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First off let me say I don't know a whole lot about this, just what I've haerd, but with plenty of us here either in, or wanting to go to, University, it seems suitable to start a topic.
I'm in my second year, on a Human Geography (BA) course at Nottingham Trent University, I live at home, get just over £3000 in repayable student loans, and my parents pay about £300 towards the tuition fees each year.
From my point of view, the change to a grant in 2004 is actually good, it's less for me to pay back when I finish, so no complaints on that front. However the grant, from what I've seen, is just £1100. Let's compare that to my current £3000 odd, bit of a shortfall eh ? Maybe it is £1100 a term, in that case you are looking at £3300, which is more like it. Living at home, running a car and travelling in means that my current loan works well. I've packed in work, sell some stuff on Ebay now and then, and I have money enough for what I want, including stuff like Broadband sub fees e.t.c. Anyone who is trying ot live away from home on the £3300 is going to need a job, at the very least. Whatever anyone says, having a job and being at university isn't always easy to do no matter how you balance time.
The proposed change to raise tuition fees for 2006 won't affect me, but it is bad. Realistically, when the University can set fees between £1000 and £3000 odd, which will it go for ? Certainly not £1000.... Make no mistake, this move will cut the numbers entering Universities IF the current government can make it that long.....
Blair accused Duncan Smith of opposing fairer access to universities today in parliament. Exsqueeze me ? Raising the fees, even with increased financial aid, still means all but the absolute poorest students will have to find a lot of money, on top of the shortfall between the grant/loans and how much it costs a year. Those whose families can afford it will be forced to pay even more.
This is a prime example of the sheer stupidity of the system in this country on nearly everything. If you earn little, you get some aid that nearly always is not truly sufficient, if you earn more then not only will taxes claw it from you, but you'll have to pay more towards everything else as well.
Yes, education is an investment, but realistically new under graduates that enter the system from 2006 will leave with massive debt, worse than now, along side the fact that everythign else in society will have increased in price. I mean come on, people go to university to get qualifications that will let the start a career, and now they'll be paying back loans until they're about 50, and the more they earn the more they will have to pay back, hence having les money as well !
Sheer stupidity, and about what I've come to expect in this country.
~~Belldandy~~
I'm in my second year, on a Human Geography (BA) course at Nottingham Trent University, I live at home, get just over £3000 in repayable student loans, and my parents pay about £300 towards the tuition fees each year.
From my point of view, the change to a grant in 2004 is actually good, it's less for me to pay back when I finish, so no complaints on that front. However the grant, from what I've seen, is just £1100. Let's compare that to my current £3000 odd, bit of a shortfall eh ? Maybe it is £1100 a term, in that case you are looking at £3300, which is more like it. Living at home, running a car and travelling in means that my current loan works well. I've packed in work, sell some stuff on Ebay now and then, and I have money enough for what I want, including stuff like Broadband sub fees e.t.c. Anyone who is trying ot live away from home on the £3300 is going to need a job, at the very least. Whatever anyone says, having a job and being at university isn't always easy to do no matter how you balance time.
The proposed change to raise tuition fees for 2006 won't affect me, but it is bad. Realistically, when the University can set fees between £1000 and £3000 odd, which will it go for ? Certainly not £1000.... Make no mistake, this move will cut the numbers entering Universities IF the current government can make it that long.....
Blair accused Duncan Smith of opposing fairer access to universities today in parliament. Exsqueeze me ? Raising the fees, even with increased financial aid, still means all but the absolute poorest students will have to find a lot of money, on top of the shortfall between the grant/loans and how much it costs a year. Those whose families can afford it will be forced to pay even more.
This is a prime example of the sheer stupidity of the system in this country on nearly everything. If you earn little, you get some aid that nearly always is not truly sufficient, if you earn more then not only will taxes claw it from you, but you'll have to pay more towards everything else as well.
Yes, education is an investment, but realistically new under graduates that enter the system from 2006 will leave with massive debt, worse than now, along side the fact that everythign else in society will have increased in price. I mean come on, people go to university to get qualifications that will let the start a career, and now they'll be paying back loans until they're about 50, and the more they earn the more they will have to pay back, hence having les money as well !
Sheer stupidity, and about what I've come to expect in this country.
~~Belldandy~~
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Rich people will have no problem just the fact most people in the Uk are middle class!
It's really the middle class that get shafted in most things
RM18 wrote:
> Figures of £21000 being quoted in the press is just media
> scaremongering - use your money wisely, and whilst debt is inevitable,
> it won't be as crippling as some would have you believe.
The figures of this amont are for those entering in 2006, not those now, and they represent an extreme. Even so, in your case you're paying 1100 fees, this is with the tuition fees capped at 1000ish. Under the proposed changes Universities can raise it up to about 3000ish, but the grant available will only cover the absolute poorest as IB has said, the rest will be on loans, which won't be upped to compensate for higher tuition fees, so if you were to go in 2006 it is quite likely nearly all your money would have gone on tuition fees alone.
The central point is the argument that this change further opens up the system, when everyone outside of the cabinet can see it doesn't.
Still, in typical British style, it won't be my problem because I finish in 2004 :P
~~Belldandy~~
> Figures of £21000 being quoted in the press is just media
> scaremongering - use your money wisely, and whilst debt is inevitable,
> it won't be as crippling as some would have you believe.
The figures of this amont are for those entering in 2006, not those now, and they represent an extreme. Even so, in your case you're paying 1100 fees, this is with the tuition fees capped at 1000ish. Under the proposed changes Universities can raise it up to about 3000ish, but the grant available will only cover the absolute poorest as IB has said, the rest will be on loans, which won't be upped to compensate for higher tuition fees, so if you were to go in 2006 it is quite likely nearly all your money would have gone on tuition fees alone.
The central point is the argument that this change further opens up the system, when everyone outside of the cabinet can see it doesn't.
Still, in typical British style, it won't be my problem because I finish in 2004 :P
~~Belldandy~~
Or those with really rich parents whose accountants can demonstrate that even though the family owns four houses, a merc, a jag and a roller, their annual income is less than 50p.
I heard that the "grants" will only be available to those whose household income is below £10,000.
ie - the extremely poor.
ie - the extremely poor.
Easy way around fees, no matter what they are, is to do a course with the Open University. If you're not working, you can do a full degree for free, the only difference is it may take 5 or 6 years to complete instead of the usual 3 or 4, but you can cram more units into each year if you think the material is simple enough for you to handle.
The only difference between long distance learning and going to Uni is you miss out on the social side and group learning, but that's about it. I did my BSc Maths with OU over 4 years, (still got two more years to go the way I planned it to get the Hons degree, but got the BSc) and so far it's cost me a grand total of £350 because I was working for 2 of those years.
Distance learning suits me down to the ground because I've always preferred working on my own, I don't get held back by others who are slower than me, I don't get put off by other people being better than me, and I'm not getting dragged out on pub crawls every other night.
And you can pay by installments.
And you can work at your own pace.
And it's practically impossible to fail a course unless you have trouble reading/watching videos/running multimedia on your PC.
I can't recommend it enough, but then it's not for everyone.
The only difference between long distance learning and going to Uni is you miss out on the social side and group learning, but that's about it. I did my BSc Maths with OU over 4 years, (still got two more years to go the way I planned it to get the Hons degree, but got the BSc) and so far it's cost me a grand total of £350 because I was working for 2 of those years.
Distance learning suits me down to the ground because I've always preferred working on my own, I don't get held back by others who are slower than me, I don't get put off by other people being better than me, and I'm not getting dragged out on pub crawls every other night.
And you can pay by installments.
And you can work at your own pace.
And it's practically impossible to fail a course unless you have trouble reading/watching videos/running multimedia on your PC.
I can't recommend it enough, but then it's not for everyone.
I'm not really affected that much. I get a £3000 loan a year, of which £1100 goes on fees. The other money I've deposited in my account and will not touch as that will pay for my fees for the next two years. The only other expenditure is books (which for me is practically negligible, as I only need 3 and the rest of the stuff I need is online/in the library), and train fares, which is substantial, but my parents are paying. :D
Figures of £21000 being quoted in the press is just media scaremongering - use your money wisely, and whilst debt is inevitable, it won't be as crippling as some would have you believe.
Figures of £21000 being quoted in the press is just media scaremongering - use your money wisely, and whilst debt is inevitable, it won't be as crippling as some would have you believe.
Absolu† Neó wrote:
> because you might learn to spell? ;-)
At least i picked a good footie team to support :p
> because you might learn to spell? ;-)
At least i picked a good footie team to support :p
SHEEPY wrote:
> I also feel students in England and Wales are getting unfairly
> bugggered
What SHEEPY is trying to say is that when he gets bugggered, he gets it fairly well done. :P
> I also feel students in England and Wales are getting unfairly
> bugggered
What SHEEPY is trying to say is that when he gets bugggered, he gets it fairly well done. :P
because you might learn to spell? ;-)
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