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In part I outlined the reasons for the demise of the Saturn, as well as Sega trying to stretch the Mega Drive brand... if you'd like to see that topic, go to prime and scroll down!
So now for part 2... now, where was I?
Right, the Saturn has flopped at release due to high pricing, a poor selection of games and mainly competition from the PSX (Sony offered retailers discounts if they sold lots of PSXs etc.)
It was then that Sega entered the dark ages. Emerging briefly to attend arcade conferences, such as JAMMA, little was known about the company for over a year. Until, that is, that rumours about a new console began to emerge. Names such as the "Dural" and "Black Belt" popped up, as dd many confusing stories.
The strangest of these was that the next Sega console would be made by two different companies- one for the East, and one for the West (3Dfx). Indeed, both divisions later admitted they had been in negotiations. Until a few months later, and the project went cold when Sega America rang 3Dfx to cancel all negotiations!
But all was not lost... rumours about a new console- the Katana- emerged. It was to use Hitachi chips, and have a modem as standard. Something was certainly going on, with Sega slowing arcade game production, and a protective wall going up around the company.
And so it became true that Sega nnounced its great White Hope- the Dreamcast. It had the built in modem, online gaming, four player ports, and a whole range of firstparty games to suite.
Now, skipping all the technical specs, let's get to the reason Sega failed.
A few days after the DC's unveiling, Sony suddenly held a press conference showing the successor to the Playstation off to the world. Amazingly, the demo of Tekken showed SEVENTY characters watching a full on back street brawl, and many other similar quality demos. Add to that the demos only took 4 weeks to make (according to the creators), and Sony were litterally saying that the console would have photorealistic graphics. So, developers jumped on board, mags were filled with the PS2 pics, and the DC got a raw deal.
What Sony failed to say was that the demos they showed were running off a series of PCs, and were not coded on a PS2 dev kit... just some very powerful computers. In fact, Sony hadn't even made the final console specs, and was just trying to create hype for its console to drown the DC.
And the hype worked. Developers jumped on the PS2 wagon... despite no console specs or dev kits!
But all was not lost for Sega! They had some stunning games, and a huge Western launch planned (Sega never were big in Japan).
In the West, adverts were aimed at selling the DC brand... and NOT the games. This worked extremely well in the US where huge launch events and parties made the console sell out. The only problem was that many gamers knew the DC was coming on 9.9.99... but didn't know what the DC was!?!?!
In Europe, the campaign went far worse. Wasting the budget on sponsoring Arsenal, SOE had a poor TV campaign, that didn't get any attention!
Saying that, the DC had some great games- Sonic, Soul Calibur and Sega Sports games were hailed as AAA titles immediately.
Now, the problem with DC sales is 2 fold:
1) Poor advertising
2) Sony happened to release PS2 info just as Sega made a big announcement.
The DC was not competing against the PS2- it wa competing against a photorealistic console that didn't exist!
The DC's online functions came too soon for the mass market, and gamers were far more interested when they heard that the PS2 would have DVD playability.
And so developers moved away from the DC to the PS2 as gamers did... but that's not the end of the story!
When PS2 dev kits actually came out there was a huge outcry from the industry. In all honesty, the dev kit was aweful! Well, it wasn't aweful, but it felt that way- the architecture of the PS2 was unlike anything before it, meaning huge development costs and long development times!
The whole reaosn for developers chosing the PSX was that it was so easy to code for, and so well supported. The PS2 was much more expensive, and had very poor libraries. And t showed too...
The first batch of PS2 games was WAY off par with the 70 man Tekken brawler seen a few months earlier. Games were jaggy, unoriginal, and second rate. Ok, there were a few stars, but nothing pushed the console beyond what had come before.
And so, gamers and publishers alike began to realise that, had they stuck to the DC, they could have made games just as good for a far cheaper price.
Ironically, Sega is getting the last laugh... as a third party developer, it is now directly competing with the developers who shunned its Dreamcast. And Sega certainly fail in that market... games have always been their forte.
Sonic
So now for part 2... now, where was I?
Right, the Saturn has flopped at release due to high pricing, a poor selection of games and mainly competition from the PSX (Sony offered retailers discounts if they sold lots of PSXs etc.)
It was then that Sega entered the dark ages. Emerging briefly to attend arcade conferences, such as JAMMA, little was known about the company for over a year. Until, that is, that rumours about a new console began to emerge. Names such as the "Dural" and "Black Belt" popped up, as dd many confusing stories.
The strangest of these was that the next Sega console would be made by two different companies- one for the East, and one for the West (3Dfx). Indeed, both divisions later admitted they had been in negotiations. Until a few months later, and the project went cold when Sega America rang 3Dfx to cancel all negotiations!
But all was not lost... rumours about a new console- the Katana- emerged. It was to use Hitachi chips, and have a modem as standard. Something was certainly going on, with Sega slowing arcade game production, and a protective wall going up around the company.
And so it became true that Sega nnounced its great White Hope- the Dreamcast. It had the built in modem, online gaming, four player ports, and a whole range of firstparty games to suite.
Now, skipping all the technical specs, let's get to the reason Sega failed.
A few days after the DC's unveiling, Sony suddenly held a press conference showing the successor to the Playstation off to the world. Amazingly, the demo of Tekken showed SEVENTY characters watching a full on back street brawl, and many other similar quality demos. Add to that the demos only took 4 weeks to make (according to the creators), and Sony were litterally saying that the console would have photorealistic graphics. So, developers jumped on board, mags were filled with the PS2 pics, and the DC got a raw deal.
What Sony failed to say was that the demos they showed were running off a series of PCs, and were not coded on a PS2 dev kit... just some very powerful computers. In fact, Sony hadn't even made the final console specs, and was just trying to create hype for its console to drown the DC.
And the hype worked. Developers jumped on the PS2 wagon... despite no console specs or dev kits!
But all was not lost for Sega! They had some stunning games, and a huge Western launch planned (Sega never were big in Japan).
In the West, adverts were aimed at selling the DC brand... and NOT the games. This worked extremely well in the US where huge launch events and parties made the console sell out. The only problem was that many gamers knew the DC was coming on 9.9.99... but didn't know what the DC was!?!?!
In Europe, the campaign went far worse. Wasting the budget on sponsoring Arsenal, SOE had a poor TV campaign, that didn't get any attention!
Saying that, the DC had some great games- Sonic, Soul Calibur and Sega Sports games were hailed as AAA titles immediately.
Now, the problem with DC sales is 2 fold:
1) Poor advertising
2) Sony happened to release PS2 info just as Sega made a big announcement.
The DC was not competing against the PS2- it wa competing against a photorealistic console that didn't exist!
The DC's online functions came too soon for the mass market, and gamers were far more interested when they heard that the PS2 would have DVD playability.
And so developers moved away from the DC to the PS2 as gamers did... but that's not the end of the story!
When PS2 dev kits actually came out there was a huge outcry from the industry. In all honesty, the dev kit was aweful! Well, it wasn't aweful, but it felt that way- the architecture of the PS2 was unlike anything before it, meaning huge development costs and long development times!
The whole reaosn for developers chosing the PSX was that it was so easy to code for, and so well supported. The PS2 was much more expensive, and had very poor libraries. And t showed too...
The first batch of PS2 games was WAY off par with the 70 man Tekken brawler seen a few months earlier. Games were jaggy, unoriginal, and second rate. Ok, there were a few stars, but nothing pushed the console beyond what had come before.
And so, gamers and publishers alike began to realise that, had they stuck to the DC, they could have made games just as good for a far cheaper price.
Ironically, Sega is getting the last laugh... as a third party developer, it is now directly competing with the developers who shunned its Dreamcast. And Sega certainly fail in that market... games have always been their forte.
Sonic
Page:
Strafex wrote:
As for Sega dev. teams, Amusement Vision have
> made Monkey Ball and Suzuki (from AM2) has said he like's the Gamecube so an
> announcement is expected sooner or later.
Are you sure about MB... I'm sure that was designed by Yugi Naka (in fact, he writes a column in edge about the games he is making!), and he is head of Sonic Team... so I'm sure it was SonicTeam!
Oh, and AM2 should certainly make something for the GC... after all, they're the biggest of Sega's departments (saying that, they're having a whale of a time with the PS2 right now!)
Anyway, Sonic Team might not
> be the biggest Sega division, but unless you're frightened of cartoony graphics
> and prefer Mr Suzuki's realism, I'd say that Naka's crew are still the best.
I'm a HUGE fan of Naka-san... NiGHTS! being my fave game of all time (MAKE A SEQUAL NAKA-SAN! MAKE A SEQUAL!!!!!). However, Sonic Team doesn't make all that many games. The games they make are good and all, but tend to be heading in the same way as Ninty are going (short and sweet)... I just need some epics!
Sonic
As for Sega dev. teams, Amusement Vision have
> made Monkey Ball and Suzuki (from AM2) has said he like's the Gamecube so an
> announcement is expected sooner or later.
Are you sure about MB... I'm sure that was designed by Yugi Naka (in fact, he writes a column in edge about the games he is making!), and he is head of Sonic Team... so I'm sure it was SonicTeam!
Oh, and AM2 should certainly make something for the GC... after all, they're the biggest of Sega's departments (saying that, they're having a whale of a time with the PS2 right now!)
Anyway, Sonic Team might not
> be the biggest Sega division, but unless you're frightened of cartoony graphics
> and prefer Mr Suzuki's realism, I'd say that Naka's crew are still the best.
I'm a HUGE fan of Naka-san... NiGHTS! being my fave game of all time (MAKE A SEQUAL NAKA-SAN! MAKE A SEQUAL!!!!!). However, Sonic Team doesn't make all that many games. The games they make are good and all, but tend to be heading in the same way as Ninty are going (short and sweet)... I just need some epics!
Sonic
===SONICRAV---> wrote:
Oh, and don't trust digitiser
> to anything!
I trust Digi more than Edge.
Edge, apparently, said that the 3DO was the future of gaming...
Anyway Digitiser seem to read and like Edge, so no need to dispute it too much.
As for Sega dev. teams, Amusement Vision have made Monkey Ball and Suzuki (from AM2) has said he like's the Gamecube so an announcement is expected sooner or later.
Also, Visual Concepts are making Soccer Slam, supposedly some foul football game.
Anyway, Sonic Team might not be the biggest Sega division, but unless you're frightened of cartoony graphics and prefer Mr Suzuki's realism, I'd say that Naka's crew are still the best.
Oh, and don't trust digitiser
> to anything!
I trust Digi more than Edge.
Edge, apparently, said that the 3DO was the future of gaming...
Anyway Digitiser seem to read and like Edge, so no need to dispute it too much.
As for Sega dev. teams, Amusement Vision have made Monkey Ball and Suzuki (from AM2) has said he like's the Gamecube so an announcement is expected sooner or later.
Also, Visual Concepts are making Soccer Slam, supposedly some foul football game.
Anyway, Sonic Team might not be the biggest Sega division, but unless you're frightened of cartoony graphics and prefer Mr Suzuki's realism, I'd say that Naka's crew are still the best.
The Game wrote:
> Wookiee... It's good to 'see' you...
And you... though I've hardly been away for a long time! :-)
> How's things?
Fine thanks... looking forward to the Xmas hols, though I have to work Xmas Eve. :-(
> Still use he same hotmail address?
[email protected] - the babylonian one doesn't exist any more!
> Wookiee... It's good to 'see' you...
And you... though I've hardly been away for a long time! :-)
> How's things?
Fine thanks... looking forward to the Xmas hols, though I have to work Xmas Eve. :-(
> Still use he same hotmail address?
[email protected] - the babylonian one doesn't exist any more!
Yer... actually, I had to amend PART 1 of this topic when I re-read about sega wanting to continue the ife of the Megadrive in the face of the 32 bit age!
Great mag that.
Sonic
Great mag that.
Sonic
Wookiee... It's good to 'see' you...
How's things?
Still use he same hotmail address?
wookieemonster or babylonian5?
Game
How's things?
Still use he same hotmail address?
wookieemonster or babylonian5?
Game
Good article about Sega's mis-handling of Saturn and Dreamcast in Edge issue 105.
BTW, what other Sega departments are developing for the GC... after all, Sonic Team aren't one of the biggest divisions...
Sonic
Sonic
Strafex wrote:
> Sonic Team was the only one I heard about.
Are you sure they all broke away
> at the same time?
Digitiser seemed to be making a fairly big thing out of just
> the Sonic Team and didn't mention anything else at the time.
Didn't the rest
> only start develloping for other consoles after that DC death announcement in
> March?
Nope! It was all announced at exactly the same time, at the same press conference...
They had the head of each division there, and took a picture of all of them together- I really wanna get a framed copy of that picture!
Oh, and don't trust digitiser to anything!
Sonic
> Sonic Team was the only one I heard about.
Are you sure they all broke away
> at the same time?
Digitiser seemed to be making a fairly big thing out of just
> the Sonic Team and didn't mention anything else at the time.
Didn't the rest
> only start develloping for other consoles after that DC death announcement in
> March?
Nope! It was all announced at exactly the same time, at the same press conference...
They had the head of each division there, and took a picture of all of them together- I really wanna get a framed copy of that picture!
Oh, and don't trust digitiser to anything!
Sonic
Sonic Team was the only one I heard about.
Are you sure they all broke away at the same time?
Digitiser seemed to be making a fairly big thing out of just the Sonic Team and didn't mention anything else at the time.
Didn't the rest only start develloping for other consoles after that DC death announcement in March?
Are you sure they all broke away at the same time?
Digitiser seemed to be making a fairly big thing out of just the Sonic Team and didn't mention anything else at the time.
Didn't the rest only start develloping for other consoles after that DC death announcement in March?
Strafex wrote:
> Sonic Team broke away from Sega a few months before Sega announced giving up
> hardware......
You seem to have missed the whole point! EVERY Sega department became independant at the same time!!! They DID NOT "break away"... Sega owned them after all! What atually happened is that Sega knew that the DC was failing. The only way for the company to survive was to go third party.
So, SEGA made all its 10 divisions independant- they're all still owned by Sega 100%, but can chose what games to make on what platforms.
Hence some of the divisions (like Sonic Team) are working on the GC saying it has te best architecture blaf blah blah.
Other divisions (like Smilebit) are working on the Xbox (jet set future), saying it has the most power, blah blah blah.
The larger divisions (like AM2) are working on many formats (shenmue and virtual fighter for example), because they have so many resources they can! (AM2 is bigger than most developers!).
So I don't know why everyone is saying that Sonic Team going to the GC is such a big thing! After all, the other nine Sega divisions are doing different stuff!
Sonic
> Sonic Team broke away from Sega a few months before Sega announced giving up
> hardware......
You seem to have missed the whole point! EVERY Sega department became independant at the same time!!! They DID NOT "break away"... Sega owned them after all! What atually happened is that Sega knew that the DC was failing. The only way for the company to survive was to go third party.
So, SEGA made all its 10 divisions independant- they're all still owned by Sega 100%, but can chose what games to make on what platforms.
Hence some of the divisions (like Sonic Team) are working on the GC saying it has te best architecture blaf blah blah.
Other divisions (like Smilebit) are working on the Xbox (jet set future), saying it has the most power, blah blah blah.
The larger divisions (like AM2) are working on many formats (shenmue and virtual fighter for example), because they have so many resources they can! (AM2 is bigger than most developers!).
So I don't know why everyone is saying that Sonic Team going to the GC is such a big thing! After all, the other nine Sega divisions are doing different stuff!
Sonic
Page: