, But for the exclusives I love them, they are 'fresh' if you know what I mean.
No doubt that in 10 years time, i'll be moaning the same, when Halo 7 comes out. Another Generation of Consoles, and i'll give Nintendo Another shot.
Well as for Nintendo of old (their early consoles, etc), yes they did help create the games industry - no question.
As for Nintendo of today, things are not so good. As has already been said, GC is slipping into 3rd position. Why is this? Well it's not just about the lack of a DVD-ROM drive, although that plays a part. But the might of Microsoft should not be underestimated, and Sony have been the market leader for some years now. Perhaps the slightly more narrow range of game types also plays a part (less choice?). On the other hand, the GBA is doing great - and the GBA-SP looks very nice, plus while there are a lot of "familiar" titles being made, there are still some "exclusives" which stand out.
So right now, I think Nintendo is a mixed bag. I don't think GC is going to overtake XBox to become No.2, let alone rival PS2 in the numbers game, but it will continue along the lines it is already on. I do think there will be enough "new" stuff and enough "multi-platform" titles to keep Nintendo fans happy for the most part - but beyond that, I can't see much changing. Wait for GC2 or whatever they call it to see which way Nintendo turns. I wouldn't like to guess yet if the mighty N becomes a software only developer or developer + GBA only company. All depends on how well or how bad they do with the GameCube in the next few years.
As for Nintendo of today, things are not so good. As has already been said, GC is slipping into 3rd position. Why is this? Well it's not just about the lack of a DVD-ROM drive, although that plays a part. But the might of Microsoft should not be underestimated, and Sony have been the market leader for some years now. Perhaps the slightly more narrow range of game types also plays a part (less choice?). On the other hand, the GBA is doing great - and the GBA-SP looks very nice, plus while there are a lot of "familiar" titles being made, there are still some "exclusives" which stand out.
So right now, I think Nintendo is a mixed bag. I don't think GC is going to overtake XBox to become No.2, let alone rival PS2 in the numbers game, but it will continue along the lines it is already on. I do think there will be enough "new" stuff and enough "multi-platform" titles to keep Nintendo fans happy for the most part - but beyond that, I can't see much changing. Wait for GC2 or whatever they call it to see which way Nintendo turns. I wouldn't like to guess yet if the mighty N becomes a software only developer or developer + GBA only company. All depends on how well or how bad they do with the GameCube in the next few years.
Could there be a time when we'll see Nintendo turned games producer only, like Sega? I doubt it. They still have a massive seller in the Gameboy and they're well respected in their homeland. However, they seem to ignore the European community whereas Sony has developed a much better attitude to western gamers. Which irritates the hell out of me. However, are people getting disheartened by Nintendo? I'm not. Other people might, but as long as they keep on releasing great, innovative games, I'll keep buying them.
Parr wrote:
> Yes, Nintendo deserve a place.
Yes, we all know that they deserve a place more than anyone, but sales figures are lowering and other consoles are becoming more and more dominant.
March should be good in terms of sales, but will it be? Metroid proved a success in the US in terms of shifting more Gamecube units, but in the UK it just seems that the Gamecube is being left behind, will Metroid prove successful with the average gamer?
> Yes, Nintendo deserve a place.
Yes, we all know that they deserve a place more than anyone, but sales figures are lowering and other consoles are becoming more and more dominant.
March should be good in terms of sales, but will it be? Metroid proved a success in the US in terms of shifting more Gamecube units, but in the UK it just seems that the Gamecube is being left behind, will Metroid prove successful with the average gamer?
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